Should Lin come off the bench?

Post #41 » by **Mr. E** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 5:13 pm

Choker wrote:Rockets fans can you clarify this observation I've had. It's the one I made earlier about when Lin is handling it James Harden just stands around the perimeter doing nothing, and when it's the reverse Lin is also either standing around or moving around way too much.

They've had moments where they clearly aren't in synch with each other on offense, and that is what I believe that you are seeing. I wouldn't read anything into beyond just needing time to gel as an offensive unit.

Twelve20Nine · Post #42 » by **Twelve20Nine** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 5:48 pm

yes Lin should come off the bench . Beverly lets Harden do what he does best dominant the ball . Lin in the second unit gets to do what dominant the ball .

Woodsanity · Post #43 » by **Woodsanity** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 6:26 pm

junot111 wrote:Too many outsiders make comments on what a team should do without actually watching their games... the ball movement is 10x better when Lin is in the game, he is a real playmaker whereas Beverley can only shoot open 3's and play stifling D (although his team defense is actually not as good as Lin's). And because Harden is a decent playmaker for his position, people assume that the Rockets can just get by with anyone at the PG spot... this isn't the triangle offense, they still need a good PG to be effective, because Harden has a tendency to go into ISO mode and that leaves the rest of the team standing still and watching. Make no mistake, the first unit is better with Lin in it, and having Beverley gives them a huge punch off the bench (where he belongs).

It certainly is worth trying. The 2nd unit would arguably do better with Lin's playmaking. When he plays with Harden he is often relegated to the role of spot up shooter which fits Beverly better since he is a 3 & D type of player.

At most Bev would be playing 20ish minutes and Lin probably around 30 as 6th man.

defhalotones · Post #44 » by **defhalotones** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 8:26 pm

Start Beverley. What a nice luxury to have. Bringing your starting PG and center from a 45 win team off the bench.

Knicky7 · Post #45 » by **Knicky7** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:00 pm

tcorbin wrote:Yes, Lin is a pretty horrible PG, but an above average ball dominate undersized shooting guard like Jason Terry, Jamal Crawford, or Bobby Jackson.

he is a poor defender, below average 3pt shooter, below average passer, but an above average player when it comes to creating his own shot.

he shouldn't start, but he should dominate the ball when Harden goes out and go up against the other team's second unit. but in the last five minutes of the game you could use a line up of Dwight/Parson/Harden/Lin/Beverley if the teams wants to go small and get some 3pt shooting around Dwight.

lol at people making comments without watching games

pr0wler · Post #46 » by **pr0wler** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:10 pm

While Lin isn't a great defender, he's definitely no slouch and can do just fine. He's been changing his shooting motion on his 3-point looks, so he's outside game should be much improved last season. Even without any improvement or growth, as other posted mentioned, compare his stats from the first 20-30 games when he was still recovering from a knee injury to the later half. It's a night and day difference. It's not unreasonable to assume that he'll continue where he left off last regular season.

defhalotones · Post #47 » by **defhalotones** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 9:29 pm

It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

LarsV8 · Post #48 » by **LarsV8** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 10:03 pm

TS% through 3 preseason games:
Harden - 68%
Parsons - 67%
Lin - 80%
Beverley - 83%
Casspi - 86%
Garcia - 94%

Post #49 » by **kingkirk** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 10:03 pm

Johnlac1 wrote:Tow ball dominant guards can't play together? That''s what they said about Walt Frazier and Earl Monroe when Monroe came to the Knicks. They ended up winning a title the next year. They might have won a few more if Reed's career hadn't been shortened by injuires. Lin and Harden won 45 games last year. With a better center they can certainly win 50 or more. The idea that they can't find a way is ludicrous.

I didn't saying they can't be on the court at the same time, but one of Lin's skills is setting up the play and that is minimised when Harden is doing it.

Lin gets relegated to a spot up shooter and that isn't his game.

If he could come off the bench in a Jarret Jack type role, i think that would best serve Lin himself but the Rockets as a team.

Its about balance.

Transistor · Post #50 » by **Transistor** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 10:09 pm

defhalotones wrote:It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

He was underated to begin with, being ignored out of college...Linsanity happened and his fans made him overated, now his haters have made him underated again. He's a solid starting PG if you actually followed the Rockets last year...took awhile for him to adjust with Harden but the 2nd half of last season he really got in a good groove and his jumper was a lot more consistent. But then he played terrible in the 2 games he played in the playoffs and that's what most people remember from last year.

Wether he starts or comes off the bench this year he'll probably get the same amount of minutes and McHale just needs to have one of Lin or Harden on the floor at all times. If we keep Asik to back-up Dwight...I think our 2nd unit would kill most benches around the league.

Kupchak9 · Post #51 » by **Kupchak9** » Sun Oct 13, 2013 11:30 pm

Transistor wrote:
defhalotones wrote:It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

He was underated to begin with, being ignored out of college...Linsanity happened and his fans made him overated, now his haters have made him underated again. He's a solid starting PG if you actually followed the Rockets last year...took awhile for him to adjust with Harden but the 2nd half of last season he really got in a good groove and his jumper was a lot more consistent. But then he played terrible in the 2 games he played in the playoffs and that's what most people remember from last year.

Wether he starts or comes off the bench this year he'll probably get the same amount of minutes and McHale just needs to have one of Lin or Harden on the floor at all times. If we keep Asik to back-up Dwight...I think our 2nd unit would kill most benches around the league.

I think its really a matter of time till the anticipated Asik for Ilyasova trade comes along.

defhalotones · Post #52 » by **defhalotones** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:30 am

The Bucks don't need Asik. Ever since they signed Zaza Pachulia to a bargain deal, their front court depth is fine.

Post #53 » by **Trader_Joe** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:26 am

One worry I would have if I were McHale is the backlash if they bench Lin.

Lin has some major believers including himself. I can't imagine he would be thrilled going to the bench. Considering chemistry is rather important to a new team, I'd want to make sure there is no drama and I have a feeling this would cause major drama if it hasn't already.

bfpri · Post #54 » by **bfpri** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:00 am

Obviously, bench players belong on the bench.

Kabookalu · Post #55 » by **Kabookalu** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:26 am

Trader_Joe wrote:One worry I would have if I were McHale is the backlash if they bench Lin.

Lin has some major believers including himself. I can't imagine he would be thrilled going to the bench. Considering chemistry is rather important to a new team, I'd want to make sure there is no drama and I have a feeling this would cause major drama if it hasn't already.

McHale could just pull up a famous Havlicek quote, "It doesn't matter who starts, but rather who finishes." Lin could fill a vital role if he came off the bench, and if he can't accept that that's on him.

Kupchak9 · Post #56 » by **Kupchak9** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:30 am

defhalotones wrote:The Bucks don't need Asik. Ever since they signed Zaza Pachulia to a bargain deal, their front court depth is fine.

How's this?

HOU out: Asik Smith HOU 2014 1st
HOU in: Ilyasova Lopez

POR out: McCollum TRob Lopez
POR in: Asik Smith

MIL out: Ilyasova
MIL in: McCollum TRob HOU 2014 1st

RollingWave · Post #57 » by **RollingWave** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:55 am

Choker wrote:
Trader_Joe wrote:One worry I would have if I were McHale is the backlash if they bench Lin.

Lin has some major believers including himself. I can't imagine he would be thrilled going to the bench. Considering chemistry is rather important to a new team, I'd want to make sure there is no drama and I have a feeling this would cause major drama if it hasn't already.

McHale could just pull up a famous Havlicek quote, "It doesn't matter who starts, but rather who finishes." Lin could fill a vital role if he came off the bench, and if he can't accept that that's on him.

Given that they already finish quite often with Beverley last year, that would seem to suggest the opposite...

Kabookalu · Post #58 » by **Kabookalu** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:57 am

RollingWave wrote:Given that they already finish quite often with Beverley last year, that would seem to suggest the opposite...

Heh, nvm.

RatherUnique · Post #59 » by **RatherUnique** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:32 am

In theory Beverley is a better fit because he doesn't dominate the ball, but if you actually watch the Rockets play, the offense is MUCH better when Lin is at the point instead of Beverley, which isn't surprising when you look at other successful 1/2 combos in the past like Westbrook/Harden, Parker/Ginobili Porter/Drexler or even Wade & Jason Williams

RollingWave · Post #60 » by **RollingWave** » Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:41 am

defhalotones wrote:It's confusing when people say that Lin sucks. Take away the month or so of "Linsanity" and your whole view of his game would be different. I mean, the dude wasn't even drafted..

And if you take away 2 months of the start of 12-13 season, he's been a pretty darn good player for 2/3 of his career . But no, let's take away the 2 peak months and instead focus on the 2 months after knee surgery, that's how we view all NBA players of course.