2024-25 NBA DPOY and All-Defense discussion

[NoStatsGuy]

some german content creator actually had a great idea, which i agree with.

we need 2 dpoys... one thats on the perimeter and a big man. how is anybody ever going to compete again against wemby's stocks. i even expect his numbers to keep rising once he puts on a little more weight and gets more used to the game. defensive impact, thats not in the statsheet gets overlooked a lot. i understand wemby also does that and he should win it this year for sure. but how are you going to compare wemby vs amen thompson for example.

we need co-dpoys or 2 seperate awards i think for the future.

[KOA]

some german content creator actually had a great idea, which i agree with.

we need 2 dpoys... one thats on the perimeter and a big man. how is anybody ever going to compete again against wemby's stocks. i even expect his numbers to keep rising once he puts on a little more weight and gets more used to the game. defensive impact, thats not in the statsheet gets overlooked a lot. i understand wemby also does that and he should win it this year for sure. but how are you going to compare wemby vs amen thompson for example.

we need co-dpoys or 2 seperate awards i think for the future.

Don’t think Jalen Williams is German

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[NoStatsGuy]

some german content creator actually had a great idea, which i agree with.

we need 2 dpoys... one thats on the perimeter and a big man. how is anybody ever going to compete again against wemby's stocks. i even expect his numbers to keep rising once he puts on a little more weight and gets more used to the game. defensive impact, thats not in the statsheet gets overlooked a lot. i understand wemby also does that and he should win it this year for sure. but how are you going to compare wemby vs amen thompson for example.

we need co-dpoys or 2 seperate awards i think for the future.

Don’t think Jalen Williams is German

Read on Twitter

lol now i know where he got that idea from.

[Ballerhogger]

I didnt see any thread related to this award, which is the most imporant one after the MVP, so who is your 2024-25 DPOY ?

For me , at the moment is Amen Thompson. Best defender in one of the best defensive teams, he is also at the top in many defensive metrics, but even with just the eyes you can tell he is elite defender.

Discuss.

Where is AD at?

[cupcakesnake]

I didnt see any thread related to this award, which is the most imporant one after the MVP, so who is your 2024-25 DPOY ?

For me , at the moment is Amen Thompson. Best defender in one of the best defensive teams, he is also at the top in many defensive metrics, but even with just the eyes you can tell he is elite defender.

Discuss.

Where is AD at?

The mighty mighty anchor of the league's 19th best defense (a defense that is 1 point better when AD sits), has not been a serious candidate for the award so far this year, except for just going on reputation.

It will be interesting to see if that changes with AD as the best player on a Dallas defense that should be very good. An AD/Lively front line is pretty imposing.

I've been vocal about this in the thread: AD is one of the best defenders in the NBA, but he hasn't been having enough obvious impact this year to be a strong candidate for the award.

[Kobe187]

1. Wemby
2. A. Davis
3. Daniels

Wemby the 1st of many.

[Kiss of Death]

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[Blazinaway]

where is Camara at? Guy has been a defensive wrecking ball?

[yellowknifer]

It’s AD. Can’t believe he wasn’t an option.

[C0bR]

Chet reallly robbed himself of unanimous DPOY with that injury.

[Rust_Cohle]

Chet reallly robbed himself of unanimous DPOY with that injury.

It was always gonna be wembys. Thunder looked fantastic while Chet was injured

[C0bR]

Chet reallly robbed himself of unanimous DPOY with that injury.

It was always gonna be wembys. Thunder looked fantastic while Chet was injured

They are good but they are the best defense ever with him.

His at rim Dfg% is now at -20%, almost twice as good as Wemby

[Rust_Cohle]

Chet reallly robbed himself of unanimous DPOY with that injury.

It was always gonna be wembys. Thunder looked fantastic while Chet was injured

They are good but they are the best defense ever with him.

His at rim Dfg% is now at -20%, almost twice as good as Wemby

In an insanely small sample size surrounded by tons of amazing defenders. Not to say Chet isn’t great but far easier to look good defensively when you have the most talented defensive team overall in the league. Look at how many okc players show up here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defense

[Ticket]

where is Camara at? Guy has been a defensive wrecking ball?

He really has been special. Should be all-defensive for sure.

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[cupcakesnake]

It was always gonna be wembys. Thunder looked fantastic while Chet was injured

They are good but they are the best defense ever with him.

His at rim Dfg% is now at -20%, almost twice as good as Wemby

In an insanely small sample size surrounded by tons of amazing defenders. Not to say Chet isn’t great but far easier to look good defensively when you have the most talented defensive team overall in the league. Look at how many okc players show up here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defense

I'd say, historically with this award, the great defensive player on the great defensive team gets a little more love than the great defender lifting the bad defensive team.

Gobert is a good example. When he first started being a DPOY-level guy, Utah was a really strong defense with guys like Favors, George Hill, Joe INgles, RIcky Rubio, Dante Exum, Thabo Sefolosha, Jae Crowder, Royce O'Neale all spending multiple season there. Gobert's on/off numbers were good, but not amazing when Favors could come in and anchor the 2nd unit well enough. Later on, they tried to go for all-offense around Gobert. His on/off went through the roof, but Utah's offense was more average than great, and Gobert didn't win the award when Utah wasn't a top 5 defense. He lost to Marcus Smart one year, because Boston was just so good on defense, and Smart wasn't even unanimously their best defender.

So... Wemby is getting this award regardless, but I think if Chet hadn't gotten hurt, and had kept doing his thing, it would have been really hard to win this award over Chet. OKC is putting hp some historic numbers, and voters tend to like to award that kind of thing, even if it's dumb to credit just 1 good player. I mean... iHart will probably be on some DPOY ballot this year, and Jdub probably should too.

[cupcakesnake]

where is Camara at? Guy has been a defensive wrecking ball?

He really has been special. Should be all-defensive for sure.

Steadily rising up the ranks of best perimeter wing defenders. Super lock down against multiple positions, and particularly good against shooting guards. He's really good off the ball in terms of deflections and forcing turnovers. He's a little bit foul heavy, and not elite as a wing rim protector, but everything else is pretty A+ right now.

[tsherkin]

I'd say, historically with this award, the great defensive player on the great defensive team gets a little more love than the great defender lifting the bad defensive team.

This is true now. In the 90s, it was a little less true if you look at Mutombo. Sometimes, sexy BPG overcome.

So in the case of someone like Chet, he'd have likely made a good run at it, but it is still possible (not necessarily guaranteed, just possible) that Wemby might have won anyway.

[Rust_Cohle]

They are good but they are the best defense ever with him.

His at rim Dfg% is now at -20%, almost twice as good as Wemby

In an insanely small sample size surrounded by tons of amazing defenders. Not to say Chet isn’t great but far easier to look good defensively when you have the most talented defensive team overall in the league. Look at how many okc players show up here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defense

I'd say, historically with this award, the great defensive player on the great defensive team gets a little more love than the great defender lifting the bad defensive team.

Gobert is a good example. When he first started being a DPOY-level guy, Utah was a really strong defense with guys like Favors, George Hill, Joe INgles, RIcky Rubio, Dante Exum, Thabo Sefolosha, Jae Crowder, Royce O'Neale all spending multiple season there. Gobert's on/off numbers were good, but not amazing when Favors could come in and anchor the 2nd unit well enough. Later on, they tried to go for all-offense around Gobert. His on/off went through the roof, but Utah's offense was more average than great, and Gobert didn't win the award when Utah wasn't a top 5 defense. He lost to Marcus Smart one year, because Boston was just so good on defense, and Smart wasn't even unanimously their best defender.

So... Wemby is getting this award regardless, but I think if Chet hadn't gotten hurt, and had kept doing his thing, it would have been really hard to win this award over Chet. OKC is putting hp some historic numbers, and voters tend to like to award that kind of thing, even if it's dumb to credit just 1 good player. I mean... iHart will probably be on some DPOY ballot this year, and Jdub probably should too.

Disagree, wemby is such a unique situation the NBA hasn’t had before. In normal circumstance sure, but a far worse spurs team from last season had wemby barely missing out on DPOY. Considering wemby is hitting insane defensive numbers especially with blocks and getting all kind of block highlights where he doesn’t have to leave his feet which is just absurd he will clean house on this award for years to come. OKC is beyond stacked with amazing defenders, Chet is also more of a role player and even when healthy was barely doing 25 minutes a game. This award was always going to be wembys to lose regardless of Chet.

Even when Chet was healthy wemby was way ahead for DPOY and rightly so:

https://amp.dimers.com/nba-defensive-player-odds-ac-11-12-2024

[C0bR]

Wembanyama is actually greatly overrated defensively. Sure if you drive right into him you will get blocked but put him into any sort of action and he gets cooked which is the primary reason behind the Spurs' disappointing defense this season.

His overall rim protection numbers are just pretty good (the block numbers suggest block chasing which is confirmed by the eye test) and he can only play drop so he gets cooked by any higher tier guards. His IQ and effort are very low.

Holmgren is essentially way better at every aspect of defense other than pure shotblocking (blockchasing) and rebounding.

[cupcakesnake]

In an insanely small sample size surrounded by tons of amazing defenders. Not to say Chet isn’t great but far easier to look good defensively when you have the most talented defensive team overall in the league. Look at how many okc players show up here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defense

I'd say, historically with this award, the great defensive player on the great defensive team gets a little more love than the great defender lifting the bad defensive team.

Gobert is a good example. When he first started being a DPOY-level guy, Utah was a really strong defense with guys like Favors, George Hill, Joe INgles, RIcky Rubio, Dante Exum, Thabo Sefolosha, Jae Crowder, Royce O'Neale all spending multiple season there. Gobert's on/off numbers were good, but not amazing when Favors could come in and anchor the 2nd unit well enough. Later on, they tried to go for all-offense around Gobert. His on/off went through the roof, but Utah's offense was more average than great, and Gobert didn't win the award when Utah wasn't a top 5 defense. He lost to Marcus Smart one year, because Boston was just so good on defense, and Smart wasn't even unanimously their best defender.

So... Wemby is getting this award regardless, but I think if Chet hadn't gotten hurt, and had kept doing his thing, it would have been really hard to win this award over Chet. OKC is putting hp some historic numbers, and voters tend to like to award that kind of thing, even if it's dumb to credit just 1 good player. I mean... iHart will probably be on some DPOY ballot this year, and Jdub probably should too.

Disagree, wemby is such a unique situation the NBA hasn’t had before. In normal circumstance sure, but a far worse spurs team from last season had wemby barely missing out on DPOY. Considering wemby is hitting insane defensive numbers especially with blocks and getting all kind of block highlights where he doesn’t have to leave his feet which is just absurd he will clean house on this award for years to come. OKC is beyond stacked with amazing defenders, Chet is also more of a role player and even when healthy was barely doing 25 minutes a game. This award was always going to be wembys to lose regardless of Chet.

Even when Chet was healthy wemby was way ahead for DPOY and rightly so:

https://amp.dimers.com/nba-defensive-player-odds-ac-11-12-2024

I agree it will always be Wemby's to lose, but a DPOY-level season by a guy on an all-time great defensive team (OKC is boasting a -8.8 rDtrg despite missing Chet almost the entire season) is the exact kind of thing that might have made Wemby lose it.

We'll never know. Chet didn't even hit a dozen games before his injury. Citing DPOY odds 10 games into the year means next to nothing. Chet might not have even kept up the same pace. I just find it an easy scenario to envision where the media was deciding to make Chet the poster boy of a historic defense. We're talking about imagination here, and it's fine if you say you don't want to imagine it. I think it's quite plausible and have plenty of historical precedent to back it up. Wemby is the best defensive player in the NBA to me, but he's not at a point where he's statistically head and shoulders above everyone. You're a Spurs fan so you may not want to hear it.