Nick Nurse Is Overrated

[cupcakesnake]

Nick Nurse is a top 2 coach in this league.

You're holding up the tiniest scrap of negativity and being like: is this heavier than the mountain of evidence that Nurse is a great coach?

The answer is no.

top 2 might be a stretch.

No, it is 100% a stretch

I had him top 2 for a while. Hard to have there right now during this Sixers travesty and with time dragging by and Nurse not having another positive indicator, there's other coach's that deserve credit more if we're doing rankings.

These things are always in flux and we're constantly changing our opinions on coaches and players as their careers progress. Nurse is kind of on the back burner for me right now, because it's hard to assess a coach in this situation and it's not like Nurse is making lemonade right now.

I've already responded to another poster about who I'd currently rank ahead of him. Nurse also hasn't coached long enough where it's like Pop or Carlisle where I give them the benefit of the doubt when they're coaching bad teams. Nurse would need at least one more impressive coaching job for me to give him that benefit of the doubt. It's just hard to look at his coaching right now when there's a million other things happening. Embiid being injured to the point he's a massive negative when he plays. 6 total minutes played by their big 3. Ice cold 3-point shooting luck. It's just kind of a perfect storm in Phili right now so I don't even know where to start in terms of coaching analysis.

Anyways, I'm kind of done talking with Nurse. There are a lot more interesting coaches to talk about right now. We can make a new Nurse thread when there's something interesting to say but right now we're just beating a dead horse, imo.

[DusterBuster]

If the Sixers stay on their current trajectory, I wouldn't be surprised to see Nurse fired by the deadline.

[Jabroni Lames]

Nick Nurse is a top 2 coach in this league.

You're holding up the tiniest scrap of negativity and being like: is this heavier than the mountain of evidence that Nurse is a great coach?

The answer is no.

top 2 might be a stretch.

No, it is 100% a stretch

I had him top 2 for a while. Hard to have there right now during this Sixers travesty and with time dragging by and Nurse not having another positive indicator, there's other coach's that deserve credit more if we're doing rankings.

These things are always in flux and we're constantly changing our opinions on coaches and players as their careers progress. Nurse is kind of on the back burner for me right now, because it's hard to assess a coach in this situation and it's not like Nurse is making lemonade right now.

I've already responded to another poster about who I'd currently rank ahead of him. Nurse also hasn't coached long enough where it's like Pop or Carlisle where I give them the benefit of the doubt when they're coaching bad teams. Nurse would need at least one more impressive coaching job for me to give him that benefit of the doubt. It's just hard to look at his coaching right now when there's a million other things happening. Embiid being injured to the point he's a massive negative when he plays. 6 total minutes played by their big 3. Ice cold 3-point shooting luck. It's just kind of a perfect storm in Phili right now so I don't even know where to start in terms of coaching analysis.

Anyways, I'm kind of done talking with Nurse. There are a lot more interesting coaches to talk about right now. We can make a new Nurse thread when there's something interesting to say but right now we're just beating a dead horse, imo.

"Nurse also hasn't coached long enough where it's like Pop or Carlisle where I give them the benefit of the doubt when they're coaching bad teams.

^^^

And yet this is exactly what you and others have been doing for the last 5 years. It's all over this thread, i.e., putting Nurse on top 5, top 3, top 2 coaching lists for winning 1 (just 1) luck-assisted chip... taking over a 59-win team that upgraded to 2 HoFs (Kawhi & Gasol) and never facing Lebron or KD in the playoffs.

Anyways, it looks like people are finally seeing the reality of Nurse (i.e. highly overrated).... so my work is probably done here. The OP has come full cirlce.

[Larry_Russell]

Nurse has been given a bunch of credit for coaching super scrappy Toronto teams, but Masai just build super scrappy teams as evidenced by their play since Nurse left.

[Crunch 99]

Reduce Embiid's role.

To this armchair quarterback, Nurse and the training staff need to make a big adjustment to how they use Embiid. Embiid is coming off a season with a career high 34.6 ppg, 21.8 fga and 38.7 usg%, along with his 4th highest mpg at 33.6, only 1 mpg off his highest mpg, but he was only able to play 39 games. Nurse acts like he thinks Embiid can play and get back to those minutes and fga. This season when he came back, Nurse ramped up his minutes and fga to the last game where he played 35 minutes and took 21 shots. Then his knee(s) swelled up and he hasn't played since.

Play him considerably fewer mpg, share the fga with Maxey, McCain and George, and they've got a chance to have him suit up more frequently and get more wins. Just a wag from the peanut gallery.

[Jabroni Lames]

Reduce Embiid's role.

To this armchair quarterback, Nurse and the training staff need to make a big adjustment to how they use Embiid. Embiid is coming off a season with a career high 34.6 ppg, 21.8 fga and 38.7 usg%, along with his 4th highest mpg at 33.6, only 1mpg off his highest mpg, but he was only able to play 39 games. Nurse acts like he thinks Embiid can play and get back to those minutes and fga. This season when he came back, Nurse ramped up his minutes and fga to the last game where he played 35 minutes and took 21 shots. Then his knee(s) swelled up and he hasn't played since.

Play him considerably fewer mpg, share the fga with Maxey, McCain and George, and they've got a chance to have him suit up more frequently and get more wins. Just a wag from the peanut gallery.

Speaking of Embiid's minutes... this does not get talked about enough. Nurse pro-actively decided last season (2023-24) to play Embiid more minutes and it backfired badly. Nurse ended Embiid's MVP level career in the same way that Thibs ended Derrick Rose.

Everyone is giving lip service to Adam Silver’s “the regular season matters — it really does” mantra this season. Well, at least until the season starts.

The latest is new 76ers coach Nick Nurse, who takes over a team with reigning MVP Joel Embiid — who played 66 games last season (enough to qualify for NBA post-season awards under the new CBA rules). Embiid played 68 the season before. But when Ky Carlin of Sixers Wire asked about Embiid and the league’s new resting policy, Nurse said he wants the MVP to play more games (hat tip Hoop Rumors).

“I think that we are looking at it maybe a little different than people think we might be. We’re trying to get him to play more games. Our goal is that it’s going up for him, not not the other direction, and some people would say, ‘Oh, that’s playoffs. Is he going to be?’ We’re just trying to get it going the other direction. I think that’s just what our people believe here that he can play and again, knock on wood, cross our fingers, all that stuff. There’s always things that can come up with that stuff, but I don’t know. I believe in the guys playing as much as they can and let’s see what happens.”

Nick Nurse sounds like he has been hanging out with Tyronn Lue this summer, talking about how the regular season is important.

All of this sounds good in the summer, but more often than not it’s the team, following the advice of their sports science/training staff who track exertion, that forces a player to load manage. It’s usually not the players themselves. These teams have massive investments in these players and want to avoid injuries — something far more likely to happen when a player is fatigued — plus have them ready for the playoffs. In the case of the 76ers (and Clippers), it does not matter if they get their stars to play more and win 58 regular season games if they get bounced in the first round of the playoffs. Ask the Bucks and Giannis Antetokounmpo how that feels. Fans are demanding both to see players more in the regular season and have the highest level of playoff performance, but those things do not necessarily go hand-in-hand.

Philly has two players who qualify for the league’s new “stars must play” designations, Embiid and James Harden — and who knows what will be happening with Harden. If Philly is going to get past the second round of the playoffs a lot of things have to go right, and one of them is a peak Embiid playing like an MVP, and getting him into position to do that should be the priority. Maybe that means playing more games. Maybe fewer.

While the first 82 games matter, it’s not where the 76ers season will be judged

https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/nick-nurse-on-joel-embiid-were-trying-to-get-him-to-play-more-games

[cupcakesnake]

Reduce Embiid's role.

To this armchair quarterback, Nurse and the training staff need to make a big adjustment to how they use Embiid. Embiid is coming off a season with a career high 34.6 ppg, 21.8 fga and 38.7 usg%, along with his 4th highest mpg at 33.6, only 1mpg off his highest mpg, but he was only able to play 39 games. Nurse acts like he thinks Embiid can play and get back to those minutes and fga. This season when he came back, Nurse ramped up his minutes and fga to the last game where he played 35 minutes and took 21 shots. Then his knee(s) swelled up and he hasn't played since.

Play him considerably fewer mpg, share the fga with Maxey, McCain and George, and they've got a chance to have him suit up more frequently and get more wins. Just a wag from the peanut gallery.

Speaking of Embiid's minutes... this does not get talked about enough. Nurse pro-actively decided last season (2023-24) to play Embiid more minutes and it backfired badly. Nurse ended Embiid's MVP level career in the same way that Thibs ended Derrick Rose.

Everyone is giving lip service to Adam Silver’s “the regular season matters — it really does” mantra this season. Well, at least until the season starts.

The latest is new 76ers coach Nick Nurse, who takes over a team with reigning MVP Joel Embiid — who played 66 games last season (enough to qualify for NBA post-season awards under the new CBA rules). Embiid played 68 the season before. But when Ky Carlin of Sixers Wire asked about Embiid and the league’s new resting policy, Nurse said he wants the MVP to play more games (hat tip Hoop Rumors).

“I think that we are looking at it maybe a little different than people think we might be. We’re trying to get him to play more games. Our goal is that it’s going up for him, not not the other direction, and some people would say, ‘Oh, that’s playoffs. Is he going to be?’ We’re just trying to get it going the other direction. I think that’s just what our people believe here that he can play and again, knock on wood, cross our fingers, all that stuff. There’s always things that can come up with that stuff, but I don’t know. I believe in the guys playing as much as they can and let’s see what happens.”

Nick Nurse sounds like he has been hanging out with Tyronn Lue this summer, talking about how the regular season is important.

All of this sounds good in the summer, but more often than not it’s the team, following the advice of their sports science/training staff who track exertion, that forces a player to load manage. It’s usually not the players themselves. These teams have massive investments in these players and want to avoid injuries — something far more likely to happen when a player is fatigued — plus have them ready for the playoffs. In the case of the 76ers (and Clippers), it does not matter if they get their stars to play more and win 58 regular season games if they get bounced in the first round of the playoffs. Ask the Bucks and Giannis Antetokounmpo how that feels. Fans are demanding both to see players more in the regular season and have the highest level of playoff performance, but those things do not necessarily go hand-in-hand.

Philly has two players who qualify for the league’s new “stars must play” designations, Embiid and James Harden — and who knows what will be happening with Harden. If Philly is going to get past the second round of the playoffs a lot of things have to go right, and one of them is a peak Embiid playing like an MVP, and getting him into position to do that should be the priority. Maybe that means playing more games. Maybe fewer.

While the first 82 games matter, it’s not where the 76ers season will be judged

https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/nick-nurse-on-joel-embiid-were-trying-to-get-him-to-play-more-games

This doesn't hold up to scrutiny considering Embiid played his lowest minutes per game in 3 years last year. Even before the injury, his minutes weren't up in any meaningful way. 34mpg before the injury that caused him to miss time.

And yet this is exactly what you and others have been doing for the last 5 years. It's all over this thread, i.e., putting Nurse on top 5, top 3, top 2 coaching lists for winning 1 (just 1) luck-assisted chip... taking over a 59-win team that upgraded to 2 HoFs (Kawhi & Gasol) and never facing Lebron or KD in the playoffs.

Anyways, it looks like people are finally seeing the reality of Nurse (i.e. highly overrated).... so my work is probably done here. The OP has come full cirlce

You just don't like Nurse man. You've never had any real analysis of his coaching strategy, you just talk about things narratively and repeat the same plot points over and over again. We get your opinion. I don't really begrudge you for it. I have random NBA characters I root against too. Congrats on getting your "work" done (by work I mean: bumping your own thread about a coach over and over again for a year).

[kingr]

Yes. But coaches need talent to win at the highest level. His main guys are in and out of the lineup consistently.

[Johnny Bball]

Barely one month into the season and this CBS Sports NBA coach ranking is completely outdated:

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/ranking-every-nba-coach-for-2024-25-season-jj-redick-at-the-bottom-pop-outside-top-10-and-no-1-in-own-tier/?utm_content=buffer7a45a&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer


Tier 9: We don't know enough
30. JJ Redick, Lakers
29. Brian Keefe, Wizards
28. Charles Lee, Hornets
27. Jordi Fernandez, Nets
26. Darko Rajakovic, Raptors

Tier 8: I wouldn't be enthused
25. Chauncey Billups, Trail Blazers
24. Billy Donovan, Bulls
23. JB Bickerstaff, Pistons
22. Doc Rivers, Bucks

Tier 7: You look promising, but it's still a tad early
21. Kenny Atkinson, Cavaliers
20. Willie Green, Pelicans
19. Jamahl Mosley, Magic

Tier 6: Middle of the road
18. Jason Kidd, Mavericks
17. Taylor Jenkins, Grizzlies
16. Quin Snyder, Hawks
15. Michael Malone, Nuggets

Tier 5: The living legend
14. Gregg Popovich, Spurs

Tier 4: Obvious floor-raisers
13. Mike Brown, Kings
12. Chris Finch, Timberwolves
11. Joe Mazzulla, Celtics
10. Tom Thibodeau, Knicks
9. Mike Budenholzer, Suns
8. Ime Udoka, Rockets

Tier 3: The Wunderkinds
7. Will Hardy, Jazz
6. Mark Daigneault, Thunder

Tier 2: The elites
5. Ty Lue, Clippers
4. Steve Kerr, Warriors
3. Rick Carlisle, Pacers
2. Nick Nurse, 76ers

Tier 1: The undisputed king
1. Erik Spoelstra, Heat

All this does is answer the question of the thread with a resounding yes.

[Jabroni Lames]

Barely one month into the season and this CBS Sports NBA coach ranking is completely outdated:

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/ranking-every-nba-coach-for-2024-25-season-jj-redick-at-the-bottom-pop-outside-top-10-and-no-1-in-own-tier/?utm_content=buffer7a45a&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer


Tier 9: We don't know enough
30. JJ Redick, Lakers
29. Brian Keefe, Wizards
28. Charles Lee, Hornets
27. Jordi Fernandez, Nets
26. Darko Rajakovic, Raptors

Tier 8: I wouldn't be enthused
25. Chauncey Billups, Trail Blazers
24. Billy Donovan, Bulls
23. JB Bickerstaff, Pistons
22. Doc Rivers, Bucks

Tier 7: You look promising, but it's still a tad early
21. Kenny Atkinson, Cavaliers
20. Willie Green, Pelicans
19. Jamahl Mosley, Magic

Tier 6: Middle of the road
18. Jason Kidd, Mavericks
17. Taylor Jenkins, Grizzlies
16. Quin Snyder, Hawks
15. Michael Malone, Nuggets

Tier 5: The living legend
14. Gregg Popovich, Spurs

Tier 4: Obvious floor-raisers
13. Mike Brown, Kings
12. Chris Finch, Timberwolves
11. Joe Mazzulla, Celtics
10. Tom Thibodeau, Knicks
9. Mike Budenholzer, Suns
8. Ime Udoka, Rockets

Tier 3: The Wunderkinds
7. Will Hardy, Jazz
6. Mark Daigneault, Thunder

Tier 2: The elites
5. Ty Lue, Clippers
4. Steve Kerr, Warriors
3. Rick Carlisle, Pacers
2. Nick Nurse, 76ers

Tier 1: The undisputed king
1. Erik Spoelstra, Heat

All this does is answer the question of the thread with a resounding yes.

Mike Malone in Tier 6 is wild... that's a slightly below average tier. Malone developing Jokic outta nowhere into a 3-time MVP should've been enough to put him in Tier 3.... at least. Let alone winning a championship with an overrated and always injured Jamal Murray.

And Jason Kidd making the Finals and Conference Finals, 2 out of the last 3 years, is also below average coaching?

[Edrees]

PG was injured several games as well. You can't just ignore that. If he was 100% they probably win a couple more games.

[Dennis 37]

Do the players, Nurse has available, play with energy and motivation?
Does Nurse give considerable time to the young guys in games they have no chance of winning?
Does he hold veterans as accountable as he does rookies?
Are the younger players getting better?

When the Toronto roster was no longer championship calibre, the answers were

No.
No.
No.
No.

[scrabbarista]

I wouldn't even let Nick Nurse touch the Coach bag that I bought for my AI girlfriend - that's how overrated he is.