Replace Shai with Luka on the Thunder. What happens?

[Bornstellar]

OKC is a team full of elite defenders and guys that can play off their superstar and hit threes. He would excel in SGA's role. I think they'd basically be in the same position

[zero rings]

They definitely take a hit on defense, and I don't think they get meaningfully better on offense.

They'd still be a juggernaut of course

[Liam_Gallagher]

I don't know.

[Patches Perry]

I'll take Shai for this OKC team because his work ethic, leadership and focus on defense has been huge in setting the tone for the culture. Its unfortunate that the quality of his teammates is often held against him because his work ethic and exemplary leadership is a huge factor in the improvement of his teammates.

Still, whether you lean one way or the other, you have to admit its pure speculation. The most honest answer if you have appropriate respect for both players is, it's a wash

[firedavidkahn]

"Replace the MVP with another MVP favorite - What happens"?

Absolutely nothing different would happen. OKC would continue to be title favorites

[og15]

First i have to say i have no problem with you believing OKC would get worse, fine i respect your opinion but when you say MUCH WORSE? I mean.. let's look at some of the facts.

How are Mavs doing without Luka organizing their offense? 29th best offense in the league.... yeah.

Luka, if you exclude last season, has basically been the best playmaker in the past 5 years. Combined with assists, 2ndary assists, points created from the assists, ShotQuality% and ShotQuality created for team mates.. No one even comes close, not even Jokic. So, you're trying to convince us that OKC would get much worse with a player like that?

On top of it, Luka led team never had problems with his defense, check his playoffs impact on Mavs before saying stuff like that.

So again, to say OKC would be MUCH worse, is simply wrong on so many levels. I actually think OKC shooters would thrive because of all the open looks they would be getting. Look at Lakers for example, Rui is having a career shooting% year so far and him and Luka/AR duo have the best offensive rating in NBA history when playing together.

This is not a very good example though, Luka is a great offensive player, but it's much more than just not having Luka for the Mavs too.

Not really, no, Luka was able to maintain much worse rosters at or over .5, they may be missing Kyrie, but they are much better at every other position, which is exactly the point.

Mavs started off starting a non PG rookie PF at PG to start the season, they were basically playing 2 C's, 2 PF's and a SG, they did that for 3 games until Lively got injured and then they added another SG to the starting lineup for one more game, then AD went down in game 5. That lineups offensive ineptitude could be seen a mile away by anyone, we're in an NBA where shooting is premium and you're starting Flagg/Davis/Washington and Lively together with no point guard, that's of course tough.

The Mavs were only able to get 266 minutes out of AD last season, not really at full strength either, but their Ortg with him last season was 113.3, not great, but that was with starting lineups like: Dinwiddie, Klay, Washington, Davis and Kai Jones.

We all know Luka is a great offensive player, but I'll always question examples that are not the best, doesn't matter if I agree with someone's overall point, I just don't think we should use examples that we know are kind of

[ChumboChappati]

Offense: Luka >> Shai
Defense: Luka <= Shai
Passing / Rebounding etc.: Luka >>> Shai

OKC would be a dynasty with Luka.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

SGA is a better player than Luka, you cannot just discount defense, and the gap between them on defense is much larger than the one on offense.

[f4p]

They get much worse, to put It simply shai is simply a better team leader

Put in Luka for shai offensively: now your offense is a heliocentric offense that doesnt develop new on ball threats, that is a lot more variance based and turnover prone. Sure Luka is a more talented offensive player, but SGA is a lot more consistent

Defensively... Welp. You trade like a near top weak side perimeter defender for a guy with inconsistent effort on defense that doesnt Excel in anything... This thunder defense is based on having no weak links now your got a solid one.

Worse

First i have to say i have no problem with you believing OKC would get worse, fine i respect your opinion but when you say MUCH WORSE? I mean.. let's look at some of the facts.

How are Mavs doing without Luka organizing their offense? 29th best offense in the league.... yeah.

Luka, if you exclude last season, has basically been the best playmaker in the past 5 years. Combined with assists, 2ndary assists, points created from the assists, ShotQuality% and ShotQuality created for team mates.. No one even comes close, not even Jokic. So, you're trying to convince us that OKC would get much worse with a player like that?

On top of it, Luka led team never had problems with his defense, check his playoffs impact on Mavs before saying stuff like that.

So again, to say OKC would be MUCH worse, is simply wrong on so many levels. I actually think OKC shooters would thrive because of all the open looks they would be getting. Look at Lakers for example, Rui is having a career shooting% year so far and him and Luka/AR duo have the best offensive rating in NBA history when playing together.

yeah people always act like you are just going to be a sieve on defense with luka but the 2024 mavs had the best defense in the playoffs. i believe by a decent margin. hard to believe they did that with luka being as terrible as people say on defense. like the celtics offense was terrible in the finals.

[Archx]

They get much worse, to put It simply shai is simply a better team leader

Put in Luka for shai offensively: now your offense is a heliocentric offense that doesnt develop new on ball threats, that is a lot more variance based and turnover prone. Sure Luka is a more talented offensive player, but SGA is a lot more consistent

Defensively... Welp. You trade like a near top weak side perimeter defender for a guy with inconsistent effort on defense that doesnt Excel in anything... This thunder defense is based on having no weak links now your got a solid one.

Worse

First i have to say i have no problem with you believing OKC would get worse, fine i respect your opinion but when you say MUCH WORSE? I mean.. let's look at some of the facts.

How are Mavs doing without Luka organizing their offense? 29th best offense in the league.... yeah.

Luka, if you exclude last season, has basically been the best playmaker in the past 5 years. Combined with assists, 2ndary assists, points created from the assists, ShotQuality% and ShotQuality created for team mates.. No one even comes close, not even Jokic. So, you're trying to convince us that OKC would get much worse with a player like that?

On top of it, Luka led team never had problems with his defense, check his playoffs impact on Mavs before saying stuff like that.

So again, to say OKC would be MUCH worse, is simply wrong on so many levels. I actually think OKC shooters would thrive because of all the open looks they would be getting. Look at Lakers for example, Rui is having a career shooting% year so far and him and Luka/AR duo have the best offensive rating in NBA history when playing together.

yeah people always act like you are just going to be a sieve on defense with luka but the 2024 mavs had the best defense in the playoffs. i believe by a decent margin. hard to believe they did that with luka being as terrible as people say on defense. like the celtics offense was terrible in the finals.

Exactly. I guess the fact that Mavs actually beat OKC in the series has been just thrown out the window suddenly. The fact that OKC barely beat Nuggets with absolutely no bench and 4 healthy starters and also barely beat IND with an injured Halliburton. Yeah....

Nuggets and Pacers also hunted SGA on defense as hell, he was terrible, it's just that he had 6-7 guys to cover up for him. The same stupid argument that Luka got clowned for "The Famous" blow by % which ESPN loved to show so much, it turned out SGA was even worse and yet no one said a thing, specially ESPN. This talk about defense has really gotten out of hand and has been blown way out of proportions.

Regular season, sure whatever SGA plays harder, deserves his MVP but talking Playoffs, that's another story.

[MoneyTalks41890]

If you’re quoting the fake SGA blow by numbers you’re not winning the debate.

The Mavs beat OKC in spite of Luka’s mediocre play. The Thunder lost to the Mavs in spite of Shai’s better play.

[Johnny Bball]

Putting a big hole in that defense for little reason.

[Snakebites]

There's an obvious defensive downgrade, but I'd also argue that the offense is better suited for SGA.

Luka needs more shooting around him, and while the Thunder have guys who CAN shoot, it's proven to be a little less consistent.

[tdotrep2]

If there was ever a tailor made team for Luka, it would be OKC.

[Patches Perry]

The way people talk about Luka in the playoffs, you'd think he has multiple titles already. It's really strange.

[Ambrose]

I think they'd win the title either way but I think they'd be worse. Their offense would be more dynamic, but their defense is their identity, and that would take a hit.

[durden_tyler]

Guaranteed dynasty (at least a 3-peat), something SGA won’t accomplish.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Black Jack]

Luka needs a team built around him along the lines of the Mavs title run. OKC, his ball hogging would make everyone else less effective.

[CobraCommander]

Did anyone watch today’s game and think Luka would be better for the thunder?

Sga is the leader they need - reeves is worse when Luka is there and sga kinda makes it work with his guys

Luka is the ball stopper which is fine and he is the alpha which is fine and SGA does interviews with the whole team is a part of the team.. sga is a no nonsense leader that raises the level of play with his guys and no matter what you say… the best guys are worse when next to Luka.

Brunson, Reeves, KP etc - all better without Luka

Kyrie is the only star that was “better”

Okc also plays team defense - that’s not Luka’s thing either

[CobraCommander]

The way people talk about Luka in the playoffs, you'd think he has multiple titles already. It's really strange.

It’s like they think sga didn’t take a lottery team to a ring and has been good every regular season…