76ers will become dynasty in 10 years

[Wonderllama]

I just want to know: when does Philly start thinking about playoffs? Next season, or the season after that?

[Unbreakable99]

There's still so many holes in the 76ers plan. This team is just as likely to bust as it is to boom. I don't buy into the hype whatsoever. I'll buy in when there's reason to.

Until then, I'm still gonna say the Jazz, Wolves, Bucks, Magic, Pelicans, and Celtics are in better situations.

The Jazz haven't won a title yet. You guys are still rebuilding. What's taking you guys so long? What is your plan? You guys haven't even made the playoffs in years. You guys stay in the lottery. Vic your team first before you ask about us. Make the playoffs before you ask about the Sixers.

Rather than just arguing "YOU SUX TOO" with everyone, why not answer the questions being asked? They're legitimate, and this doesn't help any.

And no, teams don't have to make the playoffs before we ask about the Sixers. Anyone can question another team's plan at any time.

No. You answer me on what the Jazz are actually doing. When are they going to make the playoffs? When are they going to even get past the second round. Look in the mirror. I do love Gobert. He's a monster but you guys haven't done jack squat. So answer my question. I'll throw it right back at you. I don't think your plan will work. See what I did there?

[MiltownHawkeye]

1. The Sixers have tons of cap space relative to those other teams listed.

How much will this matter in 1-2 years when nearly every team has cap space? If there wasn't a cap increase I'd agree that's a huge feather in Philly's cap.

3. How many of those teams walked out with the "best player" in the draft 2 years in a row?

I would call this empty rhetoric. It sounds great until you dissect what it actually means when you declare Noel and Embiid the best player of their draft already.

[MiltownHawkeye]

The Jazz haven't won a title yet. You guys are still rebuilding. What's taking you guys so long? What is your plan? You guys haven't even made the playoffs in years. You guys stay in the lottery. Vic your team first before you ask about us. Make the playoffs before you ask about the Sixers.

Rather than just arguing "YOU SUX TOO" with everyone, why not answer the questions being asked? They're legitimate, and this doesn't help any.

And no, teams don't have to make the playoffs before we ask about the Sixers. Anyone can question another team's plan at any time.

No. You answer me on what the Jazz are actually doing. When are they going to make the playoffs? When are they going to even get past the second round. Look in the mirror. I do love Gobert. He's a monster but you guys haven't done jack squat. So answer my question. I'll throw it right back at you. I don't think your plan will work. See what I did there?

He's not declaring that the Jazz are going to be a dynasty in ten years, nor is he posting in a thread proposing that while making zero attempt to distance himself from the claim.

[Sixersftw]

"The Sixers are going to be amazing in five years."

"The Sixers are still going to be terrible in five years."

The sooner you and everyone else accepts that these two statements (in a vacuum) are equally valid, the shorter these threads can be.

Yeah, I don't think it's Sixers fans that have the problem with both sides of the argument.

of course you don't think that

Show me if I'm wrong.

[mateo82]

I don't think in those terms. As long as they are going in the right direction it's fine. I have no idea how long it's going to take. If I have an issue with something they do, it will because I don't think it is in the best interest of the team, NOT that it's taking too long or something.

But that's different. I'm a 76ers fan. I want them to be good. You aren't, you shouldn't care/should want them to fail. So if you really think that this isn't the best way to do it, you shouldn't care/be happy that we're acting like idiots.

As long as we're asking questions, would it make you happy if we signed LMA and Wes this summer? Unless you don't like those players (In which case fill in your own hypothetical players you would like to keep around a team you like) I'm guessing not.

My point is that fans of other teams should want us to tank as long as possible. If we win X more games, that means, on average, you will lose X/29 more games. If we get X more talent, that means you will have X/29 less talent. (IDK if those numbers are exactly right but you get my point)

You're absolutely wrong on this. What Philadelphia is doing is being looked at by every team in the league. Whether it is successful or not matters a lot to fans of every team. If it's successful it means any team could start employing the same strategy and that would be harmful to the league (and harmful to fans of those teams). If it fails (crossing my fingers) maybe it means teams have more pressure to just try and win all of the time which would be great for the league.

So no, I can't ignore it and say it doesn't matter to me, it matters tremendously.

And the fact that you won't even admit that there's an expiration on the strategy or commit to a timeline when you'll turn against it speaks volumes about the state of things.

[Sixersftw]

He's not declaring that the Jazz are going to be a dynasty in ten years, nor is he posting in a thread proposing that while making zero attempt to distance himself from the claim.

Neither is he. This is Chris Sheridan's (Hack) article posted by a raptors fan. Why does he have to distance himself? He didn't declare it.

[Q C]

With regards to the Jazz (since I don't feel like quoting):

They have a ton of nice players. Gobert, Favors, and Hayward is a solid core. However, none of the three have "superstar" potential. So essentially, the Jazz' entire plan revolves around Dante Exum living up to insanely high expectations. If he doesn't pan out, they are stuck in the treadmill. They had a nice season, but as Sixers fans know, it is hard to get a game changer towards the end of the lottery.

Basically, their whole plan comes down to Exum, in my opinion.

I guess every team looks like a future treadmill when you have one of the worst rosters assembled in NBA history. You're calling one of the youngest teams in the league that is actually GOOD in the WEST a future treadmill team. The team you root for is bottom of the barrel in the worst conference of all time. Get some perspective.

[Mik317]

So we are back to the "its bad for the league and its fans" rhetoric?

The only fans the Sixers should care about is their own really. And the majority of Sixers fans are cool with everything that has happened. But whatever...if we are truly a disgrace to the league then so are the Wolves who have been just as bad as us and perhaps for longer..that franchise wasted Love and KG before that. What a disgrace yo. I am joking but it is weird that incompetence is somehow better for the league than being honest with it. If it is true then we have been Basketball Hitler for a daaaaamn long time because we have been mediocre forever...like a true treadmill team and I think that is worse for the league than anything.

I also don't think many GMs will get the same chance Hinkie got because most teams are in such **** ass position like the Pre Hinkie Sixers were. Like the Knicks are awful right now but they at least have Melo, a legit allstar and scorer...there are probably no teams that will be in the state the Sixers were after the Bynum trade. So not only will most GMs not get a chance to "Pull a Hinkie", they also probably won't get a chance to prelong and collect a few extra picks like Hinkie either having a shot at taking legit prospects that you could actually redshirt in back to back drafts is a rare thing...if not for that we could be looking at Mclemore and Wiggins instead of Noel and Embiid and I'd imagine the whole tank so hard thing would be a lot different right now. So even if anyone follows our lead if this is successful it still wouldn't be this end of days thing. There are going to be some aaaawful teams every year.that is just how it works.

[psualltheway5]

With regards to the Jazz (since I don't feel like quoting):

They have a ton of nice players. Gobert, Favors, and Hayward is a solid core. However, none of the three have "superstar" potential. So essentially, the Jazz' entire plan revolves around Dante Exum living up to insanely high expectations. If he doesn't pan out, they are stuck in the treadmill. They had a nice season, but as Sixers fans know, it is hard to get a game changer towards the end of the lottery.

Basically, their whole plan comes down to Exum, in my opinion.

I guess every team looks like a future treadmill when you have one of the worst rosters assembled in NBA history. You're calling one of the youngest teams in the league that is actually GOOD in the WEST a future treadmill team. The team you root for is bottom of the barrel in the worst conference of all time. Get some perspective.

Do you not understand the definition of a treadmill team? The Jazz are a good team. I even said that in my first sentence.

What makes them a treadmill roster is:
1. They don't have a superstar
2. They play in the West
3. They are in the process of stockpiling end of the lottery draft picks
4. They have a limited upside

The only way out of this is if Exum steps up, as I mentioned already.

Weird that you assume the Sixers roster was one of the "worst rosters ever assembled" when they never even finished with the league's worst record in their "tanking era".

[Q C]

With regards to the Jazz (since I don't feel like quoting):

They have a ton of nice players. Gobert, Favors, and Hayward is a solid core. However, none of the three have "superstar" potential. So essentially, the Jazz' entire plan revolves around Dante Exum living up to insanely high expectations. If he doesn't pan out, they are stuck in the treadmill. They had a nice season, but as Sixers fans know, it is hard to get a game changer towards the end of the lottery.

Basically, their whole plan comes down to Exum, in my opinion.

I guess every team looks like a future treadmill when you have one of the worst rosters assembled in NBA history. You're calling one of the youngest teams in the league that is actually GOOD in the WEST a future treadmill team. The team you root for is bottom of the barrel in the worst conference of all time. Get some perspective.

Do you not understand the definition of a treadmill team? The Jazz are a good team. I even said that in my first sentence.

What makes them a treadmill roster is:
1. They don't have a superstar
2. They play in the West
3. They are in the process of stockpiling end of the lottery draft picks
4. They have a limited upside

The only way out of this is if Exum steps up, as I mentioned already.

Weird that you assume the Sixers roster was one of the "worst rosters ever assembled" when they never even finished with the league's worst record in their "tanking era".

The current Jazz roster a position that the Sixers would be incredibly lucky to be in talent and record wise in 5 years. And the rosters are the same age.

[James40]

I don't think in those terms. As long as they are going in the right direction it's fine. I have no idea how long it's going to take. If I have an issue with something they do, it will because I don't think it is in the best interest of the team, NOT that it's taking too long or something.

But that's different. I'm a 76ers fan. I want them to be good. You aren't, you shouldn't care/should want them to fail. So if you really think that this isn't the best way to do it, you shouldn't care/be happy that we're acting like idiots.

As long as we're asking questions, would it make you happy if we signed LMA and Wes this summer? Unless you don't like those players (In which case fill in your own hypothetical players you would like to keep around a team you like) I'm guessing not.

My point is that fans of other teams should want us to tank as long as possible. If we win X more games, that means, on average, you will lose X/29 more games. If we get X more talent, that means you will have X/29 less talent. (IDK if those numbers are exactly right but you get my point)

You're absolutely wrong on this. What Philadelphia is doing is being looked at by every team in the league. Whether it is successful or not matters a lot to fans of every team. If it's successful it means any team could start employing the same strategy and that would be harmful to the league (and harmful to fans of those teams). If it fails (crossing my fingers) maybe it means teams have more pressure to just try and win all of the time which would be great for the league.

So no, I can't ignore it and say it doesn't matter to me, it matters tremendously.

And the fact that you won't even admit that there's an expiration on the strategy or commit to a timeline when you'll turn against it speaks volumes about the state of things.

The only people that know the expiration dates are the owner and GM. I'm as objective as it gets when it comes to the tank and losing games, ( not a fan and gave up my season tickets, so did 3 of my buddies and many others). It looks like the winning under 20 games a season for the last two is over and pretty much has to be if Embiid, Noel, and this years number 3 are healthy. The disclaimer with that is none of the top 3 picks get hurt, and our GM doesn't draft Kristaps with the Sixers number 3. So next season the Sixers have,
Smith
Russel
Covington
Noel
Embiid,
Just a guess as to who starts, but that should net more than 20 wins if healthy, then so on with next years picks.

FA signings? Who knows? I don't see Hinkie just spending to spend unless there is someone he feels they really need, again with disclaimers,( if he can sign someone to a max deal before the cap skyrockets, and say the max is 15 mil vs 25 mil in a few years, he may sign that player just on value alone).

[Mik317]

Only thanks to LMBM, JRich, Sims,and Ish skewing the age range.

The guys that matter are 20 and 21. Soon to add a 19 year old.

This age stuff is a weird thing to be hung up on. I don't agree that the Jazz are a treadmill..as I think that should only be for truly maxed out teams. Jazz are not that.

[snoopdogg88]

there are bad teams every year. it's been that way since the beginning of time. always going to be 50-60 loss teams every season.
nobody cared when we had mediocre idiots like Billy King and Tony DiLeo and Ed Stefanski running the show.
for once we actually have a thoughtful, intelligent GM with a realistic vision, and the world goes insane over us.

there's a reason why the majority of Sixers fans are absolutely in love with Hinkie (so far).

and no, it's not a "guaranteed" plan. nothing is. nobody sits and criticizes others teams for not having a 100% foolproof "plan" so why do we get criticized?
-smart head coach
-max cap space
-ridiculous amount of future 1st and 2nd round draft picks giving us flexibility to make moves.
-accumulating what we are hoping to be elite young talent (Embiid, Noel, Russell/Mudiay, Saric)

what more can you ask of your GM during a rebuilding phase after 2 seasons?

[laika]

No. You answer me on what the Jazz are actually doing. When are they going to make the playoffs? When are they going to even get past the second round. Look in the mirror. I do love Gobert. He's a monster but you guys haven't done jack squat. So answer my question. I'll throw it right back at you. I don't think your plan will work. See what I did there?

The Jazz were the 5th best team in the league after the all-star break. They were by far the best defensive team. That's an awful lot better than what Philadelphia's done lately. Also, the Jazz are the youngest team in the league.

As for this thread, there should be an absolute ban on talking about a dynasty until you've won at least one title.

[psualltheway5]

I guess every team looks like a future treadmill when you have one of the worst rosters assembled in NBA history. You're calling one of the youngest teams in the league that is actually GOOD in the WEST a future treadmill team. The team you root for is bottom of the barrel in the worst conference of all time. Get some perspective.

Do you not understand the definition of a treadmill team? The Jazz are a good team. I even said that in my first sentence.

What makes them a treadmill roster is:
1. They don't have a superstar
2. They play in the West
3. They are in the process of stockpiling end of the lottery draft picks
4. They have a limited upside

The only way out of this is if Exum steps up, as I mentioned already.

Weird that you assume the Sixers roster was one of the "worst rosters ever assembled" when they never even finished with the league's worst record in their "tanking era".

The current Jazz roster a position that the Sixers would be incredibly lucky to be in talent and record wise in 5 years. And the rosters are the same age.

You do realize that the Sixers roster is NOWHERE close to complete, right? Making a judgement based upon age is just silly, especially with outliers like Jason Richardson.

[Mobby]

I do think that it's likely the 76ers will end up being one of the best teams in 6-8 years time. If they trade their assets for a superstar that is pushing his way out -- that would be another way of reaching that peak in a shorter time. However, I also like their chances of coming out ahead in the draft with all of their opportunities.

In any case, plenty of flexibility -- and it really might not take nearly as long as 10 years if they play their cards right.

Yeah, maybe the 10 year prediction was meant for after establishing the dynasty, i.e. already winning a few titles? Because you're right, if the plan works, they'll first become one of the league's best teams much sooner than that.

The combination of "dynasty" and "10 years" wasn't the best. 76ers will become a contender in 5 years would have been much more reasonable.

Phrasing it that way doesn't drive clicks to your blog. You are correct though, the measured question is will the Sixers be a top 4 seed in the East in 5 years?

If I were a betting man, I'd say top 6 in 5 years for sure. Top 6 in the league in 8 for sure.

If this does not happen, I'd say they failed big time.

All things considered, I assume the fans would consider anything less than playoffs in 3 years to be a fail.

[MiltownHawkeye]

Yeah, I don't think it's Sixers fans that have the problem with both sides of the argument.

of course you don't think that

Show me if I'm wrong.

Which poster should I quote? The one who says "I think the Sixers will be a dynasty next year", the one that thinks what happened to the 00s Blazers/Wolves couldn't possibly ever happen to the Sixers and that anyone thinking otherwise needs to do their research, the one that can only bring up other teams in response to criticism, the one who declares a post "mindless drivel" because it opines that the Wolves have a better rebuild going than the Sixers, or the one who says that Sixer fans are the only people making intelligent points anywhere in the thread

With regards to the Jazz (since I don't feel like quoting):

They have a ton of nice players. Gobert, Favors, and Hayward is a solid core. However, none of the three have "superstar" potential. So essentially, the Jazz' entire plan revolves around Dante Exum living up to insanely high expectations. If he doesn't pan out, they are stuck in the treadmill. They had a nice season, but as Sixers fans know, it is hard to get a game changer towards the end of the lottery.

Basically, their whole plan comes down to Exum, in my opinion.

I guess every team looks like a future treadmill when you have one of the worst rosters assembled in NBA history. You're calling one of the youngest teams in the league that is actually GOOD in the WEST a future treadmill team. The team you root for is bottom of the barrel in the worst conference of all time. Get some perspective.

Do you not understand the definition of a treadmill team? The Jazz are a good team. I even said that in my first sentence.

What makes them a treadmill roster is:
1. They don't have a superstar
2. They play in the West
3. They are in the process of stockpiling end of the lottery draft picks
4. They have a limited upside

The only way out of this is if Exum steps up, as I mentioned already.

Weird that you assume the Sixers roster was one of the "worst rosters ever assembled" when they never even finished with the league's worst record in their "tanking era".

?
The problems with your view on the Jazz (and probably quite a few other rebuilding franchises by extension):

1) You seem to place little to no value on players that don't have the superstar moniker. It's not that black and white. Having a lot of young players that are very good to great already (while none of them are going to exactly be transcendent) doesn't inherently make it HARDER to become a contender. I know the Pistons are the typical counter-point to the superstar theory, but unlike other teams who desperately cling onto the hope they'll be the next Detroit, Utah's roster actually sorta fits the bill. Obviously that team wasn't just collectively worthless or low-ceiling because none of them were superstars in name. Some would include the 2013-14 Spurs; no one on that team necessarily had transcendent superstar IMPACT, but it was a ridiculously well-rounded, deep, talented team. It's a much more flawed example than the Pistons but I'll put it out there anyway.

2) Yes, they play in the West. Do you know who else played in the West? The current elite teams in the West. Being a current non-contender in the West doesn't shut you out of contention forever. All you're explaining is how it becomes a little harder for the Jazz to be a contender, not why they're already on a treadmill.

3) You make it sound like collecting late lotto picks are toxic, and each one added to your asset pile makes you worse. The Jazz already have top 5 pick-worthy talent and plenty of it. Sure, it sucks to be picking in the lottery every year when you're winning on the backs of retread veterans and other mediocre players. That's the opposite of what the Jazz are doing. They're picking 13th this year because their young talent is actually really, really good already.

4) Would you say that Noel has limited upside? Would you say that literally every prospect in the Sixers organization right now besides Embiid has limited upside? That's the only notion that consistent with saying that the Jazz has limited upside. And in that case, it's only because we've seen all of Utah's prospects play that we don't have any fanatical visions of what they'll look like in their prime. Embiid is the highest ceiling prospect on either team, yeah, but the fact that the Jazz don't have a singular prospect with as high of a ceiling doesn't make them a treadmill team. That term pretty much loses all meaning when you apply it to the Jazz of all teams.

The Celtics? Still way early to say they're a treadmill team but they have way, way less talent than the Jazz have so that's a little more palatable.

[stopstandthere]

It is often easy to talk big about dreams and even it fails they are many reasons to explain and then justify it. The Sixers are trying something radical and playing within the rules. Technically, they are in "good shape" where they have numerous picks and picks and picks, apart from the cap space. Everyone knows the theory behind.

But the coming question is, what next? Can they well managed to utilize their assets? Analytic includes chemistry factor? Any plan B if there is injury? Will NBA change its lottery system shortly? Of course no one knows because they are unknown factors.

Please do not ask me about the Knicks plan here. If you are interested, do not hesitate to discuss in our team forum. Thanks.

[Unbreakable99]

No. You answer me on what the Jazz are actually doing. When are they going to make the playoffs? When are they going to even get past the second round. Look in the mirror. I do love Gobert. He's a monster but you guys haven't done jack squat. So answer my question. I'll throw it right back at you. I don't think your plan will work. See what I did there?

The Jazz were the 5th best team in the league after the all-star break. They were by far the best defensive team. That's an awful lot better than what Philadelphia's done lately. Also, the Jazz are the youngest team in the league.

As for this thread, there should be an absolute ban on talking about a dynasty until you've won at least one title.

But when are the Jazz going to win the championship? That's all that matters. You guys have failed even with 2 hall of famers in Stockton and Malone. When are you guys going to get a good plan. It's a massive fail so far. Your plan won't work because I said so. You haven't made the playoffs in years. Fix your organization.