Best 5 players over the past 25 years

[bledredwine]

Got to love these Lebron fan polls

[SlimShady83]

Got to love these Lebron fan polls

I voted other out of spite, this was when It started ages ago

[Sakkreth]

In that order > LeBron, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Jokic

[bledredwine]

1. Shaq
2. Lebron
3. Kobe
4. Duncan
5. Jokic

[dhsilv2]

1. Shaq
2. Lebron
3. Kobe
4. Duncan
5. Jokic

Are you voting on peak? Shaq was well into his career 25 years ago. The totality of his career is dwarfed by Lebron, even if you think Shaq had a better career. But if you do it on peak....I can't see how Kobe is over Duncan or Jokic or Curry...and I can keep going.

[One_and_Done]

Got to love these Lebron fan polls

I'm not sure how this is a 'Lebron fan' thread. Is it because he has the most votes?

[bledredwine]

1. Shaq
2. Lebron
3. Kobe
4. Duncan
5. Jokic

Are you voting on peak? Shaq was well into his career 25 years ago. The totality of his career is dwarfed by Lebron, even if you think Shaq had a better career. But if you do it on peak....I can't see how Kobe is over Duncan or Jokic or Curry...and I can keep going.

I’ve watched every finals over the last twenty five years and Shaq’s three-peat was definitely the most dominant and impressive.
As for Kobe? He was considered better than Lebron until late 2009. His peak was crazy but he played with scrubs.

[dhsilv2]

1. Shaq
2. Lebron
3. Kobe
4. Duncan
5. Jokic

Are you voting on peak? Shaq was well into his career 25 years ago. The totality of his career is dwarfed by Lebron, even if you think Shaq had a better career. But if you do it on peak....I can't see how Kobe is over Duncan or Jokic or Curry...and I can keep going.

I’ve watched every finals over the last twenty five years and Shaq’s three-peat was definitely the most dominant and impressive.
As for Kobe? He was considered better than Lebron until late 2009. His peak was crazy but he played with scrubs.

So you went with peaks...and then you just like Kobe despite his peak not being top 5 in the last 25. Cool

[druggas]

While getting easily annoyed by Kobe stans myself, I think the bigger nuisance right now are One_and_Done's blatant baiting attempts to get into a discussion about Kobe to make the same arguments about him again and again. Been there, done that. Too many times already.

Agree.

[hugepatsfan]

Curry, Lebron and Duncan are obvious.

Shaq is obvious in a straight all time ranking of the top 25 players. Maybe you could filter him out for longevity since out of the last 25 years he was only elite for the first 5-6. But that span includes the 3-peat and then his MIA title as well so I leave him on. But I wouldn't totally discredit the idea that the entirety of Durant's prime puts him ahead in the last 25 years where Shaq was only that type of guy for 6 years.

It's a moot point because OP left Kobe off the list for whatever reason. So both Shaq and KD are in. But when you adjust for that, I go back and forth on if Shaq or KD should be in since it's just the last 25 years.

[bledredwine]

Are you voting on peak? Shaq was well into his career 25 years ago. The totality of his career is dwarfed by Lebron, even if you think Shaq had a better career. But if you do it on peak....I can't see how Kobe is over Duncan or Jokic or Curry...and I can keep going.

I’ve watched every finals over the last twenty five years and Shaq’s three-peat was definitely the most dominant and impressive.
As for Kobe? He was considered better than Lebron until late 2009. His peak was crazy but he played with scrubs.

So you went with peaks...and then you just like Kobe despite his peak not being top 5 in the last 25. Cool

Speak for yourself, not for me. He definitely had a top 5 peak.

[dhsilv2]

I’ve watched every finals over the last twenty five years and Shaq’s three-peat was definitely the most dominant and impressive.
As for Kobe? He was considered better than Lebron until late 2009. His peak was crazy but he played with scrubs.

So you went with peaks...and then you just like Kobe despite his peak not being top 5 in the last 25. Cool

Speak for yourself, not for me. He definitely had a top 5 peak.

There's no world where Kobe peaked higher than.

2003 - Duncan
2004 - KG
2009 - Wade (and with the playoffs we could argue 06)
2011 - Dirk
2021 - Giannis
Pick like any year for Jokic
Same with Shaq
Countless Lebron season
2016 or 2023 Curry
2012 KD (if not more seasons)

Lets just grant you these guys who are worth a debate
CP3 - 2008, 2009, 2015
Harden - Multiple years measure better but I"ll grant it for his playoff play
1999 Karl Malone
2003 Tmac
Nash - which I don't know why I'm even granting this one but I'll grant it
2011 - Howard
Doncic - I'm sure over time, I'll regret even granting this for 2023 but lets grant it
Embiid - again, I"m not sure history is going to look favorably on this one but his short comings in the playoffs, lets grant it

So there are at least 10 guys with a better peak to where it really can't even be argued. And another 8 guys with a strong case. Kobe's an amazing player who was able to play at near his peak levels from 2001 through 2009 which was crazy. But his peak doesn't stand out over the last 25 years. Even during his career he never had a strong case to be the best player in the league. Never had any case as the clear best and even his MVP was seen as a life time award and not deserving.

[bledredwine]

So you went with peaks...and then you just like Kobe despite his peak not being top 5 in the last 25. Cool

Speak for yourself, not for me. He definitely had a top 5 peak.

There's no world where Kobe peaked higher than.

2003 - Duncan
2004 - KG
2009 - Wade (and with the playoffs we could argue 06)
2011 - Dirk
2021 - Giannis
Pick like any year for Jokic
Same with Shaq
Countless Lebron season
2016 or 2023 Curry
2012 KD (if not more seasons)

Lets just grant you these guys who are worth a debate
CP3 - 2008, 2009, 2015
Harden - Multiple years measure better but I"ll grant it for his playoff play
1999 Karl Malone
2003 Tmac
Nash - which I don't know why I'm even granting this one but I'll grant it
2011 - Howard
Doncic - I'm sure over time, I'll regret even granting this for 2023 but lets grant it
Embiid - again, I"m not sure history is going to look favorably on this one but his short comings in the playoffs, lets grant it

So there are at least 10 guys with a better peak to where it really can't even be argued. And another 8 guys with a strong case. Kobe's an amazing player who was able to play at near his peak levels from 2001 through 2009 which was crazy. But his peak doesn't stand out over the last 25 years. Even during his career he never had a strong case to be the best player in the league. Never had any case as the clear best and even his MVP was seen as a life time award and not deserving.

I can't agree with any of that. You're underrating Kobe.

For peak, I've got Shaq, Lebron, Kobe, Duncan, and the rest.

I don't understand how you can put Curry over him when the playoffs matter. Curry's regular season was awesome but he was just poor in that year's playoffs, and I'm a Curry fan.
You also seem to be neglecting defense and a player's ability to hold the team accountable
and to higher standards.

And of course, this doesn't just include peak. Championships and achievements are very important in the GOAT rankings.
Kobe slaughters those guys except for Duncan/Shaq/Lebron.

[dhsilv2]

Speak for yourself, not for me. He definitely had a top 5 peak.

There's no world where Kobe peaked higher than.

2003 - Duncan
2004 - KG
2009 - Wade (and with the playoffs we could argue 06)
2011 - Dirk
2021 - Giannis
Pick like any year for Jokic
Same with Shaq
Countless Lebron season
2016 or 2023 Curry
2012 KD (if not more seasons)

Lets just grant you these guys who are worth a debate
CP3 - 2008, 2009, 2015
Harden - Multiple years measure better but I"ll grant it for his playoff play
1999 Karl Malone
2003 Tmac
Nash - which I don't know why I'm even granting this one but I'll grant it
2011 - Howard
Doncic - I'm sure over time, I'll regret even granting this for 2023 but lets grant it
Embiid - again, I"m not sure history is going to look favorably on this one but his short comings in the playoffs, lets grant it

So there are at least 10 guys with a better peak to where it really can't even be argued. And another 8 guys with a strong case. Kobe's an amazing player who was able to play at near his peak levels from 2001 through 2009 which was crazy. But his peak doesn't stand out over the last 25 years. Even during his career he never had a strong case to be the best player in the league. Never had any case as the clear best and even his MVP was seen as a life time award and not deserving.

I can't agree with any of that. You're underrating Kobe.

For peak, I've got Shaq, Lebron, Kobe, Duncan, and the rest.

I don't understand how you can put Curry over him when the playoffs matter. Curry's regular season was awesome but he was just poor in that year's playoffs, and I'm a Curry fan.
You also seem to be neglecting defense and a player's ability to hold the team accountable
and to higher standards.

And of course, this doesn't just include peak. Championships and achievements are very important in the GOAT rankings.
Kobe slaughters those guys except for Duncan/Shaq/Lebron.

If you want to dismiss Curry's 2016 playoffs which were still better than Kobe's 2010. Fine. Then there's 2015, 2017, and 2022 where Curry was as good or better than Kobe ever was in the playoffs.

If anyone is dismissing defense it's you implying Duncan's peak is even close to Kobe or leaving Giannis behind Kobe. Or again...where's Wade if defense matters? Wade was a better defender by Kobe at his best by a margin. And we're not even to KG who might be the best defender up here, and his 2004 season might be the singular best season of the last 25 years.

Ranking Kobe's peak over Jokic is down right insulting as well.

And the question was about building a team around them. not their accomplishments. Though would can already argue most of these guys have topped Kobe's 1 MVP.

[One_and_Done]

Curry, Lebron and Duncan are obvious.

Shaq is obvious in a straight all time ranking of the top 25 players. Maybe you could filter him out for longevity since out of the last 25 years he was only elite for the first 5-6. But that span includes the 3-peat and then his MIA title as well so I leave him on. But I wouldn't totally discredit the idea that the entirety of Durant's prime puts him ahead in the last 25 years where Shaq was only that type of guy for 6 years.

It's a moot point because OP left Kobe off the list for whatever reason. So both Shaq and KD are in. But when you adjust for that, I go back and forth on if Shaq or KD should be in since it's just the last 25 years.

I mean, if you want to vote for Kobe just vote 'other'. That option is there for a reason.

[RoyceDa59]

LeBron
Duncan
Kobe
Curry
Shaq