What Would Lebron Have To Do To Surpass MJ

[ImissJordan]

If he manages to some how get to 5, then some of those championships will be won with a run-down, aged Wade and an over the hill Bosh (if they're even still on the roster by then).

so the playing field will be fair, trust me. People act as though Wade will be in his prime forever.

Wade is two years older than LeBron, not five. Bosh is the same age as James...

I'd be comfortable saying James was a greater player than Kobe if he'd won four rings (with Bosh as a second fiddle).

Wade's presence and ability to perform at a higher level than LeBron on bigger stages just clouds things.

[Chris435]

i don't think people realize how difficult it is to roll off 6-8 straight championships.

Once you think about it, the reality that it could happen is ridiculous. It doesn't matter how talented a team is really. The prolonged title runs naturally take their toll on a team after about a 3-4 period.

Eventually, they all crack at some point along the way for whatever reason. Russell's Celtics were the only dynasty that outlasted this notion, but the title runs during that time typically ended around mid-to-late April. Teams at that time had about an extra 2 full months to recuperate.

Besides that, there's also the fact that by the end of the 5th year, Wade will be 34, Bosh & James 31 years old. James will be eclipsing the 45K mark in minutes by that point with about 1200 games logged in. So realistically speaking, Miami's got about a six-year window.

Add to the fact, that there are, you know, other teams that will be getting better: OKC, CHI, & NYK at the moment. Add to the fact that all 3 of those teams gave the Heat some problems and you start to understand that winning titles every year is virtually impossible based on 1) other teams will emerge and 2) prolonged title runs have a fatiguing effect on a team. IMO, their best case scenario is about 5 titles and their worst being around 2-3.

[ShabazzMuhammad]

i don't think people realize how difficult it is to roll off 6-8 straight championships.

Once you think about it, the reality that it could happen is ridiculous. It doesn't matter how talented a team is really. The prolonged title runs naturally take their toll on a team after about a 3-4 period.

Eventually, they all crack at some point along the way for whatever reason. Russell's Celtics were the only dynasty that outlasted this notion, but the title runs during that time typically ended around mid-to-late April. Teams at that time had about an extra 2 full months to recuperate.

Besides that, there's also the fact that by the end of the 5th year, Wade will be 34, Bosh & James 31 years old. James will be eclipsing the 45K mark in minutes by that point with about 1200 games logged in. So realistically speaking, Miami's got about a six-year window.

Add to the fact, that there are, you know, other teams that will be getting better: OKC, CHI, & NYK at the moment. Add to the fact that all 3 of those teams gave the Heat some problems and you start to understand that winning titles every year is virtually impossible based on 1) other teams will emerge and 2) prolonged title runs have a fatiguing effect on a team. IMO, their best case scenario is about 5 titles and their worst being around 2-3.

Not to mention potential superstars who haven't entered the league yet, there are many variables/factors that would just change the equation once entered. Durant could hit an all-time great caliber prime and just end any chance James' has at winning. Wade's knees could go out in a couple seasons and the window shrinks from 5 years to day-to-day etc.

By now James should have had at least one, Cav's had the best team for many years. Things will just get tougher from here on out, the lockout only makes things worse.

in reality it is very unlikely James gets to 5 championships, let along 7.

[dballislife]

LeBron will never pass MJ. The only active player who has a chance is Derrick Rose.

oh no u did not, pls never say or even think about this again

[Darain]

Lebron doesn't need any rings to pass Jordan

[JWiLL02]

He can't, I don't know why people have so much trouble grasping this.

Unless he can somehow go back in time and unlose two Finals, without a pathetic showing in the second, it's not going to happen.

Jordan was 6/6 in the Finals, with 6 Finals MVPs. That's really all that needs to be said.

[ImissJordan]

He can't, I don't know why people have so much trouble grasping this.

Unless he can somehow go back in time and unlose two Finals, without a pathetic showing in the second, it's not going to happen.

Jordan was 6/6 in the Finals, with 6 Finals MVPs. That's really all that needs to be said.

I think most people who didn't watch Jordan would like to believe they can witness something even greater, since they missed out on MJ's reign of terror.

Of course, those who watched Michael would know that putting LeBron's name in the same conversation with him is just downright laughable.

[CKRT]

LeBron will never pass MJ. The only active player who has a chance is Derrick Rose.

...what? Rose homers..jeez.

[JordansBulls]

Well when you go down with HCA 3 years in a row and become the first star to do that it makes even getting into the top 10 hard enough yet alone the top spot.

[Tacoma]

If he manages to some how get to 5, then some of those championships will be won with a run-down, aged Wade and an over the hill Bosh (if they're even still on the roster by then).

so the playing field will be fair, trust me. People act as though Wade will be in his prime forever.

Wade is two years older than LeBron, not five. Bosh is the same age as James...

I'd be comfortable saying James was a greater player than Kobe if he'd won four rings (with Bosh as a second fiddle).

Wade's presence and ability to perform at a higher level than LeBron on bigger stages just clouds things.

Not only does it clouds things, but if Miami happens to win a few in a row, it's just as likely that it would be Wade who leads them there. Wade has done it before and was also the better player for Miami in last season's Finals. I guess what I'm saying is Wade has a better chance than Lebron at surprising MJ, but either way, that chance is somewhere between slim to none.

[NyCeEvO]

Go back to Cleveland and win 7 rings.

also MJ was 6-0 in the finals ... lebronze = 0-2 ... even with Wade and Bosh.

I think this is a misnomer that people should really stop saying.

I'm a big MJ fan (I think he's the GOAT) and I'm definitely not a LBJ fan. However, so many guys act as if MJ never ever failed.

Breaking news: Michael Jordan actually lost a playoff series!!

In fact, he failed to reach the NBA Finals 6 consecutive times before actually getting there.

And guess what? Someone actually helped him out a lot. That guy's name was Scottie Pippen. Have you heard of him?

You guys need to stop acting as if MJ is a demigod that never failed. He was ringless for a while and he needed Pippen's help to get every single one of his rings.

A more comprehensive stat would be overall playoff series record rather than Finals record. Just looking at the Finals record gives a perception that MJ was perfect.

Yes, in my opinion, he's still the best of all time, but he wasn't perfect. He needed help.

Even if you compare the playoff series win % numbers, he'd still end up looking like a beast because he won 6 titles.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Stay in Cleveland and win 7 rings

This was it. Don't tuck tail and run to join up with two other franchise players because you couldn't hack it with 60+ win teams. And not dump on your city on the way out on national television.

I think he missed his opportunity by going to Miami.

Conceivably, Lebron could force a trade out of Miami to some other team, like Portland or Denver; and win multiple titles there.

There are other teams that have as much talent as Cleveland did, outside of Lebron. James can't be the next MJ as long as he plays with Wade. However, if he went to a team with super efficient players like Nene, Afflalo, Lawson, IMO Faried, and with a great coach like Karl; I could see Lebron winning multiple titles as the go-to guy.

In Miami there are too many primary scorers and not enough blue collar types.

Much as I don't particularly care for Lebron, I think he's got the most physical gifts of any player to put on an NBA uniform. He's not nearly the competitor of an MJ, however. What he would need is the same kinds of players around him that MJ had. I think Faried is a monster and that Hilario is a very good role player. Lawson is very underrated. Afflalo is a great shooter and very unselfish. Karl is a great coach.

Lebron could win multiple titles in another setting. All the players around him and the coach would have to have heart.

[Mourning_Would]

I dont think that Lebron can catch MJ, but look at those Bulls teams. Grant/Rodman and BJ became pretty good in the 90's making the All-Star team in the year MJ wasnt their. He also had automatic spot up shooters, and servicable centers. He also had Pippen

The Heat team now has many holes in it. We didnt have our 2 best role players, Miller and Haslem. Joel Anthony is the starting center. Nobody but Chalmers and Wade played up to par in the Finals, and Chalmers was just hitting open 3's all our other role players were missing.

And there is a slight difference in coaching level between Phil Jackson and erik Spoelstra

[SideshowBob]

I think its key to understand that if he does manage to win a bunch of championships, there's going to be a generation of basketball/NBA fans that will start to consider him the GOAT, or close to it. Even if his resume doesn't match up to the caliber of some of the past greats.

Just look back at the media storm prior to the finals, following James' clutch barrage in the ECF. Everyone was back on the "Next Jordan" parade, and comments like Scottie Pippen's came out. If (and that's a big if!) he has some stellar performances in the future and does indeed get 3 or 4 rings, this stuff is going to pop up again, whether its justified or not. It's going to be forced down our throats, and there's going to be a young demographic that simply won't know any better, and for them, he may indeed become the #1 player of all time.

The same thing happened with Kobe. Following the 09 finals, the ESPN on ABC crew just went off, talking about how Kobe had now proved himself greater than any player before him, with the exception of Michael Jordan (and Magic, as he was sitting right there). They were throwing out praise upon praise, and had I not despised every single minute the Lakers were in the lead in that series, I may have actually found their rants convincing.

There's always going to be a section of casual fans that hold players of their own era in a greater light. There are people who will argue that Kobe is much closer to Jordan than he really may be. Older fans will likewise maintain that Jordan is the absolute GOAT, and that Kobe doesn't hold a candle to him. Fans who grew up watching '80s ball will argue that Jordan just did not have the same impact on the league as Magic and Bird did before him, and will refuse to accept him as greater. Even older fans will argue that none of them come even close to the legends of the 60s and 70s, holding that Russell (my personal GOAT) is the greatest as his rings will never be matched, or that Wilt is the greatest as his utter statistical dominance is insurmountable, or that KAJ has arguably the best overall resume of any player, and this makes him the greatest.

Essentially, there will never be a unanimous GOAT, or list of greatest players. Each generation will have their own biases (especially among the casual fan base), and therefore, it is not out of the realm of possibility to think that Lebron will one day be considered the greatest.

[BattleTested]

i don't think people realize how difficult it is to roll off 6-8 straight championships.

Once you think about it, the reality that it could happen is ridiculous. It doesn't matter how talented a team is really. The prolonged title runs naturally take their toll on a team after about a 3-4 period.

Eventually, they all crack at some point along the way for whatever reason. Russell's Celtics were the only dynasty that outlasted this notion, but the title runs during that time typically ended around mid-to-late April. Teams at that time had about an extra 2 full months to recuperate.

Besides that, there's also the fact that by the end of the 5th year, Wade will be 34, Bosh & James 31 years old. James will be eclipsing the 45K mark in minutes by that point with about 1200 games logged in. So realistically speaking, Miami's got about a six-year window.

Add to the fact, that there are, you know, other teams that will be getting better: OKC, CHI, & NYK at the moment. Add to the fact that all 3 of those teams gave the Heat some problems and you start to understand that winning titles every year is virtually impossible based on 1) other teams will emerge and 2) prolonged title runs have a fatiguing effect on a team. IMO, their best case scenario is about 5 titles and their worst being around 2-3.

Agreed with everything up to here. 2-3 titles is the worst case scenario? Why is it guaranteed that they win even 1 ring? I don't think people understand what an accomplishment it is winning a championship, what a great team you have to haven order to win multiple rings over a short period of time.

[SweetTouch]

6 finals mvps
game winner in each finals

[Elden Payton]

Stay in Cleveland and win 7 rings

This....It just can;t be done...

[Blkbrd671]

Do the opposite of almost everything he's done

[dafunky1]

Let's be honest here.The goat had some pretty freakin elite 3pt shooters around him.Craig Hodges,Jumpshot Johnny,Toni Kuckoc,Jud Buchler,Steve Kerr,BJ Armstrong.Perfect for the triangle,which Tex Winters should get some of the credit for the GOATS success.

[Eziq]

1) Cancel his Twitter account
2) Stop talking to the media
3) Not join his buddy's team to be a sidekick
4) Not lose two finals series in embarrassing fashion
5) Not laugh about having lost two finals series
6) Care about being a champion instead of being a celebrity (this one applies to 95% of NBA players)

Lebron is the Karl Malone of this era.