NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2022-23 (pt 2)

[CobraCommander]

Giannis hasn’t played with his starting 5 at all this year and the writers clearly and unanimously think Giannis is vastly superior to Luka...they still openly call Giannis the best player on earth (even after Jokic back to back) and Tatum the mvp...and they have been down on Luka because weight last year and defense this year. I’m just saying what I am hearing from the people with votes. It not my opinion-

To me Jokic is so much better than Luka or Tatum that it’s not close and the only thing Giannis has is his complete resume that includes doing everything and I mean everything of importance thus far...but if it’s not a life time achievement award it has to be Jokic - if it’s objectively the best player....jokic winning with and without his best team mates and his teammates having best years playing with him.

He is passing the final test of an mvp of making his mates better...

If Dallas wants Luka to stay, let alone win mvp, they need to upgrade the coach and roster - 1/3 of his career is over...

If you look at Vegas odds, you will see that first 4 are very close. And in the poll in this thread Giannis isn't exactly way ahead of Luka. You can have your opinion of course, like I can have my.

Vegas odds had Jokic at +2900 about two weeks ago. He's trending significantly upwards.

But no one thinks - I mean really thinks anyone is actually better at basketball than Jokic....we just asking about the mvp right?


Cause the best in the world poll should be unanimous right now...

[BelgradeNugget]

That’s really my point. Jokic would have to win and win big like 62 games to even get a third straight mvp.

It will go to Giannis or even Tatum before it goes to jokic for the 3rd time in a row.

KD there is too much drama and he won’t get it

Embiid would get some consideration but he misses too many games. Only way embiid wins is if the sixers get to 57-58 wins and embiid plays 68 games and that’s doubtful considering he’s missed 8 games already.

So it comes down to Giannis or Tatum. And the answer is easy. It’s Giannis. It’s lot just the seeding. Denver can be 1 seed with 55/57 wins and that won’t get it done. It’s the overall record Vs expectations for a 3rd straight mvp. 62 wins will get Jokic the mvp. I just don’t think that will happen.

Giannis will win it with 55-57 wins.

Tatum only wins it with 67-68 wins. That’s very hard to achieve.

Those are just my opinions.

Nba mvp are just about narratives. Do we really Believe Karl Malone was better than Jordan when he got those mvp. Nope.

I wouldn't count Durant out. Anyway it is too early, one injury, hot streak by some team could change a lot.

Yup, I think Durant can be a sneaky pick if folks don’t want to give to Jokic and Giannis. For some reason, the narrative for Tatum has really died down.

Tatum's narrative was built on team record the most of all candidates. To be clear he is playing great, but other candidates are having crazy individual seasons - Embiid, Durant, Giannis, Luka, Jokic... so if his team is 5-5 in last 10, and Durant's is 9-1, 76ers are 8-2, Denver is 7-3...
BTW I don't think "Durant can be a sneaky pick if folks don’t want to give to Jokic and Giannis" I think he can 100% deserve it as things are going right now.

[Exp0sed]

i for one am very impressed by Jokic's continued consistency

He was exteremly modest and diplomatic when he said: "everyone can have ONE good game" when in fact most of his games are good and not just this season ofc

from the field for instance, Jokic has shot 50% or better in 22 consecutive games and in 28 out of 29 games this season
the one game where he didn't was a win vs. Utah where he shot 3\10

in 16 of those 28 he shot above 60% and in fact over 70% in 10 of these

edit: Jokic is shooting 62.8% at home vs 60.4 away | he is also shooting 61.1% in wins vs. 63% (!) in losses

those are some crazy splits, he just doing his thing..

Assists and rebounds are also very consistent, very few games with a substainsialy lower number of either relative to his season average

I think it's an underrated quality that demonstrates just how dominant he has been
he's usually avaialble to play (very durable thus far in his career) and he rarely puts up stinkers and barely even mediocre games

almost every game is "one good game" for the Joker, that's pretty remarkable imo

[ty 4191]

from the field for instance, Jokic has shot 50% or better in 22 consecutive games and in 28 out of 29 games this season
the one game where he didn't was a win vs. Utah where he shot 3\10

in 16 of those 28 he shot above 60% and in fact over 70% in 10 of these

edit: Jokic is shooting 62.8% at home vs 60.4 away | he is also shooting 61.1% in wins vs. 63% (!) in losses

those are some crazy splits, he just doing his thing..

Jokic from 5-10 feet, career: .572 FG%. No small sample, either, 1649 FGA.

Consider that the number 2 best since 1996-1997 (when tracking began) is Chris Paul, at .500.

Other Notables:
KG: .448
Kobe: .439
Duncan: .430
Shaq: .421
Dirk: .402
Lebron: .396
Iverson: .360
Westbrook: .336

From 5-15 feet:
Jokic: .543 (2453 attempts)

Number 2 is again Chris Paul, WAY in the distance, at .498 FG%.

Notables:
Dirk: .450
KG: .447
Kobe: .435
Jordan: .429
Duncan: .421
Shaq: .403
Karl Malone: .381
Lebron James: .379
Westbrook: .369
Iverson: .349

From 10-20 feet:
Jokic: .488 (1555 FGA)

Second is, again, Chris Paul, at .482.

Notables:
Curry: .469
Jordan: .445
Hakeem: .431
Ray Allen: .428
Embiid: .427
Reggie Miller: .424
Karl Malone: .415
Kobe: .414
Ewing: .402
Tatum: .397
Westbrook: .394
D Rob: .388
Iverson: .386
Giannis: .368 (!!)

Nikola Jokic is absolutely obscene as a shooter.

[cam24thomas]

I wonder what% 1984-1993 Jordan shot from 5-10 feet....I bet it was huge, whereas in 1996-98 he was using 10-20 feet more and his fg% slipped.

[SOA]

from the field for instance, Jokic has shot 50% or better in 22 consecutive games and in 28 out of 29 games this season
the one game where he didn't was a win vs. Utah where he shot 3\10

in 16 of those 28 he shot above 60% and in fact over 70% in 10 of these

edit: Jokic is shooting 62.8% at home vs 60.4 away | he is also shooting 61.1% in wins vs. 63% (!) in losses

those are some crazy splits, he just doing his thing..

Jokic from 5-10 feet, career: .572 FG%. No small sample, either, 1649 FGA.

Consider that the number 2 best since 1996-1997 (when tracking began) is Chris Paul, at .500.

Other Notables:
KG: .448
Kobe: .439
Duncan: .430
Shaq: .421
Dirk: .402
Lebron: .396
Iverson: .360
Westbrook: .336

From 5-15 feet:
Jokic: .543 (2453 attempts)

Number 2 is again Chris Paul, WAY in the distance, at .498 FG%.

Notables:
Dirk: .450
KG: .447
Kobe: .435
Jordan: .429
Duncan: .421
Shaq: .403
Karl Malone: .381
Lebron James: .379
Westbrook: .369
Iverson: .349

From 10-20 feet:
Jokic: .488 (1555 FGA)

Second is, again, Chris Paul, at .482.

Notables:
Curry: .469
Jordan: .445
Hakeem: .431
Ray Allen: .428
Embiid: .427
Reggie Miller: .424
Karl Malone: .415
Kobe: .414
Ewing: .402
Tatum: .397
Westbrook: .394
D Rob: .388
Iverson: .386
Giannis: .368 (!!)

Nikola Jokic is absolutely obscene as a shooter.

What website did you get the data from? And I wonder why they broke down the distances at weird specs......

[ty 4191]

What website did you get the data from? And I wonder why they broke down the distances at weird specs......

Stathead (Basketball Reference). And, you can pick any criteria you want.

[moderndarwin]

Joker love fest in here continuing. Watch him get exposed again in the playoffs when a team repeatedly targets him. The only true chance they have is if they figure out some sort of zone defense to playz

[AleksandarN]

Joker love fest in here continuing. Watch him get exposed again in the playoffs when a team repeatedly targets him. The only true chance they have is if they figure out some sort of zone defense to playz

We will see since getting poa defenders their defense has approved and now that they are healthier Denver opponents will actually have to guard Bruce brown , kcp MPJ and Murray when the last two years they could leave Austen rivers and freaking facu open knowing they don’t have to spend energy guarding them. Big difference.

[eyeatoma]

Joker love fest in here continuing. Watch him get exposed again in the playoffs when a team repeatedly targets him. The only true chance they have is if they figure out some sort of zone defense to playz

Glad to see not everyone is blinded here.

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[RB34]

Embiid stans discrediting Jokers playoff success but forgetting Embiid is a perennial playoff choker. With much better supporting casts.

[eyeatoma]

Embiid stans discrediting Jokers playoff success but forgetting Embiid is a perennial playoff choker. With much better supporting casts.

Embiid had his face caved in by Fistcal Siakim and a torn finger ligament last year. Year before that another injury and Ben Simmons turtling.

Jokic has been fully healthy the whole time and was carried to the WCF by bubble Murray.

After his 2 MVPs how far had Joker gone again? If I'm not mistaken Embiid has gone further.

Because issue for Embiid has always been injuries.

Don't want to let facts get in the way of a good story though.

Perhaps you forgot this.

https://youtu.be/YwYVudH8t1U

Clearly a choker.



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[Genjuro]

My perception right now, hearing podcasts and game announcers, is that many people is coming to terms with the fact that Jokic can win his third MVP award. I mean, I believe there's a certain degree of voter fatigue, but I feel it's less intense than I had anticipated.

Jokic won't even go down as the greatest Foreign Player ever, unless he manages to lead his Team to at least one Championship.

Dirk and Pau are still way ahead of both him and Joel in that regard.

Edit: Dirk, Pau and Giannis of course ...

Yeah, and Milicic is a champion too...

Pau is not ahead of Jokic unless you value (a few) FIBA games more than (a lot of) NBA games. Winning the title as a second banana is not the same as doing it while leading a team. Actually, Pau was 0-9 in playoff games as leader of his team.

[RB34]

Embiid stans discrediting Jokers playoff success but forgetting Embiid is a perennial playoff choker. With much better supporting casts.

Embiid had his face caved in by Fistcal Siakim and a torn finger ligament last year. Year before that another injury and Ben Simmons turtling.

Jokic has been fully healthy the whole time and was carried to the WCF by bubble Murray.

After his 2 MVPs how far had Joker gone again? If I'm not mistaken Embiid has gone further.

Because issue for Embiid has always been injuries.

Don't want to let facts get in the way of a good story though.

Perhaps you forgot this.

https://youtu.be/YwYVudH8t1U

Clearly a choker.



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Joker getting “carried” by bubble Murray while Embiid is getting swept in the first round by the Celtics.

I seem to remember the Celtics beating them 4-1 in the second round as well.

[eyeatoma]

Embiid stans discrediting Jokers playoff success but forgetting Embiid is a perennial playoff choker. With much better supporting casts.

Embiid had his face caved in by Fistcal Siakim and a torn finger ligament last year. Year before that another injury and Ben Simmons turtling.

Jokic has been fully healthy the whole time and was carried to the WCF by bubble Murray.

After his 2 MVPs how far had Joker gone again? If I'm not mistaken Embiid has gone further.

Because issue for Embiid has always been injuries.

Don't want to let facts get in the way of a good story though.

Perhaps you forgot this.

https://youtu.be/YwYVudH8t1U

Clearly a choker.



Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

Joker getting “carried” by bubble Murray while Embiid is getting swept in the first round by the Celtics.

I seem to remember the Celtics beating them 4-1 in the second round as well.

Bruh the team was built around Ben Simmons and he was injured and didn't play. The corpse of Al Horford and Josh Richardson were also in the team. Even your king wouldn't be able to do anything with that.

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[mademan]

There is just no coherent argument to make that embiid is better than jokic in the playoffs.

[RB34]

Embiid had his face caved in by Fistcal Siakim and a torn finger ligament last year. Year before that another injury and Ben Simmons turtling.

Jokic has been fully healthy the whole time and was carried to the WCF by bubble Murray.

After his 2 MVPs how far had Joker gone again? If I'm not mistaken Embiid has gone further.

Because issue for Embiid has always been injuries.

Don't want to let facts get in the way of a good story though.

Perhaps you forgot this.

https://youtu.be/YwYVudH8t1U

Clearly a choker.



Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

Joker getting “carried” by bubble Murray while Embiid is getting swept in the first round by the Celtics.

I seem to remember the Celtics beating them 4-1 in the second round as well.

Bruh the team was built around Ben Simmons and he was injured and didn't play. The corpse of Al Horford and Josh Richardson were also in the team. Even your king wouldn't be able to do anything with that.

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Oh so he played without an All Star that season? Like Joker has done his whole career?

[AleksandarN]

Read on Twitter

[ty 4191]

Joker love fest in here continuing. Watch him get exposed again in the playoffs when a team repeatedly targets him. The only true chance they have is if they figure out some sort of zone defense to playz

Glad to see not everyone is blinded here.

Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

GB is going to be insufferable with this 40 piece triple double.

Greatest stat line of all time. VoRp, SNORp, CLARP, Pterodactyl...

Such a hater. Worst poster on this forum and that’s saying a lot.

[Cubbies2120]

Embiid had his face caved in by Fistcal Siakim and a torn finger ligament last year. Year before that another injury and Ben Simmons turtling.

Jokic has been fully healthy the whole time and was carried to the WCF by bubble Murray.

After his 2 MVPs how far had Joker gone again? If I'm not mistaken Embiid has gone further.

Because issue for Embiid has always been injuries.

Don't want to let facts get in the way of a good story though.

Perhaps you forgot this.

https://youtu.be/YwYVudH8t1U

Clearly a choker.



Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

Joker getting “carried” by bubble Murray while Embiid is getting swept in the first round by the Celtics.

I seem to remember the Celtics beating them 4-1 in the second round as well.

Bruh the team was built around Ben Simmons and he was injured and didn't play. The corpse of Al Horford and Josh Richardson were also in the team. Even your king wouldn't be able to do anything with that.

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Oh ok so a team missing their #2 best player (Simmons) is an excuse for getting SWEPT by a young Celtics team, but a team missing their #2 AND #3 best players and losing to the NBA CHAMPION Warriors isn't an excuse.

Got it! in bizarro world where logic doesn't exist, this makes total sense!

"Carried to the WCF" meanwhile Jokic was clearly their best player against the (at the time) championship favorite Clippers...not sure if srs