How bad did LeBron damage his legacy?

Frosty · Post #281 » by **Frosty** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:27 pm

It may actually help him in the long run. If they cruised to it with little competition then people would of course say they colluded on getting a ring. Now it makes it look like they actually have to work for it.

Post #282 » by **Next Coming** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:27 pm

He's damaged his legacy. I don't know how anyone can say different.

For a guy who just came off winning 2 MVP's, was considered the best player on the planet and was favored to win in the Finals.

He was outscored by Jason Terry in a 6 game series. HE WAS OUTSCORED BY JASON TERRY!

bakafool · Post #283 » by **bakafool** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:29 pm

He already damaged his legacy by bolting Cleveland to join Wade and Bosh. Took the easy way out.

Kobblehead · Post #284 » by **Kobblehead** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:36 pm

LeBron was never the best player on the planet. Kobe was. Now that Kobe is fading out slowly but surely, Durant and Rose are poised to be the best players on the planet. LeBron will end his career without ever being the best player in the league.

Cognitivebias · Post #285 » by **Cognitivebias** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:37 pm

Kobblehead wrote:LeBron was never the best player on the planet. Kobe was. Now that Kobe is fading out slowly but surely, Durant and Rose are poised to be the best players on the planet. LeBron will end his career without ever being the best player in the league.

If you honestly believe this to be true, and are not writing it in order to gain some fame on these boards because of a bold statement, I feel for you.

LLJ · Post #286 » by **LLJ** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:49 pm

Not much, the real damage was done last year. People hated him after last summer so they weren't disappointed that he shat the bed, they were glad. One of these years (probably next year) they'll win it against competition that LeBron can handle who will let him barrel through the lane and do his thing. And they'll hate him in a sorta respectful way again after his first win.

But it's difficult to be disappointed in someone you never liked in the first place.

USA · Post #287 » by **USA** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:50 pm

His legacy is that of an egotistical, self-centered douche bag and he did no damage to that.

Hon-essim · Post #288 » by **Hon-essim** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 4:26 pm

Kobe/Malone/Jordan/Shaq/Isaiah/Deshawn Stevenson was an egostistical, self-centered douche bag and they were badasses for it.

Lebron isn't even sniffing the ass these days considering Rashard Lewis stole his girl. He couldn't even make up for it in the post conference. There is no area where Lebron's legacy is undamaged. Even guys insulting him make the mistake of complimenting him recently.

Illmatic21 · Post #289 » by **Illmatic21** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 4:55 pm

GreenHat wrote:By the end of his career it won't matter as much, people won't even remember it.

Kobe has had a couple of bad series before (including in the finals). Thats comparable to Lebron this series. He won after that and now no one really cares.

Even MJ lost a winnable series (against Orlando) even though he played really well. Thats comparable to Lebron in previous seasons. He won after that and now no one really cares.

Jerry West lost in all 7 of his first Finals SERIES (not games). Thats not even comparable to Lebron losing in his first two Finals. He won after that and now no one cares.

If Lebron wins a couple of titles in the future, only the haters will care that they lost this series and he played poorly.

First of all, Lebron's level of underperformance is in a different stratosphere from anything those guys ever did.

Secondly, there was no social media or media circus around for them. Lebron's failures were well publicized and everyone on Facebook, Twitter, messageboards, ESPN, etc etc got in on the action. Last night was the most watched Game 6 in NBA history. So to think that this will just "go away" is flat out wrong. Maybe if he wins at least three championships and is the clear cut Finals MVP each time, but I don't see that happening..

Coda · Post #290 » by **Coda** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 5:59 pm

rottenzombie wrote:
Coda wrote:What legacy? Honestly, what legacy does Lebron have? He doesn't have a legacy yet. Did Karl Malone (I actually love Malone) ruin his legacy when he didn't win the title after joining up with Shaq and Kobe? Nope. Tell me about the legacy of Sir Charles? Only champions truely have a legacy. Lebron isn't a champion. Maybe someday, but not yet. So far Lebron is a brand and a celebrity. People act like he is Jordan or something. Jordan was cold blooded winner and a champion many times over. Jordan became a brand by winning. Lebron seems to feel pressure to win to maintain his brand. This series hurt that brand. It didn't however hurt his legacy because he doesn't have a legacy yet.

Don't be silly.

Of course Malone has legacy, for his longevity, commitment to basketball, professionalism and that unforgettable PnR with Stockton, which was truly one of basketball's most memorable plays.

Sir Charles has a legacy, a legacy of determination, of gutsy performance (remember that "I can rest when I am dead?), of going up days in and days out against opponents taller than him.

You don't need a championship to have legacy, but championships enhance your legacy as a basketball player. If only championship matters, why don't we rename basketball as championshipball?

I get what you are saying. There is a great history to the game and also of its stars. I have been a huge NBA fan for 20 plus years and have also painfully cheered for the Timberwolves for all of that time. Karl and Charles have been my favorite players outside of KG (of course).

Lebron will have a story. We won't forget Lebron, his prep career, his potential as prospect , the years with the Cavs, the media circus that surrounded "The Decision," or his desire to be a global brand. I just don't believe you can us the word legacy to describe a players career unless they are a winner. Lebron has yet to win anything.

Second best is REALLY good. They will have a story. They can't however ruin their legacy because they don't have one. Lebron had a brand that is so strong that people confuse it for a legacy.

To put it another way, what could the Buffalo Bills do to ruin their legacy?

Post #291 » by **5DOM** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:03 pm

Galis4 wrote:
5DOM wrote:Couldn't even be the Pippen to Wade

I can't wait to see next year people saying after a win against Raptors, with Lebron's 48 points that he's learned from his mistakes and he is gonna be the next MJ etc etc....

Even 32 y/o Eddie House scored 35 points on us. 48 points is nothing.

magic1fan · Post #292 » by **magic1fan** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:16 pm

Hon-essim wrote:
redux46 wrote:Jordan never performed this badly in a finals series. Kobe, despite having some poor performances could never be accused of giving up in a game.

The way Lebron lost this series is an argument that even the most die hard fanboi is going to have problems answering in future GOAT debates.

Kobe was accused plenty of times for legit reasons. His series against Phoenix. This playoffs.

Kobe was pretty well known for this so it's not because Lebron quit alone. It's because he had the biggest breakdown - the biggest letdown - the biggest disappearing act in a superstar + a stacked team on top of that...

Here, I'll phrase it in Lebron terms:

Not Jordan (#1 star for his team), Not Kobe (#2 star for his team), Not KG (#3 star for his team), Not Carter (#4 star on Orlando), Not Havlicek (arguable #5 star on Boston), NOT King (0 rings), NOT Webber (lesser breakdown)

If Lebron does multiple bone headed moves, he could go down multiple times in all time rankings.

being accussed and actually doing it are two different things. kobe never quit in a playoff. this year the entire team ran out of gas,kind of understanable when you are coming off of three straight trips to the finals.

bballmaniac27 · Post #293 » by **bballmaniac27** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:16 pm

His legacy is permanently damaged unless he wins multiple rings as the man. Doesn't matter how many rings he wins as the second option.

triplet1984 · Post #294 » by **triplet1984** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:18 pm

Lebron James is not the best player in the NBA. That's the damage to his legacy unless he comes through big time and wins his team a title.

Jo Jo English · Post #295 » by **Jo Jo English** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:31 pm

I don't know if he actually did any further damage to his legacy, but he sure cemented the legacy that was already in place.

I still think it is possible for him to turn around his image in the eyes of many NBA fans. Not all, mind you, but many.

LeBron needs desperately to hire an adviser or two, not his high school buddies, to give him guidance on how to shape his public image. If he were to do that, and the Heat eventually win a title or two, which they obviously have the talent to do (and I expect they eventually will), his image could do a 180 in relatively quick fashion.

But first he needs to become a bit humbled and realize things needs to change. Time will tell if he ever does.

StartingBench · Post #296 » by **StartingBench** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:47 pm

He's only 25, he still has a lot of time to turn it around.

sanity · Post #297 » by **sanity** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:58 pm

He should have put a bit of money into getting PR training. Dude constantly puts his foot in his mouth and isn't even aware of it. He's obviously not trying to be disliked, but being the villain isn't going to help his situation--and certainly won't help attract seasoned vets to play for the minimum for his team. People are onto his demeanor and having well-respected dudes like Dirk call his ass immature catches on with other players.

We wake up to our everyday lives, but we're the ones paying his salary. This isn't wrestling for gods sake so it isn't asking much for these athletes to be a bit more sincere about the amazing situation they're in instead of having to be regular joes like most of us. As much as a jerkoff Bryant was before he 'matured' after Shaq left, he never stooped to such lows. He always had a certain level of respect for the sport and how much it meant to the fans. With James, I just don't see that. It looks as if he feels fans owe him.

Moggs24 · Post #298 » by **Moggs24** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 7:02 pm

Just as much damage Dirk did by choking from 2006 through 2010. It is a what have you done for me lately league. After the chicago series Lebron was better than jordan, than he was a bad series now apparently he sucks. Let's wait to his career is over to judge him.

P.S Dirk was always good.

Biohazard · Post #299 » by **Biohazard** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 7:13 pm

Scottie Pippen was a better role player who helped win championships. So his legacy is a joke

D Nice · Post #300 » by **D Nice** » Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:41 pm

Trolls need to stop comparing Lebron's failings to Kobe's in the finals. Kobe's finals experiences came either at a younger age, injured, playing an all-time defense, or some combination of the 3. And you can ask any Laker fan from here to the hills, we never questioned Kobe's effort or will to win the game. Even if he was screwing up, he was trying, huffing, puffing, and pissed if/when we did lose.

Even discounting all of the numbers and competition, the way Kobe handled himself innumerably separated him from this dunse.