The Master wrote:This analysis is useless, because you're comparing Nuggets' team DRTG to the DRTG of Nuggets with Jokic on a floor, but it doesn't take into account amount of minutes with and without. If you go by stats from nba.com, Nuggets have 112.8 DRTG with Jokic on a floor and 102.2 DRTG without Joker, their average is 111.4 because Jokic plays 75% of minutes of Nuggets, so the fact that Nuggets are very good defensively without Jokic can't impact team Nuggets general stats that much. In reality, Nuggets are bad defensively with Jokic and great defensively without him, and while a situation that Nuggets are that bad with Jokic on a floor isn't only his fault, Jokic's weaknesses on defense are certainly not helpful either.
Well now I understand this. What I don't undrestand is this:
Last year in the playoffs Jazz as a team had defensive rating of 116.8 (by nba.com)
Rudy Gobert (DPOY) had defensive rating of 119.4 in 38.6 mpg. How much worst was he making Utah defensively?
Or there is some context behind that?
The Master wrote: Some stats point Jokic as being good defender, because defense is very difficult to evaluate, and many metrics take into account stats that are not precisely representative to real level of defense of a player, like rebounding or steals. Lillard is a point guard, so there's much less mislead about evaluation of his defense. According to same metrics, Russell Westbrook was a great defender thanks to his rebounding, while in reality most of time he was average or even below average because he was statpadding those rebounds no matter what. That's why Jokic's BPM stats and BPM-based formulas are historically great, while in reality it is really flawed formula in defense evaluation.
1. How you evaluate PG's defense?
2. We all know Russell Westbrook was stat-pading rebounds because his teammates were boxing out for him and he wasn't challenging shots to secure rebounds. If Jokic is 5th in league in box outs per game, are his rebounds legit defensive stat? He is among the league leaders in steals and deflections, without gambling and stat-padding are those stats in this case legit defensive stats?
3. Embiid is allowing 4.9 DFGM <6ft, Jokic is allowing 4.4. Is Jokic Dikembe Mutombo now? What if Embiid is attacking drivers at the rim while Jokic's point of attack is a little further from the rim forcing drivers to shoot midrange shots or floaters (less efective shots than layups). Is Jokic still worst rim protector in the league or he is doing it differently?
I aksed a lot of questions, here is how I see it. If every offensive stat says Jokic is great there must be some truth to that (and Dame is also great only not on Jokic's level). If every defensive stat shows Dame as terrible defender there must be some truth to that. And if some defensive stat show Jokic as great, some as average and some as terrible I would go with average.
