2024-25 NBA MVP Discussion Thread (Pt. 4: Who is the MVP?)

[Triple7]

SGA should get it this year. You just can’t give Jokic 4 mvp’s right? If SGA won it last year, then Jokic probably would win it this year averaging a triple double. Denver needs to solidify their 2nd place standing, and for Okc to flop this final 15 games for Jokic to win it.

[AleksandarN]

Jokic is not winning it this year

[-Luke-]

SGA should get it this year. You just can’t give Jokic 4 mvp’s right? If SGA won it last year, then Jokic probably would win it this year averaging a triple double. Denver needs to solidify their 2nd place standing, and for Okc to flop this final 15 games for Jokic to win it.

You can, he already should be at four. But you can't give it to him if the other player is also having a historic season like that. If Shai wins, he deserves it.

[SpreeS]

Rookie Saar got 34pts and 5ast on Jokic.

[kazyv]

SGA should get it this year. You just can’t give Jokic 4 mvp’s right? If SGA won it last year, then Jokic probably would win it this year averaging a triple double. Denver needs to solidify their 2nd place standing, and for Okc to flop this final 15 games for Jokic to win it.

he wouldn't. you don't get MVPs for average seasons like the nuggets are having. not when the other contender you're dead even with in advanced stats is leading a young inexperienced team to such a dominating season. this MVP race isn't close at all. jokic and nuggets can compete for 2nd place with giannis and bucks and that's more of a "fair" fight. but they aren't in contention for MVP when they are barely on pace for 50 wins

[Big J]

Jokic is not winning it this year

Have faith young grasshopper.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Full highlights. This might have been SGA’s best offensive performance of the season in terms of the range of different ways he scored and the extra aura points.

Read on Twitter

[OkcSinceSGA]

If Jokic put effort into defense how much would his offense drop off?

Read on Twitter

[Mavrelous]

If Jokic put effort into defense how much would his offense drop off?

Read on Twitter

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

[OkcSinceSGA]

If Jokic put effort into defense how much would his offense drop off?

Read on Twitter

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

[Mavrelous]

If Jokic put effort into defense how much would his offense drop off?

Read on Twitter

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

No, statwise both are positive defenders, eye test wise, when SGA was pressure tested, he crumbled real fast, it's only the fact he has elite rim protector and 2 elite perimeter defenders starting + IHart, Caruso and Wallace that makes him look great defensively.
No one is playing defense and carrying and offense except prime LeBron and maybe Kawhi...

[kazyv]

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

No, statwise both are positive defenders, eye test wise, when SGA was pressure tested, he crumbled real fast, it's only the fact he has elite rim protector and 2 elite perimeter defenders starting + IHart, Caruso and Wallace that makes him look great defensively.
No one is playing defense and carrying and offense except prime LeBron and maybe Kawhi...

this is getting silly. i agree that jokic can be a positive defender and the bashing has gone too far at times. they would never have won in 2023 if he was a bad defender. but we are in the 2025 MVP thread. it's about this season and the production in THIS season. the nuggets have not been a good defensive team this season. jokic is part of that squad and has to own that, especially as a center.

shai is part of a legendary squad on defense. a squad that had it's ups and downs on with injuries but has always brought it on defense. and shai is part of that defensive success. he played the most minutes, the most games and he was on the court, no matter if it's with or without ihart or whoever else. SGA clearly outplayed Jokic this season. there's no ifs and buts about it

[Mavrelous]

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

No, statwise both are positive defenders, eye test wise, when SGA was pressure tested, he crumbled real fast, it's only the fact he has elite rim protector and 2 elite perimeter defenders starting + IHart, Caruso and Wallace that makes him look great defensively.
No one is playing defense and carrying and offense except prime LeBron and maybe Kawhi...

this is getting silly. i agree that jokic can be a positive defender and the bashing has gone too far at times. they would never have won in 2023 if he was a bad defender. but we are in the 2025 MVP thread. it's about this season and the production in THIS season. the nuggets have not been a good defensive team this season. jokic is part of that squad and has to own that, especially as a center.

shai is part of a legendary squad on defense. a squad that had it's ups and downs on with injuries but has always brought it on defense. and shai is part of that defensive success. he played the most minutes, the most games and he was on the court, no matter if it's with or without ihart or whoever else. SGA clearly outplayed Jokic this season. there's no ifs and buts about it

I was very clear SGA is the MVP regardless, and I've been on this since January, but the reasons have nothing to do with defense.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

No, statwise both are positive defenders, eye test wise, when SGA was pressure tested, he crumbled real fast, it's only the fact he has elite rim protector and 2 elite perimeter defenders starting + IHart, Caruso and Wallace that makes him look great defensively.
No one is playing defense and carrying and offense except prime LeBron and maybe Kawhi...

And yet he’s still hugely positive on defense when these guys like Chet, Hart, Caruso are down long stretches this season. Makes perfect sense! lol

[lethalizer]

Thing about Shai is I agree that he's somewhat overrated as a defender because of his steal and block numbers.

But the effort he actually put in this season to close out to the shooters has genuinely been impressive. He was lazier on those the seasons before.

Watch the game from last night as a perfect example. He rotated to Hardaway JR and Beasly multiple times to contest their threes.

I still don't really trust him as a one on one defender, but besides that he doesn't really have any weaknesses on the defensive end right now. Can't ask for more from your superstar guard if he's basically your offensive engine and is great at every other aspect of the defensive end besides one on one coverage.

Help side blocks, hawking the passing lanes, rotaring to shooters. If these are coming from your guard being this good on the offensive end, you'd take it 100 out of 100 times.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Thing about Shai is I agree that he's somewhat overrated as a defender because of his steal and block numbers.

But the effort he actually put in this season to close out to the shooters has genuinely been impressive. He was lazier on those the seasons before.

Watch the game from last night as a perfect example. He rotated to Hardaway JR and Beasly multiple times to contest their threes.

I still don't really trust him as a one on one defender, but besides that he doesn't really have any weaknesses on the defensive end right now. Can't ask for more from your superstar guard if he's basically your offensive engine and is great at every other aspect of the defensive end besides one on one coverage.

Help side blocks, hawking the passing lanes, rotaring to shooters. If these are coming from your guard being this good on the offensive end, you'd take it 100 out of 100 times.

For me he’s more like peak Wade defense than he is MJ or Pippen. He’s not a lockdown guy who’s your primary stopper. But he’s a hugely positive EFFORT defender who racks up stocks.

[BigGargamel]

Nuggets lost to the Wizards twice this year. Get Jokic some real teammates, what a joke this is.

[Packbuckman]

Love how everyone uses anecdotes to push his agenda, PJ Washington and DJJ who went off in the WCSF were SGA's men, he roamed off of, when this got him stocks in RS everyone cheered what a defensive playet he is, when PJ and DJJ were hitting wide open 3s, and PJ posted up SGA at every chance it was shooting variance...
Neither Jokic nor SGA are playing good defense, SGA is carried defensively by his squad, Jokic isn't because KCP is hone and defensive anchor Gordon is down this season, and results show it.
SGA is still the clear MVP for me BTW, and his season is ATG season, no need to make false narratives.

There is ZERO false narrative to say it’s clear that SGA is a hugely positive defender and Jokic is a not a positive defender. It’s supported by data as well, not just a few lowlights. I’m asking a non rhetorical question. If Jokic actually competed defensively, would he be able to maintain this offensive level? Because SGA is having the greatest offensive (and really overall) guard season since 96 MJ.

That’s with him playing defense and scoring 33+ ppg. I’m asking if Jokic became a solid to good defender how much would his offense drop off? Energy is finite and I’m not sure he maintains that level. I could see him dropping to something like 25 points, 8 assists. Still insanely good but less historic on paper.

Yes, I’m biased.. but I’m not just dissing him. I’m wanting answers.

No, statwise both are positive defenders, eye test wise, when SGA was pressure tested, he crumbled real fast, it's only the fact he has elite rim protector and 2 elite perimeter defenders starting + IHart, Caruso and Wallace that makes him look great defensively.
No one is playing defense and carrying and offense except prime LeBron and maybe Kawhi...

Giannis is still playing defense and carrying offense he was exceptional on D last nite against the pacers in a playoff atmosphere game with 3 blocks and 34-10-7 line he is the only player that can raise his defense to great level to match his dominance on offense. But my vote definitely would be SGA as mvp his team has been great this year. Tonight’s game will be very interesting both on a btb Milwaukee vs OKC.

[hardenASG13]

Nuggets lost to the Wizards twice this year. Get Jokic some real teammates, what a joke this is.

He had 3 teammates score 20 or more. It was their Defense, letting the Wiz drop 126 that was the problem, and Jokic was a huge part of it.

[Optms]

Nuggets lost to the Wizards twice this year. Get Jokic some real teammates, what a joke this is.

Jokic needs stars to beat a 14 win team. Is this what we're doing now?

Meanwhile not a word about Joker allowing Alex freaking Sarr to go off? Nuggets have issues from top to bottom.