Peak only - Kawhi vs Kobe

[ballzboyee]

Kawhi has been in the league 11 years and has 12,000 points and has only made all-defensive team 7 times. Peak is relative to how long a player can be consistent. Ya'll act like he is out there every night locking down everybody in the league. Kobe was 1 or 1b on two entirely different Lakers regimes that dominated the NBA with three straight finals runs and winning five of those. Kawhi's higher efficiency is almost exclusively related how modern teams and players are much more stingy in shot selection and the emphasis on practicing and shooting threes. Every team runs a lot screens to get shooters in space and motion for favorable matchups for easy threes, and this has pushed league efficiency way, way up. In the early 2000's, league TS% was .520 and today it is close .580. Pretty much all primary scorers today are more efficient than in 2000's, so efficiency is not really an argument unless we blame Kobe for not inventing three-ball analytics that have changed the way teams approach scoring. However, Kobe was a superior playmaker and was no slouch himself at defense, although Kawhi is better at defense no question. Peak Kobe could drop 81 points in a game, lockdown the other team's perimeter scorer, and play 42 minutes in every game of the season including playoffs with zero drop in production. You knew what you were getting every time. Kawhi has had a couple of great playoff runs, but he is not quite on Kobe's level yet.

[Baz]

Kawhi for the impact both ways.

[Myth]

I chose Kawhi as well. As others have said, better defender and more efficient scorer. Kobe’s strength was volume.

[xAIRNESSx]

Kawhi's 2019 playoff run was the closest thing we've seen to prime Jordan.

[cupcakesnake]

Kobe is quicker, more dynamic off the ball, and a way better playmaker.

Kawhi is so much bigger. He's way stronger, way longer... just physically in a different category. I also prefer Kawhi's shot selection. He's a bit deliberate, but he gets to his best spots to take his best shots and no one can stop. Kobe thought every shot was his best shot. Kawhi edges Kobe out in terms of scoring efficiency (though Kobe has some peak seasons where it's closer than you'd think). Kawhi has superior shooting range.

Kawhi has a big defensive edge regardless, but it's important to remember peak Kawhi isn't peak defensive Kawhi. His best defensive seasons happen before his best offensive seasons. You can compromise and pick 2017, I suppose.

Kobe's edge over Kawhi is longevity. Especially for the playoffs, it's hard to look at any numbers and pick a Kobe season over a peak Kawhi one. But over their best years, Kobe is still playing twice as many playoff games.

Kawhi for peak but he doesn't touch Kobe's career.

[MavsDirk41]

In 2017 Kawhi put up 39/9/5 per 100, 121 Ortg/102 Drtg and 610 TS% in the RS, and a ridiculous 40/11/7, 136 Ortg/110 Drtg and 672 TS% in the playoffs. Seems pretty clear Kawhi was better than Kobe on offense too.

Did you know Kobe played 82 games four seasons in his career while Leonard has only played 70 games or more twice in his career? With Leonard its “when” is he going to get hurt and miss some time. Leonards “peak” years were quiet impressive but Kobe gave us a HOF career to remember.

[One_and_Done]

In 2017 Kawhi put up 39/9/5 per 100, 121 Ortg/102 Drtg and 610 TS% in the RS, and a ridiculous 40/11/7, 136 Ortg/110 Drtg and 672 TS% in the playoffs. Seems pretty clear Kawhi was better than Kobe on offense too.

Did you know Kobe played 82 games four seasons in his career while Leonard has only played 70 games or more twice in his career? With Leonard its “when” is he going to get hurt and miss some time. Leonards “peak” years were quiet impressive but Kobe gave us a HOF career to remember.

Cool. The thread is about who was better at their peak though.

[MavsDirk41]

In 2017 Kawhi put up 39/9/5 per 100, 121 Ortg/102 Drtg and 610 TS% in the RS, and a ridiculous 40/11/7, 136 Ortg/110 Drtg and 672 TS% in the playoffs. Seems pretty clear Kawhi was better than Kobe on offense too.

Did you know Kobe played 82 games four seasons in his career while Leonard has only played 70 games or more twice in his career? With Leonard its “when” is he going to get hurt and miss some time. Leonards “peak” years were quiet impressive but Kobe gave us a HOF career to remember.

Cool. The thread is about who was better at their peak though.

What was Leonards peak? A year lol?

[Sixerscan]

Kawhi by a lot.

[Ruma85]

Kobe is quicker, more dynamic off the ball, and a way better playmaker.

Kawhi is so much bigger. He's way stronger, way longer... just physically in a different category. I also prefer Kawhi's shot selection. He's a bit deliberate, but he gets to his best spots to take his best shots and no one can stop. Kobe thought every shot was his best shot. Kawhi edges Kobe out in terms of scoring efficiency (though Kobe has some peak seasons where it's closer than you'd think). Kawhi has superior shooting range.

Kawhi has a big defensive edge regardless, but it's important to remember peak Kawhi isn't peak defensive Kawhi. His best defensive seasons happen before his best offensive seasons. You can compromise and pick 2017, I suppose.

Kobe's edge over Kawhi is longevity. Especially for the playoffs, it's hard to look at any numbers and pick a Kobe season over a peak Kawhi one. But over their best years, Kobe is still playing twice as many playoff games.

Kawhi for peak but he doesn't touch Kobe's career.

Umm way stronger in terms of guys bouncing off him on drives sure, otherwise I don't see it, your other arguments other are valid, I was thought if Kobe choose a sport like tennis or boxing he would be closer to the goat discussion that belief would be spectacular for a sport that's 1 on 1 , I him 5th on my list, a lot of Kobe's percentage is based on him believing he could make any shot he took, he was the best bad shot maker in nba history, there's no qualms about that, the playmaking gets severely underrated, because a lot people see him as a chucker, when people say oh he got lucky to play with Shaq yes there was luck involved but Shaq was lucky to play with Kobe aswell. I always hoped Kwahi would be able to stay health, it's just so unfortunate it has broken down.

[Cubbies2120]

Did you know Kobe played 82 games four seasons in his career while Leonard has only played 70 games or more twice in his career? With Leonard its “when” is he going to get hurt and miss some time. Leonards “peak” years were quiet impressive but Kobe gave us a HOF career to remember.

Cool. The thread is about who was better at their peak though.

What was Leonards peak? A year lol?

I think a peak is by definition a year.

It is the absolute best period (season, or playoffs) of a player's prime.

If the discussion was about 'primes', then that would usually be a 3-5 year period.

Peak is the best period of the prime.

[Heej]

Kawhi peak but it's close

[lakerz12]

You should also have to enter your age when answering the poll question.

[DS17]

This is why children and neck beards votes don’t matter in comparison to real ballers. Kawhi is an amazing player but to put him over peak Kobe is a freaking joke. Y’all should be ashamed lol

[bovice]

a lot of y'all value stats way too much

[One_and_Done]

This is why children and neck beards votes don’t matter in comparison to real ballers. Kawhi is an amazing player but to put him over peak Kobe is a freaking joke. Y’all should be ashamed lol

I would lose all faith in the objectivity of anyone who took Kobe. This isn't close. You can tell because even though Kobe is a beloved player with tonnes of stans, and Kawhi is a widely disliked player, Kawhi is still winning easily.

[Trey24]

People saying Kawhi don't have a single clue

[maradro]

Cool. The thread is about who was better at their peak though.

What was Leonards peak? A year lol?

I think a peak is by definition a year.

It is the absolute best period (season, or playoffs) of a player's prime.

If the discussion was about 'primes', then that would usually be a 3-5 year period.

Peak is the best period of the prime.

If peak is a year then I give it to Kobe

If it's a month or a playoff run then Leonard has an argument

IMO it should be a year at least

[One_and_Done]

Come on bro, Kawhi in 2017 smokes any year Kobe had.

[maradro]

Come on bro, Kawhi in 2017 smokes any year Kobe had.

Kawhi in 2017
Regular season:
1888 pts / 430reb / 260 ast / 133 stl / 55 blk

Playoffs:
332 pts / 93 reb / 55 ast / 20 stl / 6 blk

Total:
2220 pts / 523 reb / 315 ast/ 153 stl/ 61 blk
.489 FG

Kobe 2009
Regular season:
2201 pts / 429 reb / 399 ast /120 stl / 37 blk
Playoffs:
695 pts/ 123 reb /126 ast / 38 stl / 21 blk
Total:
2896 pts / 552 reb / 525 ast / 158 stl / 58 blk
.464

Kobe has
+676 pts, +29 reb, +210 ast, +5 stl, -3 blk , -2.5 FG%
Theres an argument that kawhi's efficiency and defense trump kobes volume and playmaking, but its definitely close

some will say, kobe played more minutes and more games! but thats the point... Kobe, MJ, whatever big name player you compare to leonard, destroys his output over an entire season because he has never played an entire season. he is only comparable if you start cutting down to months or playoff runs or series etc...

since some people have mentioned jordan:

1990
Regular season:
2753 pts / 565 reb / 519 ast / 227 stl / 54 blk
Playoffs:
587 pts / 115 reb / 109 ast / 45 stl / 14 blk
Total:
3340 pts / 680 reb / 628 ast / 272 stl / 68 blk
.524 FG%

this one is not even close for either K