2021-22 NBA Rookie Thread (part 4)

[LoveMyRaps]

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?s=21

In my book Barnes is ahead of Mobley. And it was a highway robbery that Barnes was not named East Rookie for Oct and Nov.

No it wasn't. But Barnes has definitely passed Mobley in December. No doubt about that.

[LoveMyRaps]

Dude can do it all. OP SCOTTIE!

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[The-Power]

For all the flashes Giddey has shown, he's still scoring at a putrid 45% TS, his on/off numbers are weak and his team rebounds poorly with him on the court (and a lot better without). Obviously the sample size is still rather small and flashes are arguably the most important thing to look for in young Rookies, but Giddey has a lot of development ahead of him to become even an average impact player.

I wonder how you'd feel about Giddey if he'd fallen to your Warriors. Sour grapes much?

Not everything is about size measuring contests, my friend. I'm just posting my opinion about Giddey just as I have with plenty of other Rookies (even before they were drafted, by the way). I understand why a thread like this might confuse you in this regard, because it seems to be mostly fans of different teams propping up their Rookies or downplaying the competition, but I can assure you that me being a Warriors fan has nothing to do with my posts in this thread.

[MoneyTalks41890]

SGA and Giddey were a combined +77 against the Grizzlies. Giddey is very legit. He needs to improve his shot but his BBIQ and passing ability are already some of the best in the league at 19. And he’s a solid rebounder.

[srhcan]

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?s=21

In my book Barnes is ahead of Mobley. And it was a highway robbery that Barnes was not named East Rookie for Oct and Nov.

No it wasn't. But Barnes has definitely passed Mobley in December. No doubt about that.

It was. Compare the stats of first 6 weeks. On NBA Rookie Ladder Barnes was ranked #1 for 4 of those 6 weeks.

[DudetheObscure]

For all the flashes Giddey has shown, he's still scoring at a putrid 45% TS, his on/off numbers are weak and his team rebounds poorly with him on the court (and a lot better without). Obviously the sample size is still rather small and flashes are arguably the most important thing to look for in young Rookies, but Giddey has a lot of development ahead of him to become even an average impact player.

I wonder how you'd feel about Giddey if he'd fallen to your Warriors. Sour grapes much?

Not everything is about size measuring contests, my friend. I'm just posting my opinion about Giddey just as I have with plenty of other Rookies (even before they were drafted, by the way). I understand why a thread like this might confuse you in this regard, because it seems to be mostly fans of different teams propping up their Rookies or downplaying the competition, but I can assure you that me being a Warriors fan has nothing to do with my posts in this thread.

It's been well discussed that the Ws wanted to draft Giddey and many on this thread have said that Giddey would be a great fit in Kerr's system, but it's probably just a coincidence that a Ws fan is trying to put him in the worst possible light. Enjoy Kuminga.

[Chandan]

cade close to a triple double mid way into the third.

[Madhouse]

Giddey is promising, just going to take a couple of years to be an impact player.

[DudetheObscure]

Giddey is promising, just going to take a couple of years to be an impact player.

Yes, he needs three things, 1) strength, 2) consistent outside shooting, and 3) teammates who can finish his assists.

[God Squad]

Cade with a rough shooting night going 2-13 FG, no biggie. Still got 9 reb and 8 assist, the 5 turnovers aren't great though.

[BlazersBroncos]

Giddey is promising, just going to take a couple of years to be an impact player.

Yes, he needs three things, 1) strength, 2) consistent outside shooting, and 3) teammates who can finish his assists.

He is going to be fine IMO. He has the frame to put on muscle, his shot is very workable and to the last point, that one will be on Presti.

His feel for the game is unteachable. He is already a top tier passer and rebounder for a SF and his defensive awareness is quite underrated (He wont ever be great on defense due to physical limitations, but he has a good feel for where to be at least).

I think he will be a 18/8/8 guy in time with 35-38% 3PT shooting (Maybe better, again his shot is tremendously workable).

[OrlMagic05]

East Rookie of the Month

16ppg 52%FG 36%3pt 8reb 4ast 1.6blk
17ppg 48%FG 40%3pt 6reb 4ast 1.3 stls
18ppg 42%FG 40%3pt 6reb 6ast 1.7stl

Who yall got?

[PhilBlackson]

East Rookie of the Month

16ppg 52%FG 36%3pt 8reb 4ast 1.6blk
17ppg 48%FG 40%3pt 6reb 4ast 1.3 stls
18ppg 42%FG 40%3pt 6reb 6ast 1.7stl

Who yall got?

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

[srhcan]

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In a redraft (too soon), Rockets and Raptors will switch.

[OrlMagic05]

East Rookie of the Month

16ppg 52%FG 36%3pt 8reb 4ast 1.6blk
17ppg 48%FG 40%3pt 6reb 4ast 1.3 stls
18ppg 42%FG 40%3pt 6reb 6ast 1.7stl

Who yall got?

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

[PhilBlackson]

East Rookie of the Month

16ppg 52%FG 36%3pt 8reb 4ast 1.6blk
17ppg 48%FG 40%3pt 6reb 4ast 1.3 stls
18ppg 42%FG 40%3pt 6reb 6ast 1.7stl

Who yall got?

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

Not at all.

Hence why when star players come together their individual numbers tend to drop. Established hierarchies mean there are players that are ahead of others in the pecking order which means less shot opportunities as the offensive schemes are drawn up to cater to their more established players.

It's why people always say things like "yeah but he's putting those numbers up on a bad team...". The pecking order doesn't really exist and that team is trying to showcase that player because there aren't superior players in their way and as many egos to contend with. How many other double digit scorers are there on the roster to contend with for touches & shots?! Also is that player generating their own offense or is it being done for them?!

Just putting up guys with similar numbers is far too simplistic without context of how it's achieved.

[OrlMagic05]

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

Not at all.

Hence why when star players come together their individual numbers tend to drop. Established hierarchies mean there are players that are ahead of others in the pecking order which means less shot opportunities as the offensive schemes are drawn up to cater to their more established players.

It's why people always say things like "yeah but he's putting those numbers up on a bad team...". The pecking order doesn't really exist and that team is trying to showcase that player because there aren't superior players in their way and as many egos to contend with. How many other double digit scorers are there on the roster to contend with for touches & shots?! Also is that player generating their own offense or is it being done for them?!

Just putting up guys with similar numbers is far too simplistic without context of how it's achieved.

Which is why I put up percentages. Yes, there are players that put up numbers on bad teams, but look at their efficiency. Its easier to put up numbers when there are 2-3 other player on your team that defenses have to worry about. More open shots for said player, where as when you are the main focus, defenses scheme around how to stop you first.

[orlando_joe]

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

Not at all.

Hence why when star players come together their individual numbers tend to drop. Established hierarchies mean there are players that are ahead of others in the pecking order which means less shot opportunities as the offensive schemes are drawn up to cater to their more established players.

It's why people always say things like "yeah but he's putting those numbers up on a bad team...". The pecking order doesn't really exist and that team is trying to showcase that player because there aren't superior players in their way and as many egos to contend with. How many other double digit scorers are there on the roster to contend with for touches & shots?! Also is that player generating their own offense or is it being done for them?!

Just putting up guys with similar numbers is far too simplistic without context of how it's achieved.

like rebounds when no center plays..

[basketballRob]

East Rookie of the Month

16ppg 52%FG 36%3pt 8reb 4ast 1.6blk
17ppg 48%FG 40%3pt 6reb 4ast 1.3 stls
18ppg 42%FG 40%3pt 6reb 6ast 1.7stl

Who yall got?

Which one has more talent around them where it's harder to put up the same numbers???

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

For Cade, Barnes, and Giddey it's a little easier to put up rebounding numbers. Wagner starts the game with 3 other good rebounders.

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[PhilBlackson]

I think its the complete opposite. Someone that has more talent around them makes it a little easier for them to put up numbers as you arent the other teams main focus.

Not at all.

Hence why when star players come together their individual numbers tend to drop. Established hierarchies mean there are players that are ahead of others in the pecking order which means less shot opportunities as the offensive schemes are drawn up to cater to their more established players.

It's why people always say things like "yeah but he's putting those numbers up on a bad team...". The pecking order doesn't really exist and that team is trying to showcase that player because there aren't superior players in their way and as many egos to contend with. How many other double digit scorers are there on the roster to contend with for touches & shots?! Also is that player generating their own offense or is it being done for them?!

Just putting up guys with similar numbers is far too simplistic without context of how it's achieved.

Which is why I put up percentages. Yes, there are players that put up numbers on bad teams, but look at their efficiency. Its easier to put up numbers when there are 2-3 other player on your team that defenses have to worry about. More open shots for said player, where as when you are the main focus, defenses scheme around how to stop you first.

Of course I know where you're trying to lead this.....to Wagner lol and of course he 100% deserves his props, no one disputes that.

He's very good at what he does, smart player, knows his spots, how to get to them, still really versatile. He's the reason why the Magic aren't getting bagged on for having a bad draft because Suggs on the otherhand *ahem*....we'll just leave that alone and give him more time because at least his defence looks good.

BUT I don't like simple accounting stats without context because I 1000% believe if either of Mobley or Barnes were on more depleted teams like ORL, DET....that their numbers would be higher across the board too. I don't mean efficiency because a lot of that will come with improving shooting mechanics and learning their spots as Franz has done/is doing but production wise their numbers would be higher and of course if they were putting up 20+ppg then no one is even comparing Wagner's numbers to theirs but the situations they are in do dictate a lot and people do realize that as those 2 improve their mechanics, get to know their spots better and move up the totem pole in the team's heirarchy that they are/will be superior prospects, there's no shame in that and doesn't mean Franz wasn't a GREAT pickup for ORL, will only hope that as Suggs improves his shot and finds his spots that his numbers will improve too...