76ers will become dynasty in 10 years

[snoopdogg88]

I wouldn't call Sam Hinkie "a fool" regardless of where the Sixers end up 2-3 years from now.
He's a very intelligent guy who puts serious thought and analytics into what he does with this organization.

In a league full of nepotism and neanderthal GM's and coaches, he has a fresh outlook on things.

[sixerswillrule]

Tanking in order to build a "dynasty" through lottery picks is a fool's gamble that may or may not pay off. If it pays off, that said fool will appear as a genius even though they're just a fool that got lucky.

I present you with exhibit A.
-------------------------------------
1999 - #1 - Elton Brand
2000 - #4 - Marcus Fizer
2001 - #2 - Tyson Chandler
2001 - #4 - Eddy Curry
2002 - #1 - Jay Williams
2003 - #7 - Kirk Hinrich
2004 - #3 - Ben Gordon
2004 - #6 - Loul Deng
2006 - #4 - Tyrus Thomas
2007 - #9 - Joakim Noah
2008 - #1 - Derrick Rose

11 high lottery picks (3 of which were #1). How many championships have the Bulls won? Have they even reached that finals yet? Isn't it also ironic that their best current player is arguably Jimmy Butler who was drafted 30th overall?

I present you with exhibit B.
---------------------------------------
A fundamental piece of every dynasty is a generational talent.

NBA dynasties over the last 25 years.

Bulls - Michael Jordan
Spurs - Tim Duncan
Lakers - Shaq/Kobe

These types of players are available once every 10 yrs.....maybe every 5 yrs if you are lucky. Tanking does not guarantee you will get one of these guy regardless of how skilled your GM is at putting a losing team together.

The road to becoming a chmpionship team is a long difficult one with many random variables along the way that have to go in your favour. There are no guarantees regardless of what strategy you employ. Anybody who tries to tell you otherwise is a fool.

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

[JDizzel3000]

The short answer to your pretty long OP is:
No.

A longer answer: Dynasties often include the best player on the planet. Are the Sixers anywhere close to having a top 5 player on the planet or even the best player? No, they aren't.

Embiid will be dominant, and Russell will be top 10 player esque In his peak.

You can say that without either one ever playing in an actual NBA basketball game? I want your visionary skills.
Or can you at least tell me next weeks lotto numbers?

People project all of the time with draft picks ...it's quite common actually


While it's true neither has played an "actual NBA game" that doesn't not equal them having 0 game footage whereby you can evaluate their tangible skills and project them into the NBA game


Did you need to be Ms.Cleo to know that Blake Griffin would be great? Did you need a crystal ball to tell that Derrick Rose would excell at this level?

[ceremony816]

Spoiler:

Tanking in order to build a "dynasty" through lottery picks is a fool's gamble that may or may not pay off. If it pays off, that said fool will appear as a genius even though they're just a fool that got lucky.

I present you with exhibit A.
-------------------------------------
1999 - #1 - Elton Brand
2000 - #4 - Marcus Fizer
2001 - #2 - Tyson Chandler
2001 - #4 - Eddy Curry
2002 - #1 - Jay Williams
2003 - #7 - Kirk Hinrich
2004 - #3 - Ben Gordon
2004 - #6 - Loul Deng
2006 - #4 - Tyrus Thomas
2007 - #9 - Joakim Noah
2008 - #1 - Derrick Rose

11 high lottery picks (3 of which were #1). How many championships have the Bulls won? Have they even reached that finals yet? Isn't it also ironic that their best current player is arguably Jimmy Butler who was drafted 30th overall?

I present you with exhibit B.
---------------------------------------
A fundamental piece of every dynasty is a generational talent.

NBA dynasties over the last 25 years.

Bulls - Michael Jordan
Spurs - Tim Duncan
Lakers - Shaq/Kobe

These types of players are available once every 10 yrs.....maybe every 5 yrs if you are lucky. Tanking does not guarantee you will get one of these guy regardless of how skilled your GM is at putting a losing team together.

The road to becoming a chmpionship team is a long difficult one with many random variables along the way that have to go in your favour. There are no guarantees regardless of what strategy you employ. Anybody who tries to tell you otherwise is a fool.

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

[sixerswillrule]

Spoiler:

Tanking in order to build a "dynasty" through lottery picks is a fool's gamble that may or may not pay off. If it pays off, that said fool will appear as a genius even though they're just a fool that got lucky.

I present you with exhibit A.
-------------------------------------
1999 - #1 - Elton Brand
2000 - #4 - Marcus Fizer
2001 - #2 - Tyson Chandler
2001 - #4 - Eddy Curry
2002 - #1 - Jay Williams
2003 - #7 - Kirk Hinrich
2004 - #3 - Ben Gordon
2004 - #6 - Loul Deng
2006 - #4 - Tyrus Thomas
2007 - #9 - Joakim Noah
2008 - #1 - Derrick Rose

11 high lottery picks (3 of which were #1). How many championships have the Bulls won? Have they even reached that finals yet? Isn't it also ironic that their best current player is arguably Jimmy Butler who was drafted 30th overall?

I present you with exhibit B.
---------------------------------------
A fundamental piece of every dynasty is a generational talent.

NBA dynasties over the last 25 years.

Bulls - Michael Jordan
Spurs - Tim Duncan
Lakers - Shaq/Kobe

These types of players are available once every 10 yrs.....maybe every 5 yrs if you are lucky. Tanking does not guarantee you will get one of these guy regardless of how skilled your GM is at putting a losing team together.

The road to becoming a chmpionship team is a long difficult one with many random variables along the way that have to go in your favour. There are no guarantees regardless of what strategy you employ. Anybody who tries to tell you otherwise is a fool.

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

I would ignore anyone who acts like that (and I haven't seen anyone who has) because anyone with logic will tell that it's far from a guarantee.

[HartfordWhalers]

Spoiler:

Tanking in order to build a "dynasty" through lottery picks is a fool's gamble that may or may not pay off. If it pays off, that said fool will appear as a genius even though they're just a fool that got lucky.

I present you with exhibit A.
-------------------------------------
1999 - #1 - Elton Brand
2000 - #4 - Marcus Fizer
2001 - #2 - Tyson Chandler
2001 - #4 - Eddy Curry
2002 - #1 - Jay Williams
2003 - #7 - Kirk Hinrich
2004 - #3 - Ben Gordon
2004 - #6 - Loul Deng
2006 - #4 - Tyrus Thomas
2007 - #9 - Joakim Noah
2008 - #1 - Derrick Rose

11 high lottery picks (3 of which were #1). How many championships have the Bulls won? Have they even reached that finals yet? Isn't it also ironic that their best current player is arguably Jimmy Butler who was drafted 30th overall?

I present you with exhibit B.
---------------------------------------
A fundamental piece of every dynasty is a generational talent.

NBA dynasties over the last 25 years.

Bulls - Michael Jordan
Spurs - Tim Duncan
Lakers - Shaq/Kobe

These types of players are available once every 10 yrs.....maybe every 5 yrs if you are lucky. Tanking does not guarantee you will get one of these guy regardless of how skilled your GM is at putting a losing team together.

The road to becoming a chmpionship team is a long difficult one with many random variables along the way that have to go in your favour. There are no guarantees regardless of what strategy you employ. Anybody who tries to tell you otherwise is a fool.

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

Would be nice to find these posters. They keep getting brought up, yet never seem to be anywhere to quote when they are. I'm sure if you look really hard you might find 1, maybe even 2, tracking in at what 3% of Sixers posters? 2%? But I would be shocked if you could find more than that, and it isn't just an absolutely absurd strawman that people trot out and expect to have it treated seriously despite no basis.

[Scoot McGroot]

I don't know that much about the CBA but

But Presti was having to operate under a tight salary cap, which is something Hinkie will not have to deal with. By the time Nerlens Noel, Joel Embiid, Dario Saric and others finish their rookie scale contracts, the salary cap will be well over $100 million — and teams will be able to carry at least three max players on their roster.

Isn't this kinda like saying "imagine how much more stuff everyone will be able to buy if we print enough money to give them all $1,000,000?"

Not sure if it's been replied to, as the thread is 20 pages long now, but....

Does the writer/radio show/podcast guest not realize that the max salaries for the young guys will go up essentially proportional to the salary cap, as well? It's not much different. All depends on how they fill out the rest of the roster, but add an MLE player or two, especially under the next CBA, and they're in the exact same position as OKC was.

[Sixersftw]

Not sure if it's been replied to, as the thread is 20 pages long now, but....

Does the writer/radio show/podcast guest not realize that the max salaries for the young guys will go up essentially proportional to the salary cap, as well? It's not much different. All depends on how they fill out the rest of the roster, but add an MLE player or two, especially under the next CBA, and they're in the exact same position as OKC was.

No he doesn't, this is Sheridan we are talking about. He is a hack.

[HeartBreakKid]

The Sixers have done a great job drafting, the only get flack because they took injured players.

People citing other teams failed drafts are really underselling what the Sixers did.

The Sixers will have the highest rated prospects in three drafts in a row, that is crazy - the chances of them hitting are pretty damn good.

Nerlens Noel was the highest rated draft pick by far before he got injured - Ben Mclemore and Victor Oladipo were dark horses for #1 around the time he went down. they traded a solid PG in Jrue Holiday for a guy with serious DPOY potential (they also got a draft pick also), that is easily worth. Noel is already close to being an all-defensive caliber big, and I thought he should have won ROY.

Joel Embiid was the highest rated draft pick by a full tier before he got injured, this is over a highly praised draft class - he was rated over both Parker and Wiggins and were beginning to think it was silly to even suggest that the wings could have went #1 overall.

These two were the near concensus #1 draft picks who only fell because of injury. It was incredibly short sighted to not take BPA just because of an injury, for Noel it's already starting to work out for the Sixers. Embiid has more questions as he is raw on top of him being injury prone, but his potential is extremely high. Does anyone in their right mind think Smart, Exum and Randle would have been better picks? (the guys who were available?)



And third, the Sixers are in the top 3 in this years draft, meaning they can arguably get the best player in this years draft. I think the Sixers will likely take D'Angello Russell who is the best prospect in this draft in my opinion, he's not the consensus #1 (Towns probably is at the favorite at this point, though there really is no true consensus), so from my perspective these guys have the three best talents for THREE years in a row - 2/3 of those draft classes are a talented class (of course in hindsight 14 and 15 can end up being bad). Even if they end up with Towns or Okafor, those guys are legit blue chip pieces.


I'm not going to say that the Sixers will win multiple championships, but they've done a great job building their team. They got Dario Saric who is a decent prospect, they dumped MCW, Spencer Haws and Thad Young who are all fools gold (Young isn't too bad), they have a TON of cap space, and multiple draft picks.

I dont get how anyone can hate on them. I think chances are they become a good team in the future, at least good enough to have a winning record during this new regime. If their plan doesn't work out, it doesn't make them dumb....I don't think they could have played these past few years much better.

[Scoot McGroot]

Not sure if it's been replied to, as the thread is 20 pages long now, but....

Does the writer/radio show/podcast guest not realize that the max salaries for the young guys will go up essentially proportional to the salary cap, as well? It's not much different. All depends on how they fill out the rest of the roster, but add an MLE player or two, especially under the next CBA, and they're in the exact same position as OKC was.

No he doesn't, this is Sheridan we are talking about. He is a hack.

Chris Sheridan? If so, agreed. He's a massive hack. We saw it in Cleveland during the Lebron return. He threw so much crap against the wall that eventually, something stuck. Then he claimed that he had the best sources. It was ridiculous.

[HeartBreakKid]

Also citing the Bulls draft history is bizarre, the Bulls actually had really good draft picks they are just incredibly short sighted. Even when they had Jordan they were short sighted, hence why they broke up their core after winning the championship.

The Bulls gave up on their prospects so early in their career, and they also refused to pay anyone worth a ****. They have a very cheap owner despite them being one of the largest markets in the NBA.

Stating that you can't get good through the draft then citing a team who drafted Elton Brand their first year tanking makes zero sense. Elton Brand was a superstar at one point. The Bulls were bad because of incompetence.

[HartfordWhalers]

Not sure if it's been replied to, as the thread is 20 pages long now, but....

Does the writer/radio show/podcast guest not realize that the max salaries for the young guys will go up essentially proportional to the salary cap, as well? It's not much different. All depends on how they fill out the rest of the roster, but add an MLE player or two, especially under the next CBA, and they're in the exact same position as OKC was.

No he doesn't, this is Sheridan we are talking about. He is a hack.

Chris Sheridan? If so, agreed. He's a massive hack. We saw it in Cleveland during the Lebron return. He threw so much crap against the wall that eventually, something stuck. Then he claimed that he had the best sources. It was ridiculous.

Disagree on all that.

I think he is an utter hack in general and wouldn't trust him in general. But with Lebron he came out early and he came out strong that Lebron was coming back to Cleveland. He said it was 100%, and bet his credibility (although he had little to none on it) on it happening, when almost no one was seriously considering it. It didn't come across as crap throwing at all -- a little of this a little of that and look I'm guaranteed right. Instead, it was a guy in a casino putting all his chips on the roulette wheel coming up #27, repeating that it would, and then cashing in his chips when it happened.

I think he absolutely had a a legitimate source the size of his posturing and stance on it wouldn't surprise me if someone involved with the coming home SI article was the leak or something elsewhere but equally 100% in the know. And it pains me to write that, because, Sheridan in general is a massive hack.

[mateo82]

Spoiler:

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

Would be nice to find these posters. They keep getting brought up, yet never seem to be anywhere to quote when they are. I'm sure if you look really hard you might find 1, maybe even 2, tracking in at what 3% of Sixers posters? 2%? But I would be shocked if you could find more than that, and it isn't just an absolutely absurd strawman that people trot out and expect to have it treated seriously despite no basis.

"These posters" are anyone who refers to what the 76ers are doing as a "plan" or "strategy". Praying you win the powerball is not a plan.

[Scoot McGroot]

No he doesn't, this is Sheridan we are talking about. He is a hack.

Chris Sheridan? If so, agreed. He's a massive hack. We saw it in Cleveland during the Lebron return. He threw so much crap against the wall that eventually, something stuck. Then he claimed that he had the best sources. It was ridiculous.

Disagree on all that.

I think he is an utter hack in general and wouldn't trust him in general. But with Lebron he came out early and he came out strong that Lebron was coming back to Cleveland. He said it was 100%, and bet his credibility (although he had little to none on it) on it happening, when almost no one was seriously considering it. It didn't come across as crap throwing at all -- a little of this a little of that and look I'm guaranteed right. Instead, it was a guy in a casino putting all his chips on the roulette wheel coming up #27, repeating that it would, and then cashing in his chips when it happened.

I think he absolutely had a a legitimate source the size of his posturing and stance on it wouldn't surprise me if someone involved with the coming home SI article was the leak or something elsewhere but equally 100% in the know. And it pains me to write that, because, Sheridan in general is a massive hack.

That was pretty late in the process after he had already made MANY appearances on Cleveland media and GREATLY hedged his bets in every single direction. That's why when he did throw his chips in late, no one in Cleveland took him seriously nor gave him great respect, as he had kind of played all sides in that process.

[HartfordWhalers]

Chris Sheridan? If so, agreed. He's a massive hack. We saw it in Cleveland during the Lebron return. He threw so much crap against the wall that eventually, something stuck. Then he claimed that he had the best sources. It was ridiculous.

Disagree on all that.

I think he is an utter hack in general and wouldn't trust him in general. But with Lebron he came out early and he came out strong that Lebron was coming back to Cleveland. He said it was 100%, and bet his credibility (although he had little to none on it) on it happening, when almost no one was seriously considering it. It didn't come across as crap throwing at all -- a little of this a little of that and look I'm guaranteed right. Instead, it was a guy in a casino putting all his chips on the roulette wheel coming up #27, repeating that it would, and then cashing in his chips when it happened.

I think he absolutely had a a legitimate source the size of his posturing and stance on it wouldn't surprise me if someone involved with the coming home SI article was the leak or something elsewhere but equally 100% in the know. And it pains me to write that, because, Sheridan in general is a massive hack.

That was pretty late in the process after he had already made MANY appearances on Cleveland media and GREATLY hedged his bets in every single direction. That's why when he did throw his chips in late, no one in Cleveland took him seriously nor gave him great respect, as he had kind of played all sides in that process.

It was really really early compared to people saying it had a chance nationally. I should look up exact details, but I would say that no one took him serious because his past rep didn't merit it, not because it wasn't a massive scoop when he had it

[HartfordWhalers]

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

Would be nice to find these posters. They keep getting brought up, yet never seem to be anywhere to quote when they are. I'm sure if you look really hard you might find 1, maybe even 2, tracking in at what 3% of Sixers posters? 2%? But I would be shocked if you could find more than that, and it isn't just an absolutely absurd strawman that people trot out and expect to have it treated seriously despite no basis.

"These posters" are anyone who refers to what the 76ers are doing as a "plan" or "strategy". Praying you win the powerball is not a plan.

Thats just incredible dumb. I'm sorry if you cannot figure out the difference between having a plan and saying a plan is guaranteed to work. Frankly, that is just idiotic.

Do you go through life with no plan, as nothing is 100% guaranteed?

[Scoot McGroot]

Disagree on all that.

I think he is an utter hack in general and wouldn't trust him in general. But with Lebron he came out early and he came out strong that Lebron was coming back to Cleveland. He said it was 100%, and bet his credibility (although he had little to none on it) on it happening, when almost no one was seriously considering it. It didn't come across as crap throwing at all -- a little of this a little of that and look I'm guaranteed right. Instead, it was a guy in a casino putting all his chips on the roulette wheel coming up #27, repeating that it would, and then cashing in his chips when it happened.

I think he absolutely had a a legitimate source the size of his posturing and stance on it wouldn't surprise me if someone involved with the coming home SI article was the leak or something elsewhere but equally 100% in the know. And it pains me to write that, because, Sheridan in general is a massive hack.

That was pretty late in the process after he had already made MANY appearances on Cleveland media and GREATLY hedged his bets in every single direction. That's why when he did throw his chips in late, no one in Cleveland took him seriously nor gave him great respect, as he had kind of played all sides in that process.

It was really really early compared to people saying it had a chance nationally. I should look up exact details, but I would say that no one took him serious because his past rep didn't merit it, not because it wasn't a massive scoop when he had it

He kept making appearances in Cleveland was hedging his bets on the radio and such, even after writing his "prediction". He was throwing stuff against the wall the whole time. Just his writings? Sure. Give him credit. On lesser document-able resources he was hedging his bets like crazy, though.

[HartfordWhalers]

That was pretty late in the process after he had already made MANY appearances on Cleveland media and GREATLY hedged his bets in every single direction. That's why when he did throw his chips in late, no one in Cleveland took him seriously nor gave him great respect, as he had kind of played all sides in that process.

It was really really early compared to people saying it had a chance nationally. I should look up exact details, but I would say that no one took him serious because his past rep didn't merit it, not because it wasn't a massive scoop when he had it

He kept making appearances in Cleveland was hedging his bets on the radio and such, even after writing his "prediction". He was throwing stuff against the wall the whole time. Just his writings? Sure. Give him credit. On lesser document-able resources he was hedging his bets like crazy, though.

Interesting, had no idea on that stuff (I actually thought you meant Lebron earlier when you said tv appearances). Thanks!

[Scoot McGroot]

It was really really early compared to people saying it had a chance nationally. I should look up exact details, but I would say that no one took him serious because his past rep didn't merit it, not because it wasn't a massive scoop when he had it

He kept making appearances in Cleveland was hedging his bets on the radio and such, even after writing his "prediction". He was throwing stuff against the wall the whole time. Just his writings? Sure. Give him credit. On lesser document-able resources he was hedging his bets like crazy, though.

Interesting, had no idea on that stuff (I actually thought you meant Lebron earlier when you said tv appearances). Thanks!

Ah, sorry. No, it was Sheridan. At one point, one of the radio shows stopped booking Sheridan up to Lebron's decision because of the constant hemming and hawing. He wouldn't stand firm on his position. But he did in his national writing, which was weird.

[Unbreakable99]

Spoiler:

Tanking in order to build a "dynasty" through lottery picks is a fool's gamble that may or may not pay off. If it pays off, that said fool will appear as a genius even though they're just a fool that got lucky.

I present you with exhibit A.
-------------------------------------
1999 - #1 - Elton Brand
2000 - #4 - Marcus Fizer
2001 - #2 - Tyson Chandler
2001 - #4 - Eddy Curry
2002 - #1 - Jay Williams
2003 - #7 - Kirk Hinrich
2004 - #3 - Ben Gordon
2004 - #6 - Loul Deng
2006 - #4 - Tyrus Thomas
2007 - #9 - Joakim Noah
2008 - #1 - Derrick Rose

11 high lottery picks (3 of which were #1). How many championships have the Bulls won? Have they even reached that finals yet? Isn't it also ironic that their best current player is arguably Jimmy Butler who was drafted 30th overall?

I present you with exhibit B.
---------------------------------------
A fundamental piece of every dynasty is a generational talent.

NBA dynasties over the last 25 years.

Bulls - Michael Jordan
Spurs - Tim Duncan
Lakers - Shaq/Kobe

These types of players are available once every 10 yrs.....maybe every 5 yrs if you are lucky. Tanking does not guarantee you will get one of these guy regardless of how skilled your GM is at putting a losing team together.

The road to becoming a chmpionship team is a long difficult one with many random variables along the way that have to go in your favour. There are no guarantees regardless of what strategy you employ. Anybody who tries to tell you otherwise is a fool.

If the the length of time that the Sixers have been tanking as I mentioned above is the first often repeated misconception, the emphasized statement above is the second often repeated misconception.

Why do people keep making it seem like we think there's a guarantee? Of course it's not guaranteed. Everyone knows that. Everyone knows that it's risky. That's just stating the obvious.

Because some of you do act like it is a guarantee. Some of you also act like there is this elaborate master plan where failure is not possible.

Name one person who said it was a guarantee it would succeed.