Wade in Tmac's Orlando situation

[Buck You]

The Heat are pathetic. Not even Jordan himself could get this team into the playoffs. Don't harp on Wade because they are loosing, he's doing everything he can. He's playing hurt trying to get this team to wins. The man has won a title already, Tmac never won a playoff series!!

[Harry Heinous]

This thread title should be changed to the "Player Haters Ball"

[Harry Heinous]

There is nothing more pathetic than a player fan. Unfortunately a large portion of Heat fans are nothing more than Wade fans. You can usually spot them by their usernames here.......Wade this, Flash that.

Same deal with Kobe fans. But at the end of the day, all I'm saying is Wade has been trash this year...........turnover machine who hasn't made his teammates better whatsoever.

Without Shaq, Wade his been exposed........much like Pippen was without MJ.

Can you at least use semi-intelligent examples:

Pippen exposed without Jordan? Pippen, when Jordan left for baseball, had his best statistical year and led the Bulls to a 55-27 record and they lost in the Conference Semifinals in Game 7 to the Knicks.

Cmon man, try to pretend you know something about basketball.

[Das]

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Hard to disagree with that. Winning is what matters ultimately. Just saying that this is just another case where a superstar is being blamed unfairly for his team's woes.

Why not?

He got all the credit when they won the Championship, like Shaq got all the credit for winning 3 championships with the Lakers.

[Harry Heinous]

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Why not?

He got all the credit when they won the Championship, like Shaq got all the credit for winning 3 championships with the Lakers.

That's fine, but you can't have it both ways. People (Induveca) are trying to revise history and take away credit for the championship, and now are trying to put all the credit, blame on Wade for the Heat's terrible season this year.

Realistically, Wade more than any other player on the Heat was the main reason the Heat won a championship in 05-06.

Now, I have no problem with Wade getting most of the blame for the Heat's terrible year this year. I don't agree with it, but I understand it. As the team's "main man" you get all the credit and blame.

But the man is playing injured, and is clearly not himself. Disregarding that would be ignoring reality.

[Flash3]

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Why not?

He got all the credit when they won the Championship, like Shaq got all the credit for winning 3 championships with the Lakers.

No matter how great of a player you are, you can't win titles in this league alone. Bird couldn't do it. Magic couldn't do it. Hakeem couldn't do it. MJ couldn't do it. Shaq couldn't do it.

You need your role players fulfilling their roles on your team. That's why role players such as Steve Kerr, Jud Buechler, Horace Grant, Derek Fisher, AC Green, Robert Horry, Udonis Haslem, Sam Cassel, Bruce Bowen etc were so important to their respective teams in winning titles. Without them, their respective teams might not have as many titles as they do today......

Getting the blame/credit is fine, but when you have people giving mind-numbingly (Please Use More Appropriate Word) reasons to discredit said player, as we've had here already, then it's a whole different story altogether....

[G35]

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That's fine, but you can't have it both ways. People (Induveca) are trying to revise history and take away credit for the championship, and now are trying to put all the credit, blame on Wade for the Heat's terrible season this year.

Realistically, Wade more than any other player on the Heat was the main reason the Heat won a championship in 05-06.

Wade gets the credit for carrying the team. There shouldn't be ANY problem with him getting the blame.

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He can win you a title. Did you not see his title run when he won the title? That was carrying a team.

The man can carry a team, but his team is horrible, no defense, and even worst offense.

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Wade carried his team to a championship. Ask yourself this, if T-Mac had done the same for Orlando, would he have been criticized shortly afterwards for not being able to carry a team? No! Why? BECAUSE HE'D HAVE CARRIED A TEAM!

theres a reason why ppl consider the heat one of the worst championship teams of alltime and not just cause they think the refs were bad ... the roster wasn't that great ...wade carried a bunch of avg players and single handely willed them to the finals putting up 40 ppg in the last 4 games ... a player has to be special when u got a washed up shaq, fatoine walker and jwill as starters in ur lineup when u win a championship ...

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Yup. Just go back and watch Wade in the playoffs 2003-2006. Will and sheer determination are often how scouts and coaches describe Dwyane Wade.

Especially the 2006 NBA finals. Talk about will, fire, and sheer determination. Down 0-2 in the series, and Wade goes on to average 40ppg in the next 4 games to will his team back and win the championship.

Even Flash3 said that this losing streak is hurting Wades legacy. You can excuse some losing streaks to injury, bad shooting slumps, coaching but 13 games?

The Heat fans like to say winning the championship was worth any pain down the road but how many teams have had 13 games losing streaks? If Wade is as willful and can carry a bunch of avg players in the playoff's don't you think he can carry the Heat to a win in the regular season.......

[BBallFreak]

Even Flash3 said that this losing streak is hurting Wades legacy. You can excuse some losing streaks to injury, bad shooting slumps, coaching but 13 games?

The Heat fans like to say winning the championship was worth any pain down the road but how many teams have had 13 games losing streaks? If Wade is as willful and can carry a bunch of avg players in the playoff's don't you think he can carry the Heat to a win in the regular season.......

If T-Mac is as great a player as people seem to think he is, why can't he GET OUT OF THE FIRST ROUND? I'll answer for you. It's a team game!

If you'd bothered to quote some of my other posts, you'd have noted that I said blaming T-Mac is unfair. Obviously then, doing nothing but crediting Wade would also be asinine! And in fact, I've often given credit to his teammates for the ring. Without Udonis Haslem, Shandon Anderson, and James Posey playing Dirk as well and as physically as they did, we don't win. Without Shaq drawing doubles and triples every time down the floor, we don't win. Without Toine being a consistent third scorer (even though he was the second leading scorer) we don't win. Without J-Will taking care of the ball, we don't win. Without GP and Zo playing phenomenal defense and making huge plays, we don't win.

Does Wade deserve some of the blame for what's happened in Miami this season? Absolutely. Maybe even the lion's share of it in terms of players. But, the crap that's being said about him in this thread is PREPOSTEROUS!

He's been likened to Isiah Rider, blamed entirely for the losing streak, been called less than a superstar, and every bit of the credit he earned for his role in the ring has been shifted to Shaq just so people can either put him down or lift T-Mac up. Either way, it's stupid, and I would hope you folks would realize it by now.

Dwyane Wade is a fantastic player. He's a superstar. He's done more than T-Mac has in this league. That's undeniable. To suddenly consider him garbage (as has continually been implied in this thread) is disingenuous, at best...

[Flash3]

^and when he gets 1 win, you'll have your naysayers saying, "he can only get 1 win in X games, he is still the suxorrz"

The hatred in these sort of situations NEVER end. -- We've seen it with the Kobe, T-Mac, LeBron, and just about every other great wing player.....

[G35]

^and when he gets 1 win, you'll have your naysayers saying, "he can only get 1 win in X games, he is still the suxorrz"

The hatred in these sort of situations NEVER end. -- We've seen it with the Kobe, T-Mac, LeBron, and just about every other great wing player.....

Probably but that's the nature of being the guy "who carries his team to the championship." Since Wade carried his team to the championship single handedly once, now it's assumed he can do it everytime. A lot of people said the Heat would fall off but it was assumed that any team with Wade and Shaq would be a contender.

So now those statements have to be modified. There really should be a middle ground. Like Wade was the #1 option or Wade took over the offense in the last 4 games of the series or something. But things get taken out of context.

You see those "Wade carried his team in the playoff's"; so now he gets the Wade can't get his team a win or can't get his team into the playoff's. In fairness if I were Wade I would be pissed at the whole situation. He has to do whatever it takes to win. Which is why I watch Wade. I like watching him; he is a compelling basketball player even to the haters. Just like people that don't like Shaq, Kobe, the Celtics or Lebron. He is a top 5 player imo. More like top 10 this year. Even with all the losses he is still a top player in my mind.

But he needs to say forget waiting for the rest of his teammates and lead them to a win. Today......

[D-Wade]

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If I had Shaq I'd be an NBA champion too.

If you had Shaq averaging 13/10 in the NBA Finals?

Please. This is probably one of the worse threads in RealGM history.

[D-Wade]

The Heat are pathetic. Not even Jordan himself could get this team into the playoffs. Don't harp on Wade because they are loosing, he's doing everything he can. He's playing hurt trying to get this team to wins. The man has won a title already, Tmac never won a playoff series!!

Bump.

Wade goes for 35/8/4 in the Finals & Shaq puts up 13/10.

Yet the statement goes,

"Even I can win a title with Shaq"

[jzmagik]

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If you had Shaq averaging 13/10 in the NBA Finals?

Please. This is probably one of the worse threads in RealGM history.

LOL Shaq is still Shaq, its amazing how people continue to say degrade Shaq's impact to make Wade look better by quantifying his performance.

[lalalisa]

This is so (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Let us remember that TMac has not won A SINGLE PLAYOFF SERIES.

[RoxFan08]

This is so (Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Let us remember that TMac has not won A SINGLE PLAYOFF SERIES.

And we go back to the same, idiotic, mindless statement.

[D-Wade]

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LOL Shaq is still Shaq, its amazing how people continue to say degrade Shaq's impact to make Wade look better by quantifying his performance.

Shaq is still Shaq?

Wow. Obviously, you haven't watched basketball in about 5 years.

I would never lower myself to arguing basketball with you.

[D-Wade]

Let me ask you guys a question:

If the Celtics win a title this year or next, what will you say about KG who couldn't carry a team until he was placed with TWO All-Star teammates? I'd love to hear 20 pages of responses to this question.

I also find it funny how people fail to mention Kobe's failure to carry the Lakers to .500 a few years ago. Lamar Odom & Caron Butler (even with a bummed knee back then) are obviously superior to any of Wade's "supporting" garbage.

[CB4MiamiHeat]

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LOL Shaq is still Shaq, its amazing how people continue to say degrade Shaq's impact to make Wade look better by quantifying his performance.

Wade had a guy that was a great 2nd option and a top 5 center...

He didnt have the usual Shaq, you know the guy that had 40-20 playoff games with the Lakers..or games where he nearly had a quadruple double or nearly 30 free throw attempts.

[D-Wade]

Bottom line:

Dwyane Wade put up 35/8/4 in the NBA Finals to carry his team to a title on the road. He did that with ANTOINE WALKER AS THE TEAM's SECOND LEADING SCORER.

Tracy McGrady, who is actually one of my favorites, has never carried a team to ANYTHING. Not to mention he's playing with Yao Ming and a far superior supporting cast to anything Wade has to work with right now.

Where are the excuses for why T-Mac hasn't made it out of round 1?

Wade >>> T-Mac.
However, Kobe >>> all.
(not debatable, IMO)

Basketball is a team game. Stop pretending as if this is golf or tennis.

[RoxFan08]

Bottom line:

Dwyane Wade put up 35/8/4 in the NBA Finals to carry his team to a title on the road. He did that with ANTOINE WALKER AS THE TEAM's SECOND LEADING SCORER.

Tracy McGrady, who is actually one of my favorites, has never carried a team to ANYTHING. Not to mention he's playing with Yao Ming and a far superior supporting cast to anything Wade has to work with right now.

Where are the excuses for why T-Mac hasn't made it out of round 1?

Wade >>> T-Mac.
However, Kobe >>> all.
(not debatable, IMO)

Basketball is a team game. Stop pretending as if this is golf or tennis.

If you put Wade in Tmac's position in Orlando, or in Tmac's position in Houston, I'd be willing to bet you he wouldn't have made it out of the 1st round either. He's been the victim of very bad circumstances. Its no secret the West has been the varsity to the East's JV the last 4 years or so. Only this year is that slowly starting to change, with Boston and Detroit's revival, but there are STILL 10 teams in the West right now with 21 or more wins, while only 3 in the East.