China cancels NBA stuff / Silver issues statement (pg1) /Ongoing discussion...

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Promezclan
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#261 » by Promezclan » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:22 pm

13th Man wrote:
wco81 wrote:
13th Man wrote:Nobody is pandering to the Chinese. Their situation is extremely complicated, stay out of their business. You meddle into **** you know little about and chances are you could get burned.



Nothing complicated. Chinese Communist Party is authoritarian and will run over civilian protesters with tanks.

They suppress that information so now a lot of Chinese lemmings have this mistaken sense of nationalistic pride so they support suppression of dissent in places like Tibet or the muslim minority and now HK as well.


You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?

Man, working overtime today, I see.

Just because you have a perspective doesn't mean it's valid. Slavery, genital mutilation, foot binding etc. are common cultural practices, but the Western perspective is just more enlightened.

There are also universal declarations of human rights that bring genocide, for example, under international law.

And, of course, the Chinese made a treaty agreement with the UK to maintain 50 years of a separate system with basic human rights in Hong Kong, before quickly closing all independent book stores, censoring media, banning politicians, abducting/disappearing people, and now extraditing Hong Kongers to the kangaroo courts (if you're lucky) of the Mainland, etc.

And it's a simple fact that the United States doesn't agree with you that all possible perspectives are equally valid. It has a very specific public (clandestine is another story, of course) policy of promoting democracy and human rights.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#262 » by wco81 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:28 pm

13th Man wrote:
wco81 wrote:
13th Man wrote:Nobody is pandering to the Chinese. Their situation is extremely complicated, stay out of their business. You meddle into **** you know little about and chances are you could get burned.



Nothing complicated. Chinese Communist Party is authoritarian and will run over civilian protesters with tanks.

They suppress that information so now a lot of Chinese lemmings have this mistaken sense of nationalistic pride so they support suppression of dissent in places like Tibet or the muslim minority and now HK as well.


You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?


No I’m looking at it from a human perspective.

Govts shouldn’t massacre political dissidents. NBA shouldn’t pander to authoritarians.

What are you going to say next, that the Chinese aren’t ready for Western style democracy?

:roll:
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#263 » by 13th Man » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:30 pm

Promezclan wrote:
13th Man wrote:
wco81 wrote:

Nothing complicated. Chinese Communist Party is authoritarian and will run over civilian protesters with tanks.

They suppress that information so now a lot of Chinese lemmings have this mistaken sense of nationalistic pride so they support suppression of dissent in places like Tibet or the muslim minority and now HK as well.


You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?

Man, working overtime today, I see.

Just because you have a perspective doesn't mean it's valid. Slavery, genital mutilation, foot binding etc. are common cultural practices, but the Western perspective is just more enlightened.

There are also universal declarations of human rights that bring genocide, for example, under international law.

And, of course, the Chinese made a treaty agreement with the UK to maintain 50 years of a separate system with basic human rights in Hong Kong, before quickly closing all independent book stores, censoring media, banning politicians, abducting/disappearing people, and now extraditing Hong Kongers to the kangaroo courts (if you're lucky) of the Mainland, etc.

And it's a simple fact that the United States doesn't agree with you that all possible perspectives are equally valid. It has a very specific public (clandestine is another story, of course) policy of promoting democracy and human rights.


I will admit that you know more about Chinese history than I do, I try to keep my arguments at simplistic level. So do you think it is the responsibility of the U.S. to keep the China in line wrt humanitarian issues? Isn't that what the United Nations is for?

Personally, I don't think that it's fair to place the burden on the NBA or even the USA to try to keep them in check.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#264 » by 13th Man » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:33 pm

wco81 wrote:
13th Man wrote:
wco81 wrote:

Nothing complicated. Chinese Communist Party is authoritarian and will run over civilian protesters with tanks.

They suppress that information so now a lot of Chinese lemmings have this mistaken sense of nationalistic pride so they support suppression of dissent in places like Tibet or the muslim minority and now HK as well.


You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?


No I’m looking at it from a human perspective.

Govts shouldn’t massacre political dissidents. NBA shouldn’t pander to authoritarians.

What are you going to say next, that the Chinese aren’t ready for Western style democracy?

:roll:


So what is your proposed solution to handle this? To me this is a complicated matter because the Chinese is intertwined in all types of relations with the United States, so you have to tread carefully. Keep in mind that they are superpower as well and are no pushover country.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#265 » by 13th Man » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:34 pm

Why should the burden be placed on the United States to straighten out China's humanitarian problems? Is the USA the only country impacted by this?
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#266 » by clyde21 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:35 pm

13th Man wrote:
Promezclan wrote:
13th Man wrote:
You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?

Man, working overtime today, I see.

Just because you have a perspective doesn't mean it's valid. Slavery, genital mutilation, foot binding etc. are common cultural practices, but the Western perspective is just more enlightened.

There are also universal declarations of human rights that bring genocide, for example, under international law.

And, of course, the Chinese made a treaty agreement with the UK to maintain 50 years of a separate system with basic human rights in Hong Kong, before quickly closing all independent book stores, censoring media, banning politicians, abducting/disappearing people, and now extraditing Hong Kongers to the kangaroo courts (if you're lucky) of the Mainland, etc.

And it's a simple fact that the United States doesn't agree with you that all possible perspectives are equally valid. It has a very specific public (clandestine is another story, of course) policy of promoting democracy and human rights.


I will admit that you know more about Chinese history than I do, I try to keep my arguments at simplistic level. So do you think it is the responsibility of the U.S. to keep the China in line wrt humanitarian issues? Isn't that what the United Nations is for?

Personally, I don't think that it's fair to place the burden on the NBA or even the USA to try to keep them in check.


united nations? united nations is pretty damn useless

but really, that's kind of the US fault for making the United Nations useless and irrelevant, undermining every single resolution that comes out of there if it goes against American narratives

Israel has violated hundreds of UN resolutions with impunity lol
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#267 » by sikma42 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:36 pm

Most dont think beyond the dopamine hit theg get from typing some silly statement on an anonymous forum...
13th Man wrote:
wco81 wrote:
13th Man wrote:
You're seeing this from a western perspective. It's their country, who are you to tell them how it should be run?


No I’m looking at it from a human perspective.

Govts shouldn’t massacre political dissidents. NBA shouldn’t pander to authoritarians.

What are you going to say next, that the Chinese aren’t ready for Western style democracy?

:roll:


So what is your proposed solution to handle this? To me this is a complicated matter because the Chinese is intertwined in all types of relations with the United States, so you have to tread carefully. Keep in mind that they are superpower as well and are no pushover country.


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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#268 » by KnicksGadfly » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:37 pm

Leave it. The Chinese fans know the CBA is shat. They'll still watch NBA games.

-Foreigner in China
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#269 » by samir7maher » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:38 pm

13th Man wrote:Why should the burden be placed on the United States to straighten out China's humanitarian problems? Is the USA the only country impacted by this?



thats not the point
the point is can an other nation or company restricted the free speech of people in the usa ( or any other free nation)?
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#270 » by GrandTheftRondo » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:39 pm

ElodyTamTam wrote:LOL @ all the US imperialists calling China "authoritarian". LOL @ the same old trite "human rights" card being played once more when NBA teams periodically wear camo. Your terrorist soldiers killed over 10 million (and counting) Arab civilians in less than 30 years, your beloved NBA teams think that's something worth celebrating... but of course the problem is China, right?
Can't wait for the day you get fed your own medicine.

China is a disgrace of a country. Quit being in denial.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#271 » by samir7maher » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:41 pm

knicksh20b wrote:Leave it. The Chinese fans know the CBA is shat. They'll still watch NBA games.

-Foreigner in China



if you really are in china you know thatthe central government can order tencent just not 2 carry the games.

people can still watch it by illegal streams but the nba doesnt earn anything from illegal streams
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#272 » by ratul » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:41 pm

I'd say something snarky about China but I am pretty sure someone is listening into my tv set.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#273 » by 13th Man » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:46 pm

samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:Why should the burden be placed on the United States to straighten out China's humanitarian problems? Is the USA the only country impacted by this?



thats not the point
the point is can an other nation or company restricted the free speech of people in the usa ( or any other free nation)?


It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#274 » by samir7maher » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:48 pm

13th Man wrote:
samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:Why should the burden be placed on the United States to straighten out China's humanitarian problems? Is the USA the only country impacted by this?



thats not the point
the point is can an other nation or company restricted the free speech of people in the usa ( or any other free nation)?


It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?


when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#275 » by 13th Man » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:50 pm

samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:
samir7maher wrote:

thats not the point
the point is can an other nation or company restricted the free speech of people in the usa ( or any other free nation)?


It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?


when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??


Again, it comes down to business. You hurt your partner's reputation, there may be consequences. I don't know the legal implications of what they're doing but asked me if they do something like this and so far it appears to me that they can.
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#276 » by sikma42 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:51 pm

samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:
samir7maher wrote:

thats not the point
the point is can an other nation or company restricted the free speech of people in the usa ( or any other free nation)?


It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?


when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??
Technically speaking its not a restriction on free speech. There was no US government action restricting the speech. The NBA didnt have to react the way it did, but made a business decision. Thats not the same as not having an option.

I think many here seem ignorant as to how much of a power China is economically...Maybe this situation will open some eyes

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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#277 » by samir7maher » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:52 pm

13th Man wrote:
samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:
It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?


when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??


Again, it comes down to business. You hurt your partner's reputation, there may be consequences. I don't know the legal implications of what they're doing but asked me if they do something like this and so far it appears to me that they can.



so your saying freedom of speech for employees doesnt excist if it hurts the business of the employer??

so if i company x decide that for example gay rights are off limit. does that mean that all my employees cant say anything about it
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#278 » by sikma42 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:54 pm

Free speech deals with government interferance. You would be protected by other legislation in that instance...
samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:
samir7maher wrote:
when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??


Again, it comes down to business. You hurt your partner's reputation, there may be consequences. I don't know the legal implications of what they're doing but asked me if they do something like this and so far it appears to me that they can.



so your saying freedom of speech for employees doesnt excist if it hurts the business of the employer??

so if i company x decide that for example gay rights are off limit. does that mean that all my employees cant say anything about it


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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#279 » by inmate347 » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:54 pm

Where are all the black protest shirts? Anyone wearing them? Any players threatening to sit out if the nba continues to capitulate?
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Re: China Cancels G League Games 

Post#280 » by samir7maher » Mon Oct 7, 2019 11:56 pm

sikma42 wrote:
samir7maher wrote:
13th Man wrote:
It's business. The believe that Morey's opinion represents that of the Rockets and the NBA.

Are you allowed to bash your employer (or entity closely tied to your employer) publicly without repercussion?


when has china ( or any other nation ) has become the employer of all people working for the nba or the teams??
Technically speaking its not a restriction on free speech. There was no US government action restricting the speech. The NBA didnt have to react the way it did, but made a business decision. Thats not the same as not having an option.

I think many here seem ignorant as to how much of a power China is economically...Maybe this situation will open some eyes

Sent from my SM-N960U using RealGM mobile app



i fully understand the economic power of china and i understand that the nba is in a difficult position.
But an uber woke league like the nba for exampling pulling the all star game out of charlotte etc etc
so they themself set the bar that the nba is a place you can speak your mind about things you find offensive.

but when china says 1 thing they pull back really scared that means all those words about justice etc etc where pure theater and had no meaning.

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