Safe to say, Chet "Hologram" Holgrem > Paolo Banchero

[JustBuzzin]

Stop it.

Chet might not even win ROTY in his own class.

[madmaxmedia]

Chet can be bullied down in the post by teenagers. He´s good, but i dont know if he will be able to play center with his anorexic frame in the long term.

Just the other day I shook him down for his lunch money (and it was a LOT of money.)

Too bad he needs big lunches.

You're right, now I feel really bad.

[God Squad]

Stop it.

Chet might not even win ROTY in his own class.

Well, that doesn't mean he's not better than Banchero. Not that I think he is or isn't, it's too early. I just think that's a silly argument considering Wemby would be drafted ahead of Paolo and likely win ROY in 22'.

[mademan]

I think there is a very strong possibility that Banchero ends up providing more overall value to his team(s) than Chet. That said, if youre at the top of the draft and blessed with the number 1 pick, you gotta take the highest upside guy, and thats Chet. Banchero, imo, has potential to be maybe a top 20 guy. Chet has potential to be top 5

[TheHartBreakKid]

Yeah, I’m really rooting for Che, but no, it’s definitely not safe to say that yet.

[Ambrose]

I see nothing special in Banchero. He's a high volume, low efficiency small forward in a power forward's body.

That's what we're basing it on?
Lebron's rookie season: 20.9 ppg on 48.8% TS.
Banchero's rookie season: 20 ppg on 52.9% TS.

Hate this argument.

20.9 ppg (13th) when teams were averaging 93.4 ppg on 51.6% TS.

20.0 ppg (42nd) when teams were averaging 111.4 ppg on 58.1% TS.

These things aren't the same.

[DC_Melo]

I haven't watched much Banchero's game, is he similar to Tobias Harris?

I'd say he's a rich man's version of Tobias, but with improved ballhandling, passing and playmaking.

But, all of this, comparing a 21-year old with a prime Tobias. So Banchero can (and will) improve on what he is right now.

I like Banchero and I would definitely pick him over Chet. The issue with Chet is durability.

Banchero's archetype (a big, versatile wing who can serve as a team's primary scorer) is very easy to identify as a success mold in the NBA's history. Many champions and contenders had a similar player like him as their best player.

The issue with Banchero is how much better he can get, and if, over time, he could be good enough to be the best player on a contender, or if he would need a better player alongside him. That I still don't know, need to see his development curve, it's too early to tell.

Paolo is 3 inches taller than Tobias Harris (6'9" vs. 6'6.5" no shoe measurement) and on another level athletically. Paolo's game is much more built on force: speed, strength, explosiveness, and a bigger body. Paolo has not figured out his offensive role in the NBA yet, but the one thing people couldn't do in year 1 was keep him out of the paint without fouling (10.6 FTA per 100).

I don't think there is a good player comp for him just because there aren't any guys at his size playing that way. Like he's bigger than Lebron or Julius Randle. Size wise he's closer to Sabonis or Ben Simmons. I don't know what Paolo is yet but I know he's got some rare gifts.

Yea… his athleticism is very sneakily close to elite. He’s not jumping out of gyms but has such a rare blend of power, agility, coordination, and length. He’s too quick for a lot of bigger post defenders to guard, and can overpower anyone his size or smaller. And he’s got a diverse arsenal of scoring moves that uses that blend of athleticism very well. If he ever hits his full potential, he’ll be a real nightmare for opposing defenses.

That said… I would take Chet over PB. Partially cuz I’m a Portland fan and the thought of drafting a promising center with injury concerns is simply too nostalgic to resist.

The other part is cuz he’s such a difference maker defensively and you just can’t coach size. His build is too uniquely suited for the modern center. If Wemby didn’t exist Chet would be hyped as the next generational talent. The few guys that do match up well with a guy like PB are the lengthy, agile types… and that’s cuz those types match up well against almost everyone lol. Which makes Chet highly valuable.

While PB has the higher offensive ceiling, the gap between him and Chet on that end doesn’t compare to the gap in Chet’s defensive potential over PB, at least in my opinion.

[zero rings]

First NBA season 72 vs 0 games played.. which one you picking.

Andre Wiggins played in 82 games in his first year, compared to Joel Embiid’s 0.

Who you got?

[Catchall]

Chet can be a top 20 player in the league even if he is scoring 15 ppg. Ridiculous to pass up on him with that potential as a rim protector and floor spacer at the 5.

Paolo has potential to be a top 10 player in the league. He just needs his scoring off the dribble to come together.

[mademan]

Chet can be a top 20 player in the league even if he is scoring 15 ppg. Ridiculous to pass up on him with that potential as a rim protector and floor spacer at the 5.

Paolo has potential to be a top 10 player in the league. He just needs his scoring off the dribble to come together.

Neither his physical package or his skillset is special. A lot (like a crazy amount) would have to go right for him to be top 10, imo

[Karate Diop]

Can Chet stay healthy? He's got better physicals than Paolo but those durability concerns haven't just vanished after a few games...

[GeorgeSears]

I see nothing special in Banchero. He's a high volume, low efficiency small forward in a power forward's body.

That's what we're basing it on?
Lebron's rookie season: 20.9 ppg on 48.8% TS.
Banchero's rookie season: 20 ppg on 52.9% TS.

LeBron was much better in his rookie season. He's not becoming the next LeBron. Preposterous comparison.

[sfernald]

What’s going on with Paulo right now? Why is he having such a **** season so far? Looks like he has regressed from last year no?

[7r5ur]

His ROY campaign seemed very Tyreke Evans-esque to me. Just by the eye test Franz Wagner seems like the best player on the Magic.

His raw stats where incredible 20/7/4, but he pretty much had the green light to do as he pleased. His team was better with him off the court than on it. He had a below league average PER, and he had mediocre efficiency.

There's tons of stuff to like about him though, he's a very good passer, he's strong, and he's elite at drawing fouls. If he could scale back his shooting, and embrace being a point forward, he's going to take the Magic to another level.

You're describing most rookies here, even great ones. KD's team was WAY worse with him on the floor his first 2 years, Luka his rookie year, etc. Paolo's got a lot to get better at and will have some bumps in the road, but he's gonna be a great player.

I really love Chet's game too, but it's too hard to tell after 4 games. If you could totally remove injury concerns from the equation I might consider Chet as the better prospect overall, but Paolo also seems to have more potential to become a true #1 guy, which Orlando needs (I see Franz topping out as a great #2). While OKC doesn't need that much from Chet, so I think both are in the places they belong. (though Chet belongs in Detroit next to Duren )

[Buckeye-NBAFan]

I don't know if Holgrem or Banchero will be better.

What I do know is neither will perform at the level Brandon Jennings did in their first 10 games.

[Rendei]

I see nothing special in Banchero. He's a high volume, low efficiency small forward in a power forward's body.

That's what we're basing it on?
Lebron's rookie season: 20.9 ppg on 48.8% TS.
Banchero's rookie season: 20 ppg on 52.9% TS.

Hate this argument.

20.9 ppg when teams were averaging 93.4 ppg on 51.6% TS.

20.0 ppg when teams were averaging 111.4 ppg on 58.1% TS.

These things aren't the same.

I'm just illustrating a point. Lebron was chucking at a below league average efficiency as a rookie. Durant was too, for that matter.
I'm not trying to say that he's going to be as good as Lebron or Durant. I'm saying that even Lebron and Durant were high volume, low efficiency chuckers when they were rookies. Why Lebron and Durant? Because we're talking about small forwards in a power forward's body. Which should be a positive, if anything.

[Ambrose]

That's what we're basing it on?
Lebron's rookie season: 20.9 ppg on 48.8% TS.
Banchero's rookie season: 20 ppg on 52.9% TS.

Hate this argument.

20.9 ppg when teams were averaging 93.4 ppg on 51.6% TS.

20.0 ppg when teams were averaging 111.4 ppg on 58.1% TS.

These things aren't the same.

I'm just illustrating a point. Lebron was chucking at a below league average efficiency as a rookie. Durant was too, for that matter.
I'm not trying to say that he's going to be as good as Lebron or Durant. I'm saying that even Lebron and Durant were high volume, low efficiency chuckers when they were rookies. Why Lebron and Durant? Because we're talking about small forwards in a power forward's body. Which should be a positive, if anything.

Those things still aren't comparable though. Both LeBron and Durant were scoring at high volume and on much better relative efficiency. There are levels to "scores points on below average efficiency". When you start to use numbers that are more comparable to Panchero, the examples get a lot less impressive.

13th in ppg on -2.8 rTS% vs. 42nd in ppg on -5.2 rTS% are stratospheres apart.

[DC_Melo]

Chet can be a top 20 player in the league even if he is scoring 15 ppg. Ridiculous to pass up on him with that potential as a rim protector and floor spacer at the 5.

Paolo has potential to be a top 10 player in the league. He just needs his scoring off the dribble to come together.

Neither his physical package or his skillset is special. A lot (like a crazy amount) would have to go right for him to be top 10, imo

I would argue his physical package combined with his skillset is what makes him special. Neither on their own is elite but put together, he’s a pretty damn versatile weapon.

That said I totally agree that a lot would have to go right for him to ever be a top 10 player. I see him having a top 20ish ceiling realistically

Chet, on the other hand, I would be less surprised to see become a top 10 player. A lot would still have to go right, but the path seems more realistic given the disruptive impact he has defensively, on top of having some scoring ability.

[DC_Melo]

Stop it.

Chet might not even win ROTY in his own class.

How is that relevant?

Olajuwon
Pippen
Stockton & Malone
Magic
Kobe
Bill Russell
Westbrook
Reggie Miller
Barkley
Paul George
Tracy McGrady
Kawhi Leonard
Curry
Jokic
Anthony Davis
Melo
Wade
Bosh
Giannis
Brian Scalabrine

Are we allowed to call any of them better than Banchero even though they didn’t win ROTY?

[JustBuzzin]

Stop it.

Chet might not even win ROTY in his own class.

How is that relevant?

Olajuwon
Pippen
Stockton & Malone
Magic
Kobe
Bill Russell
Westbrook
Reggie Miller
Barkley
Paul George
Tracy McGrady
Kawhi Leonard
Curry
Jokic
Anthony Davis
Melo
Wade
Bosh
Giannis
Brian Scalabrine

Are we allowed to call any of them better than Banchero even though they didn’t win ROTY?

How is the topic relevant?