ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0

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Who wins the series?

Cavs in 4
130
73%
Cavs in 5
13
7%
Cavs in 6
4
2%
Cavs in 7
1
1%
Raptors in 6
2
1%
Raptors in 7
28
16%
 
Total votes: 178

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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2841 » by LightTheBeam » Tue May 8, 2018 2:44 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:
Splashin wrote:
2007 spurs and 2011 Mavs 100x better than any team MJ faced? Nice try guy.


Lol nice cherry pick chief.

The warriors and spurs are 100x tougher than Jordan ever faced in the finals. But nice attempt at picking arguably his 2 weakest opponents



The Spurs team that had a 37 year old Tim Duncan a 22 year old Kawhi and went 7 games in round 1 as the #1 seed? Just because they smashed Lebron's team don't make them tougher. The Warriors basically came out of nowhere. They won 47 games and then the next year won 67 games with same team. Basically like the Cavs team from 2008 to 2009.


Lol 37 year old Duncan was still putting up 15/10 with great advanced stats. 22 year old Kawhi won finals MVP. Tony parker averaged 18ppg in the finals, and Manu averaged 15. They were also coached by the greatest coach of all time and were 10 deep.

Its **** pointless having a conversation with a troll who tries to discredit the spurs with meaningless numbers. Either you didn't watch the series, or you blanked out just how great the spurs were to protect your father figure Michael Jordan.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE 3-0 

Post#2842 » by Jadoogar » Tue May 8, 2018 2:44 pm

diamondsfinest wrote:
IbakasD wrote:
diamondsfinest wrote:
Well that would give

Lowry FVV
Miles Wright/Powell
Leonard Anunoby
Gasol/Ibaka
Val/Gasol/Noguiera

which could be a better team. Depending on what is exactly traded. Leonard is one of the greatest perimeter defenders to ever exist, wanna stop Lebron? Put Leonard on him. Could actually turn the tables.

It all depends how much Masai can work his voodoo magic like getting a #9 for Bargnani. Thats some serious mind games. I mean this is San Antonio.

Lol that team will get destroyed by healthy Boston,
Cleveland, Philly.


Depends on who's coach. Should I remind you we were running the Cavs out of the building in game 1 until they started outcoaching us and everyone gave up. We erased a ten point deficit without Derozan, could be another addition by subtraction. The defence alone of Leonard to Derozan is enough to turn the tides in some cases.


Game 1 is not on coaching. We got good shots. It's not the coach's fault that we went 1/18 on mostly good looks. It's not on Casey that JV missed like 1000 layups. It's not Casey's fault that Demar refuses to play defense.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE 3-0 

Post#2843 » by diamondsfinest » Tue May 8, 2018 3:04 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
diamondsfinest wrote:
IbakasD wrote:Lol that team will get destroyed by healthy Boston,
Cleveland, Philly.


Depends on who's coach. Should I remind you we were running the Cavs out of the building in game 1 until they started outcoaching us and everyone gave up. We erased a ten point deficit without Derozan, could be another addition by subtraction. The defence alone of Leonard to Derozan is enough to turn the tides in some cases.


Game 1 is not on coaching. We got good shots. It's not the coach's fault that we went 1/18 on mostly good looks. It's not on Casey that JV missed like 1000 layups. It's not Casey's fault that Demar refuses to play defense.


by this point, the play-calling and defensive effort is on the coach. They've had 3 years to prepare.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2844 » by Mylie10 » Tue May 8, 2018 3:41 pm

As much as I like Derozen and Lowry, neither one of them is a stone cold killer.

I would not blow this team up, but they have to find a killer. You can't win in this League without them. So use Derozen and Lowry to make a move and bring in some will.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2845 » by RaptorsLife » Tue May 8, 2018 4:01 pm

Gonna be rooting for Sixers or Celtics against Cavs not cus i dislike LeBron. I love LeBron but the whole narrative Toronto is LeBron is unbeatable and we didn't lose cus Raptors are trash

Would love nothing more to see a team with roziar and horford beat them and I can laugh
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2846 » by RaptorsLife » Tue May 8, 2018 4:10 pm

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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2847 » by bb22 » Tue May 8, 2018 4:30 pm

MrSparkle wrote:
gp2015 wrote:Any argument that the Raptors are any good is out the window when you get swept in the second round with 2 blowouts.

Any team worth a damn will not let that happen.


Well, same thing happened to Atlanta. I don’t think they handled the situation well by nuking it. They hung onto the wrong guy instead of trading high (Schroeder). Ainge is good at selling high (doing 2 steps back 3 forward), although it ends up being better in the short-term anyway.

Right now they need to rebuild trade value, so as painful as it is, imo they should mainly stand pt and stress internal improvement unless hot deals come up.


Ya I agree. But if Derozan didn’t stink it up completely against the cavs, I think the raps could have dealt him for some nice pieces this offseason. I’ve never trusted Derozan, they should have sold his stock when it was highest (last year). They also have to move JV somehow cuz that type of C cannot serve a major role on any contender.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2848 » by bmurph128 » Tue May 8, 2018 4:49 pm

AdagioPace wrote:is there a worse team historically than Toronto among those with a SRS > 7 ?

the 2007 Mavs at least had a superstar and honestly they were a bit unlucky matchup wise



I mean, the Raptors were more than a bit unlucky match up wise.

The Mavs were definitely worse. They lost to an 8 seed.

In the Raptors case, sure, match ups played a part - but they were playing against the best player in the NBA.

This came out of nowhere - I didn't see a sweep coming. And obviously LeBron's game 2 was insane. This was a big legacy boost for LeBron. I haven't researched it yet, but I'm not sure how often a team with a 7+ SRS has even been swept. Possibly the Magic in the finals, but I'll have to check. With how hard some people are trying to discredit the Raptors and how many anti LeBron posters are coming out of the woodwork, I can feel him moving closer to Jordan. Not there yet, but getting closer.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2849 » by JordansBulls » Tue May 8, 2018 4:58 pm

RipPizzaGuy wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:
Lol nice cherry pick chief.

The warriors and spurs are 100x tougher than Jordan ever faced in the finals. But nice attempt at picking arguably his 2 weakest opponents



The Spurs team that had a 37 year old Tim Duncan a 22 year old Kawhi and went 7 games in round 1 as the #1 seed? Just because they smashed Lebron's team don't make them tougher. The Warriors basically came out of nowhere. They won 47 games and then the next year won 67 games with same team. Basically like the Cavs team from 2008 to 2009.


Lol 37 year old Duncan was still putting up 15/10 with great advanced stats. 22 year old Kawhi won finals MVP. Tony parker averaged 18ppg in the finals, and Manu averaged 15. They were also coached by the greatest coach of all time and were 10 deep.

Its **** pointless having a conversation with a troll who tries to discredit the spurs with meaningless numbers. Either you didn't watch the series, or you blanked out just how great the spurs were to protect your father figure Michael Jordan.


So why is it when Lebron goes against a 37 year old it is considered they are they still good and great players, but when Lebron had a 37 year old Shaq he is talked about as ancient when he won the allstar game mvp the year before and outplayed Lebron in pivotal game 5 of the series when Cavs had HCA?
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2850 » by Freighttrain » Tue May 8, 2018 5:10 pm

This is lowkey funny, wanted to post it before this thread is locked :lol:

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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2851 » by LightTheBeam » Tue May 8, 2018 5:28 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:

The Spurs team that had a 37 year old Tim Duncan a 22 year old Kawhi and went 7 games in round 1 as the #1 seed? Just because they smashed Lebron's team don't make them tougher. The Warriors basically came out of nowhere. They won 47 games and then the next year won 67 games with same team. Basically like the Cavs team from 2008 to 2009.


Lol 37 year old Duncan was still putting up 15/10 with great advanced stats. 22 year old Kawhi won finals MVP. Tony parker averaged 18ppg in the finals, and Manu averaged 15. They were also coached by the greatest coach of all time and were 10 deep.

Its **** pointless having a conversation with a troll who tries to discredit the spurs with meaningless numbers. Either you didn't watch the series, or you blanked out just how great the spurs were to protect your father figure Michael Jordan.


So why is it when Lebron goes against a 37 year old it is considered they are they still good and great players, but when Lebron had a 37 year old Shaq he is talked about as ancient when he won the allstar game mvp the year before and outplayed Lebron in pivotal game 5 of the series when Cavs had HCA?


Did you watch Shaq and Duncan at their respective 37 year old years? If so that should be an easy answer.

And how does that have anything to do with my argument. Strawman.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE 3-0 

Post#2852 » by Jadoogar » Tue May 8, 2018 5:43 pm

diamondsfinest wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
diamondsfinest wrote:
Depends on who's coach. Should I remind you we were running the Cavs out of the building in game 1 until they started outcoaching us and everyone gave up. We erased a ten point deficit without Derozan, could be another addition by subtraction. The defence alone of Leonard to Derozan is enough to turn the tides in some cases.


Game 1 is not on coaching. We got good shots. It's not the coach's fault that we went 1/18 on mostly good looks. It's not on Casey that JV missed like 1000 layups. It's not Casey's fault that Demar refuses to play defense.


by this point, the play-calling and defensive effort is on the coach. They've had 3 years to prepare.


I'll agree on defense (kind off, Lebron has destroyed every East defense for like 10 years) but what was wrong with the offense. We made the right pass, took open shots, got offense rebounds. We just missed everything, that's not on coaching.

For example, the final FVV shot was a wide open three. Followed by Demar miss in the paint, followed by JV bricking a point blank tip in. How many times have we seen Demar chuck a contested jumper late in the game? He made the correct passes yet we couldn't capitalize.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2853 » by TeamTragic » Tue May 8, 2018 8:20 pm

There is no chance Lebron leaves the East. What exactly would be the benefit? Don't forget that the Cavaliers nearly lost in the first round against the Pacers. They played terrible in that series and had help from the refs.

Just putting this into perspective. Raptors are in trouble for the unforeseeable future. I don't see Lebron dealing with Harden/Paul. If he does leave I think that the Sixers have a good shot.

EDIT: Raptors should fire Casey and listen to offers for DeRozan
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2854 » by yoyoboy » Tue May 8, 2018 8:58 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:

The Spurs team that had a 37 year old Tim Duncan a 22 year old Kawhi and went 7 games in round 1 as the #1 seed? Just because they smashed Lebron's team don't make them tougher. The Warriors basically came out of nowhere. They won 47 games and then the next year won 67 games with same team. Basically like the Cavs team from 2008 to 2009.


Lol 37 year old Duncan was still putting up 15/10 with great advanced stats. 22 year old Kawhi won finals MVP. Tony parker averaged 18ppg in the finals, and Manu averaged 15. They were also coached by the greatest coach of all time and were 10 deep.

Its **** pointless having a conversation with a troll who tries to discredit the spurs with meaningless numbers. Either you didn't watch the series, or you blanked out just how great the spurs were to protect your father figure Michael Jordan.


So why is it when Lebron goes against a 37 year old it is considered they are they still good and great players, but when Lebron had a 37 year old Shaq he is talked about as ancient when he won the allstar game mvp the year before and outplayed Lebron in pivotal game 5 of the series when Cavs had HCA?

Because Duncan was a very good player at 37 and Shaq was terrible, lazy, and out of shape. It's not that complicated and it's very ridiculous that the anti-LeBron crowd brings up Shaq as if he was only marginally worse than threepeat Shaq. We see the agenda and you're not fooling anybody. One was a guy who led the league in DRPM and helped anchor a historically good defense his last year in the league. The other was a defensive liability who clogged driving lanes yet could still put up points on the board despite actively hurting the team.

Why are you bringing up the All Star Game MVP? Why should we care about a meaningless exhibition game and more importantly why do you value it over an 82 games regular season and entire postseason's worth of games that actually matter?

And bringing up Game 5...okay? That was LeBron's worst game of the playoffs. Even with him having a terrible shooting night and Shaq putting up 21 in his best game of the postseason, they saw nowhere near the same defensive attention as LeBron was double or triple teamed every time he went to the basket while Shaq got easy lay ins largely created from LeBron's gravity. But again, it's one throwback game for Shaq and an off night for LeBron yet you expect us to say, "Oh well that settles it, LeBron clearly had enough help to beat the Big 3 Celtics because he had 'prime Shaq' and Mo Williams!" FYI, LeBron's on-off in the 2010 playoffs was +23.2 while Shaq's was -8.3. Once again...Shaq was a bad player by that point.

Also, I find it amusing that when other players are injured - namely a guy like Curry in recent years - he gets all the excuses in the world made for him. Yet LeBron had a serious elbow injury in the 2010 playoffs that even caused him to shoot a free throw left handed at the very end of the Bulls series and affected him against Boston, but nobody cares.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE 3-0 

Post#2855 » by diamondsfinest » Tue May 8, 2018 9:16 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
diamondsfinest wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
Game 1 is not on coaching. We got good shots. It's not the coach's fault that we went 1/18 on mostly good looks. It's not on Casey that JV missed like 1000 layups. It's not Casey's fault that Demar refuses to play defense.


by this point, the play-calling and defensive effort is on the coach. They've had 3 years to prepare.


I'll agree on defense (kind off, Lebron has destroyed every East defense for like 10 years) but what was wrong with the offense. We made the right pass, took open shots, got offense rebounds. We just missed everything, that's not on coaching.

For example, the final FVV shot was a wide open three. Followed by Demar miss in the paint, followed by JV bricking a point blank tip in. How many times have we seen Demar chuck a contested jumper late in the game? He made the correct passes yet we couldn't capitalize.


well here's why we lost. Guess how that play started? A lowry and FVV screen on Derozan, which created NO room, causing Derozan to fumble the ball, forcing him to give it up to a guy with a hurt right shoulder.

Yeah wonder what went wrong.

Lol this is why no real NBA player takes the Raptors seriously, Raptors don't know how to win.
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2856 » by +2number4+ » Tue May 8, 2018 10:21 pm

Now I'd like to hear it from those who kept pulling out metrics left & right trying to prove how it's gonna be different this time for the Raptors especially in going up against LeBron.

I remember the Raptors trying so hard to get to 60W and everybody around here thought it was pointless. Now it all make sense. It was the closest thing to championship they could get. :lol:
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Re: ECSF: P3 | (1) Toronto Raptors vs Cleveland Cavaliers (4) | CLE wins 4-0 

Post#2857 » by jason bourne » Tue May 8, 2018 10:49 pm

RipPizzaGuy wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:
jason bourne wrote:
First, you want an apology from the Raps fans who razzed you. Okay, you were right and they were wrong. I kinda held my breath because LeBron has owned the Raps before. However, how can you say after that LeBron is the GOAT when he beat up a team that he's used to beating up? LeBron has got to get past the teams like the Celtics and the winners out of the WCF. Then he'll finally have the 4th ring which puts him into the HOF winners circle. You're putting the cart before the horse.


Agreed!! He couldn't even beat prime Dwight. Even Kobe did that. Kobe even beat Prime Duncan as well, while Lebron had to have some luck to beat old Duncan due to Ray Allen.


Lol it's always Jordan/Kobe fans putting lebron down. You make it seem as if those Kobe/lebron teams are on equal levels. One team had Ilgauskas/Andy/Moe Williams while the other had Gasol/bynum/Ariza or artest/fisher.

In other words Cavs were a 20 win team without lebron, while the lakers still would have made the playoffs with Kobe.

Lebron has faced 100x tougher finals opponents than Jordan ever did. (And I'm actually a bigger fan of 90s basketball) but its evident teams just weren't as stacked as they are now days.


Sure, MJ is the real GOAT. Not like LeBron. I would put Tim Duncan ahead of LeBron as someone in the discussion for GOAT. Same with Kobe and Shaq. These are newest members in that rare club along with Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Bird, Russell and Hakeem. You readily forget that Kyrie didn't want to play with LeBron last season and gave up a chance at a supermax deal to get away from him. It means LeBron is too selfish with the glory. He's been the one to go to other teams in order to get his ring and he'll probably do that if he fails this year. That's not to say he can't reach the top, but he has to get into the discussion first. Usually, for Hall of Famers that takes 4 rings. Most of the guys I mentioned are there. There are other criteria, too, which you do not even mention. You're already giving it to LeBron after the 2nd round victory over the Raptors ha ha.
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