Kyrie Trade Discussion Continued

[BasketballFan7]

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Vegas know something we don't?

Yea, that there are a lot of Knick's fans in Vegas who have cash to burn.

What's to stop Irving from having all his friends place a bet on the team he is going to before it is public knowledge?

Place a 20mil bet on the Bucks or Hawks once he knows it's done through a "friend."

Celtics are higher on the odds list than I would expect.

The book has to accept the bet I believe.

[Bobalob]

Kyrie, Shump, and Frye to Denver for Faried, Chandler, Murray, and Garry Harris...and Jameer Nelson

Seem like a lot? If you're Denver what you gonna do just be 'deep' forever? If you're Cleveland maybe depth is the best weapon vs GS rather than goin head on.

Denver: Kyrie, Barton, Shump, Milsap, Jokic...bench still young w/ Mudiay, Lyles, Hernangomez, Beasley
Cleveland:

Nelson/Rose...Murray when he ready
JR/Korver...Harris when he ready
Bron/Chandler
Love/Faried
Thompson

[Drax]

Celtics are higher on the odds list than I would expect.

The book has to accept the bet I believe.

Best part about this though is, in the end everyone has a common figure they can hate against. Daniel R. Ainge is his name, he blew it again ... What a joke of a GM.

[turk3d]

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Vegas know something we don't?

Doesn't even include Memphis in the list.

[MGB8]

With Rose on board, it should be Irving for Fultz and Okafor.

[CelticsLV]

There's no reason for other teams to offer much for Irving. The fact he requested a trade and listed preferences will scare away a lot of suitors. This is a clear signal Iriving could leave potential suitors like Suns in 2 years. An automatic red flag that needs to be taken into account when you make an offer. If the situation is as terrible as some paint it then return could be underwhelming. I think Kevin Love was the last all-star who was traded for big return and even then it was all-in type move by Cavs because LeBron was coming back. People thought returns for Boogie, Butler, George were underwhelming and i expect same with Irving.

[SAKURABA216]

I would love for him to join the Bucks so they can roll out a lineup of Kyrie, Middleton, Giannis, Jabari, and Thon. I know it would never happen, but that team would be special for a very long time.

[Bobalob]

There's no reason for other teams to offer much for Irving. The fact he requested a trade and listed preferences will scare away a lot of suitors. This is a clear signal Iriving could leave potential suitors like Suns in 2 years. An automatic red flag that needs to be taken into account when you make an offer. If the situation is so terrible as some paint it then return could be underwhelming.

It'll scare off some but 2 years is a lot of time and there's a lot of teams in the league lol All it takes is 2 or 3 to drive up the price and they'll damn sure have that

Ie if you're denver, utah, milwaukee, Sacramento, etc, you aint never signing a marquee elite free agent (Paul Milsap is not one) so you might as well take a shot and trade for one now.

Hell if you're the Kings the guy could literally save you from losing your franchise by bringing in fans

[Profound23]

I would love for him to join the Bucks so they can roll out a lineup of Kyrie, Middleton, Giannis, Jabari, and Thon. I know it would never happen, but that team would be special for a very long time.

Yeah, I would too.....but the Bucks have to trade at least one of the players you listed to get Irving.

Probably looks more like Irving, Snell, Jabari, Giannis, Thon

[jbk1234]

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Vegas know something we don't?

Doubt it.

[phraoh]

Anyone who thinks they won't get a good, maybe great return is being naive, or maybe its just the Celtic fans afraid Cavs will be better this year than last year with more balance on their team.

[JHFVF07]

Would like to see him in Utah. Something like Favors+Exum+Fillers. He could share the backourt with Rubio, and have Gobert to erase his defensives lapses.

[CelticsLV]

There's no reason for other teams to offer much for Irving. The fact he requested a trade and listed preferences will scare away a lot of suitors. This is a clear signal Iriving could leave potential suitors like Suns in 2 years. An automatic red flag that needs to be taken into account when you make an offer. If the situation is so terrible as some paint it then return could be underwhelming.

It'll scare off some but 2 years is a lot of time and there's a lot of teams in the league lol All it takes is 2 or 3 to drive up the price and they'll damn sure have that

Ie if you're denver, utah, milwaukee, Sacramento, etc, you aint never signing a marquee elite free agent (Paul Milsap is not one) so you might as well take a shot and trade for one now.

Hell if you're the Kings the guy could literally save you from losing your franchise by bringing in fans

Boogie, Butler and George sure did bring a lot of bidders. So many that none of those players got a return majority was expecting. Majority considered them as underwhelming returns.
I think some of you should wake up and understand that there's no such thing as bidding in NBA trade market. It's not a damn auction through telephone. No team is interested in bidding wars and nobody really shares their offers. Team like Cavs could lie about offers/interest they receive to drive up price. You really think it's as easy as GM x calls GM y and asks: "Hey, what did you offer for Kyrie?". Then GM y tells what exactly he offered and GM x proceeds to try and outbid the other GM. First of all, GM x is not even interested in sharing such information.

[jbk1234]

Read on Twitter

Vegas know something we don't?

Doubt it.

The more I think about it, I'd definitely place $1,000 on Kyrie not coming back to Cleveland. I'd place another $1,000 on Kyrie getting traded to the Suns. If he goes anywhere but the PHX, it's a wash. If he ends up with the Suns, you make some good money.

[europeanfan]

Cuban is a known star-lover. How about Kyrie and Shump for Dennis Smith and Harrison Barnes

Actually a credible trade idea. Even feel like Barnes is an overpay.

It was said Cavs want blue chip young talent. Not of lot of team willing to part with those guys but Cuban might be one of them.

Also the Heat with Winslow Adebayo, not sure they even qualify as blue chippers but if you package them with Dragic if a good offer to both win now and retain value long term.

[G35]

This is the thinking of you and I and any logical competitive person, but Gilbert is not logical lmao Thats why this whole situation is strange.

Kyrie and Gilbert seem to be on some 'well we aint winning anyway so let me set myself up for life after he leave'

And i cant 100% blame Gilbert (i do blame Kyrie bc he's a baller, he shouldn't think like that)

Let me give a tangible example, say it came down to two offers: One offer is Fultz and Saric, the other is Bledsoe and Melo. Clearly Bledsoe and Melo give you a better chance to win now...

If im Gilbert, im taking Fultz and Saric!

I get trying to keep the quality of the roster up as much as possible when LeBron leaves, but doing that makes it for sure that LeBron will leave and the fan base will blame the FO not LeBron for that and there will be a lot of backlash.

This is a big part of what you get with LeBron, you have to cator to him or he leaves, Gilbert had to know that and has went deep into the luxury tax to do what LeBron wants. I'm not quite sure he's ready to just hit eject with LeBron yet. Also, there is no upside for LeBron to let Gilbert know he's leaving, he has to keep stringing him along to keep Gilbert putting out the best team he can around LeBron. LeBron is high maintenance but he's good enough to be that way(not that I like players having that much power).

I don't know if anyone has discussed this but I don't know if the next team that signs Lebron has to cater to him....I would call his bluff. What do we know about Lebron's situation:

- He will be 33 in December and I don't see Lebron getting better, he is slowing down from what I see. He's going to have to cut back on his minutes, which cuts down on his all-around/swiss army knife value, if he wants to preserve his career. He isn't going to be playing 36-38 minutes and he already takes several games off every year. This is his games played in the last six years:

2012 - 62 games
2013 - 76
2014 - 77
2015 - 69
2016 - 76
2017 - 74

You can put down right now before the season even starts that he is going to miss 8-10 games. Who knows how the season will actually go because it could be more.

- He appears to be burning bridges in CLE. Is he friends with Gilbert? Are they going to make up now and say it was all a big joke and we really love each other? I think he is done in CLE so that means he loses that leverage vs other teams and definitely goes into FA now being able to "go home"

- Are teams going to give him a max two year or three year deal? Or will they leverage him into taking a four year deal thus locking him into future plans. Remember Lebron is not your typical FA where he is going where the money is, he wants to win, so the pool of teams he will sign with is relatively small. Which of these teams is going to "cater" to Lebron and be able to compete for titles? I'm going to put in all the possible contending teams and those who might acquire other players and become conteders:

Spurs
Miami
Boston
Golden State
Portland
Minnesota
Houston
Lakers
Clippers
Oklahoma
Denver

I think this is most teams that have even a remote chance of competing for titles. Now which ones will have to cater to Lebron and give him the control he is use to?

Not a chance in hell Lebron gets the control teams:
Lakers Magic is not giving Lebron control
Spurs Pop/Buford is not giving Lebron control
Boston Ainge is not giving up control
Miami Lol not the way the last marriage ended
Golden State they like things just the way they are

Maybe he might get some control teams:
Houston Doubtful Morey gives up control
Clippers Doc likes control even though he is a players coach...depends on Ballmer

He probably could get the control he desires teams:
Minnesota they would do it
Oklahoma they would probably also do it but Lebron and WB on the same team....
Denver they would do it
Portland they would also do it


I think teams are going to realize that if Lebron tries to wait until the last minute to announce his intentions and teams load up elsewhere, Lebron will not have as many choices for his preferred destination and he will have to make some compromises. He was 25 and 29 when he made his FA decisions, at 32 and will be 33 at the time of his free agency, I would not empty the bank for him nor capitulate any power......

[guille_4]

IMO if they want a young blue-chip prospect and considering he's asked to be traded and the return for George, Butler and Cousins, this trade could make sense in January:

Kyrie Irving and Iman Shumpert for Jeff Teague and Andrew Wiggins + OKC 1st.

Kyrie Irving
Iman Shumpert
Jimmy Butler
Taj Gibson
KAT

I like that team. Plenty of shot-creation with Kyrie, Butler and KAT, and two solid role players who provide above average defense in Taj and Shumpert.

On the other hand:

Jeff Teague
Andrew Wiggins
Lebron James
Kevin Love
Tristan Thompson

Is stil the best team in the East and if Lebron leaves, you stay competitive for another year and then have another 5 years of Andrew Wiggins to rebuild.

[jbk1234]

IMO if they want a young blue-chip prospect and considering he's asked to be traded and the return for George, Butler and Cousins, this trade could make sense in January:

Kyrie Irving and Iman Shumpert for Jeff Teague and Andrew Wiggins + OKC 1st.

Kyrie Irving
Iman Shumpert
Jimmy Butler
Taj Gibson
KAT

I like that team. Plenty of shot-creation with Kyrie, Butler and KAT, and two solid role players who provide above average defense in Taj and Shumpert.

On the other hand:

Jeff Teague
Andrew Wiggins
Lebron James
Kevin Love
Tristan Thompson

Is stil the best team in the East and if Lebron leaves, you stay competitive for another year and then have another 5 years of Andrew Wiggins to rebuild.

Kyrie isn't going to be on the Cavs roster come January. If the Wolves want to wait until Teague can be traded, they'll watch him get traded elsewhere.

[cavs4life03]

Why are so many "Cavs" fans **** on Kyrie right now? Anybody with common sense can see LeBron brings with him a soap opera of problems. LeBron is passive aggressive and he's a hypocrite. He'll crap all over his teammates for not trying hard, but willing to take a seat on the bench in the middle of the game just cuz.

Kyrie simply doesn't want his career to be orchestrated by LeBron, and he's willing to forgo a sure chance of reaching the playoffs and even the finals to pursue his dream his own way. Call it an ego trip or whatever, but it's at least refreshing that some guys won't gargle LeBron's nutsack.

Kyrie was willing to lead a young, rebuilding team and recruit stars to play with him. Then in 11 days it changed to whatever LeBron wants he gets. It's unfortunate that LeBron just wants old washed up shooters who play no defense and threw out every young prospect and draft pick to do so. This team was a joke in the finals despite having a great offense all year, and it only gets worse with age.

Anyways, Cavs fans should be happy Kyrie is leaving because if LeBron is as narcissistic as we all think, he'll stay in Cleveland to counter all the chatter of him to LA being a reason Kyrie wants out now.

This team just ran into arguably the greatest team ever assembled. They beat a 73-9 team and took the Warriors to 6 even with Kyrie and Love out. That's why Lebron get's whatever he wants, because he takes every **** team in the east to the finals. Kyrie was out for the first half of 2016 and the cavs still had the #1 seed. Kyrie played like **** during the first few rounds of this years playoffs but Lebron easily carried them to sweeps. Kyrie's may not want his career orchestrated by Lebron but his career wouldn't be **** right now had Lebron not came to Cleveland.

I agree with this.

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[Euroballer]

He should go to Knicks, get 7th position and knock out Lebron in the first round.