Luka Doncic hints that he might stay in Europe next season

[Eskobar13]

Perennial all-star. Although much of what will make him considered a bust or not falls in what his peers will do. If Doncic goes 1st and Ayton 2nd, the worst of them will be a bust if they're at least two tiers apart.

This is, if Ayton is a #1 option on a championship caliber team (superstar), than Doncic as a perennial all-star will be doomed a bust.

[jg77]

As long as he's a + starter then I don't think he'll be considered a bust.

[RSP83]

Reading all this comments, it might not be too crazy to hope Doncic fall to #7. Keep up the hate and skepticism guys, maybe it'll catchup to the pro-ranks, and Doncic slides.

[walk with me]

I voted perennial all star regardless of position ranking.... I’d be personally shocked if he achieved that much. Anything below that would be a bust imo.

Aren't these two sentences incongruous? I always thought of a bust as not meeting expectations but you don't seem to expect much.

I'll say career starter. If a guys making valuable contributions as a starter I find it hard to consider him a 'bust.' MKG comes to mind, he's never turned into the star some expected but makes a good contribution.

I expect belinelli or galinari esque career. Based on the hype that’s a disappointment.

[Mirotic12]

I’m not attributing my biases... I’m attributing the fact that I cannot remember the last time a Euroleague stud was able to translate that to the NBA. Also the fact that they are dominant for against a tier of basketball players that is not comparable to the NBA. It’s the 2nd best league in the world true, but by a large margin. There are probably 10-20 players in Euroleague who could or have played in the NBA, and those who have were role players. 16 ppg in Euroleague doesn’t scream top overall pick to me. The only 2 time Euroleague MVP to my memory was Anthony Parker, and most casual fans don’t even know who he is even though he played in the NBA. I’m still of the belief that NCAA is the 2nd best league to the NBA, bc you’re regularly playing with other future NBAers, and for coaches who’ve all for the most part coached current NBA players.

For one on Doncic, lateral quickness is a big thing for guards, especially point guards. That means he’s likely to struggle to beat the 1st defender off penetration. Second, the NBA 3 id further than the Euroleague 3.

It’s not that I think he’s a scrub, just more of a question mark than a lot of ppl make it seem. Phoenix has like 5 lottery busts of big men; they need a big more than a guard. A “low motor” is subjective... they said James Harden had one too

That's way, way off. There have been dozens upon dozens of guys that played in EuroLeague and NBA. It probably reaches into the hundreds easily.

Also, NCAA champs couldn't even compete with most average teams in most European national leagues - they lose by 30-50 points against any decent EuroLeague team.

The other part is factually and statistically incorrect. A much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA and than NCAA players. A much larger percentage. That's factually statistically incorrect to claim more NCAA players play in the NBA. It's actually not even close how much larger the percentage is for EuroLeague (easily much higher than NCAA).

[Goudelock]

I’m not attributing my biases... I’m attributing the fact that I cannot remember the last time a Euroleague stud was able to translate that to the NBA. Also the fact that they are dominant for against a tier of basketball players that is not comparable to the NBA. It’s the 2nd best league in the world true, but by a large margin. There are probably 10-20 players in Euroleague who could or have played in the NBA, and those who have were role players. 16 ppg in Euroleague doesn’t scream top overall pick to me. The only 2 time Euroleague MVP to my memory was Anthony Parker, and most casual fans don’t even know who he is even though he played in the NBA. I’m still of the belief that NCAA is the 2nd best league to the NBA, bc you’re regularly playing with other future NBAers, and for coaches who’ve all for the most part coached current NBA players.

For one on Doncic, lateral quickness is a big thing for guards, especially point guards. That means he’s likely to struggle to beat the 1st defender off penetration. Second, the NBA 3 id further than the Euroleague 3.

It’s not that I think he’s a scrub, just more of a question mark than a lot of ppl make it seem. Phoenix has like 5 lottery busts of big men; they need a big more than a guard. A “low motor” is subjective... they said James Harden had one too

That's way, way off. There have been dozens upon dozens of guys that played in EuroLeague and NBA. It probably reaches into the hundreds easily.

Also, NCAA champs couldn't even compete with most average teams in most European national leagues - they lose by 30-50 points against any decent EuroLeague team.

The other part is factually and statistically incorrect. A much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA and than NCAA players. A much larger percentage. That's factually statistically incorrect to claim more NCAA players play in the NBA. It's actually not even close how much larger the percentage is for EuroLeague (easily much higher than NCAA).

I want to see those stats. If you're going to make grandiose statements about how a much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA than the NCAA, then the least you can do is reference some sources.

[Mirotic12]

I want to see those stats. If you're going to make grandiose statements about how a much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA than the NCAA, then the least you can do is reference some sources.

People have researched it. Nothing at all grandiose. It's actually quite well known basic sports fact.

About 1% of NCAA Division I players ever play in EuroLeague or NBA.

Just about every EuroLeague team has like 4-5 NBA players, some have 6, 7, 8..........

How this could be considered a grandiose statement...................for the NCAA to have "more NBA players" then every single Division I college basketball team would need to have at least 1/3 to 1/2 of their roster be of NBA players.

In fact, there was just an NBA scouting report about a week ago that said something about how NCAA would get like 5% of its players maybe playing pro somewhere (not EuroLeague level)...while EuroLeague had like 1/4 of it's players already in the NBA. The scouting report is posted in the Luka Doncic thread I believe. I don't have time to find it, but I am sure anyone that posted in that thread can verify it. It's already been posted there.

Besides it's basic common math....just go to any EuroLeague roster and see how many players played in NBA, not even counting how many are draft picks and how many will play in NBA (Doncic or Teodosic last year would not even be counted)...again, every team has several NBA players. Now compare that to NCAA Division I, where probably dozens of teams have zero NBA players.

[papidulo]

I’m not attributing my biases... I’m attributing the fact that I cannot remember the last time a Euroleague stud was able to translate that to the NBA. Also the fact that they are dominant for against a tier of basketball players that is not comparable to the NBA. It’s the 2nd best league in the world true, but by a large margin. There are probably 10-20 players in Euroleague who could or have played in the NBA, and those who have were role players. 16 ppg in Euroleague doesn’t scream top overall pick to me. The only 2 time Euroleague MVP to my memory was Anthony Parker, and most casual fans don’t even know who he is even though he played in the NBA. I’m still of the belief that NCAA is the 2nd best league to the NBA, bc you’re regularly playing with other future NBAers, and for coaches who’ve all for the most part coached current NBA players.

For one on Doncic, lateral quickness is a big thing for guards, especially point guards. That means he’s likely to struggle to beat the 1st defender off penetration. Second, the NBA 3 id further than the Euroleague 3.

It’s not that I think he’s a scrub, just more of a question mark than a lot of ppl make it seem. Phoenix has like 5 lottery busts of big men; they need a big more than a guard. A “low motor” is subjective... they said James Harden had one too

That's way, way off. There have been dozens upon dozens of guys that played in EuroLeague and NBA. It probably reaches into the hundreds easily.

Also, NCAA champs couldn't even compete with most average teams in most European national leagues - they lose by 30-50 points against any decent EuroLeague team.

The other part is factually and statistically incorrect. A much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA and than NCAA players. A much larger percentage. That's factually statistically incorrect to claim more NCAA players play in the NBA. It's actually not even close how much larger the percentage is for EuroLeague (easily much higher than NCAA).

Cmon man, i hope youre just trolling now...

I get that youre trying to say that alot of Euroleague players have played in the NBA, but its not even close to compare Euroleague players in the NBA to former NCAA players. Almost everyone in the NBA played college ball, except for the “dozens and dozens” of Euroleague players you refer to. The number of former NCAA players in the NBA in the thousands lol.

The NBA and the rest of the world are so far apart that the US is about to just start sending a 25 and under team as the US team.

I still feel justified in my skepticism on Doncic

[Mirotic12]

Cmon man, i hope youre just trolling now...

I get that youre trying to say that alot of Euroleague players have played in the NBA, but its not even close to compare Euroleague players in the NBA to former NCAA players. Almost everyone in the NBA played college ball, except for the “dozens and dozens” of Euroleague players you refer to. The number of former NCAA players in the NBA in the thousands lol.

The NBA and the rest of the world are so far apart that the US is about to just start sending a 25 and under team as the US team.

I still feel justified in my skepticism on Doncic

I will say it one more time, then I am done with this thread...if we can't accept basic facts here...

Every single EuroLeague team consists of around 1/4 to 1/2 of NBA players. Therefore, it is mathematical fact, and 100% true and verifiable, that much more percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA than NCAA Division I players.

An extremely small number of NCAA Division 1 players ever play in NBA. If anyone here honestly believes that 1/4 to 1/2 of every NCAA team roster consists of NBA players, then they very clearly have never in their lives seen an NCAA game.

OK, I am done with this thread. It's not worth the time for anyone that wants to engage in even remotely serious basketball discussion.

[dtbrehm]

I will say it one more time, then I am done with this thread...if we can't accept basic facts here...

Every single EuroLeague team consists of around 1/4 to 1/2 of NBA players. Therefore, it is mathematical fact, and 100% true and verifiable, that much more percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA than NCAA Division I players.

An extremely small number of NCAA Division 1 players ever play in NBA. If anyone here honestly believes that 1/4 to 1/2 of every NCAA team roster consists of NBA players, then they very clearly have never in their lives seen an NCAA game.

OK, I am done with this thread. It's not worth the time for anyone that wants to engage in even remotely serious basketball discussion.

I mean you're basically arguing a different point from who you quoted...

Something like 85% of current NBA players are from US college/high school. But yes, EuroLeague does have a lot of washed up former NBA players.

[Lauri_Legend]

I think majority of the "hyped" Euro players still come into the NBA with a much higher IQ than your typical NCAA standout prospect

[leolozon]

I’m not attributing my biases... I’m attributing the fact that I cannot remember the last time a Euroleague stud was able to translate that to the NBA. Also the fact that they are dominant for against a tier of basketball players that is not comparable to the NBA. It’s the 2nd best league in the world true, but by a large margin. There are probably 10-20 players in Euroleague who could or have played in the NBA, and those who have were role players. 16 ppg in Euroleague doesn’t scream top overall pick to me. The only 2 time Euroleague MVP to my memory was Anthony Parker, and most casual fans don’t even know who he is even though he played in the NBA. I’m still of the belief that NCAA is the 2nd best league to the NBA, bc you’re regularly playing with other future NBAers, and for coaches who’ve all for the most part coached current NBA players.

For one on Doncic, lateral quickness is a big thing for guards, especially point guards. That means he’s likely to struggle to beat the 1st defender off penetration. Second, the NBA 3 id further than the Euroleague 3.

It’s not that I think he’s a scrub, just more of a question mark than a lot of ppl make it seem. Phoenix has like 5 lottery busts of big men; they need a big more than a guard. A “low motor” is subjective... they said James Harden had one too

That's way, way off. There have been dozens upon dozens of guys that played in EuroLeague and NBA. It probably reaches into the hundreds easily.

Also, NCAA champs couldn't even compete with most average teams in most European national leagues - they lose by 30-50 points against any decent EuroLeague team.

The other part is factually and statistically incorrect. A much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA and than NCAA players. A much larger percentage. That's factually statistically incorrect to claim more NCAA players play in the NBA. It's actually not even close how much larger the percentage is for EuroLeague (easily much higher than NCAA).

Cmon man, i hope youre just trolling now...

I get that youre trying to say that alot of Euroleague players have played in the NBA, but its not even close to compare Euroleague players in the NBA to former NCAA players. Almost everyone in the NBA played college ball, except for the “dozens and dozens” of Euroleague players you refer to. The number of former NCAA players in the NBA in the thousands lol.

The NBA and the rest of the world are so far apart that the US is about to just start sending a 25 and under team as the US team.

I still feel justified in my skepticism on Doncic

Your argument doesn’make any sense. You say that the NCAA is better than the Euroleague, because more guys in the NBA have played in the NCAA. By that logic, high school basketball in the USA is better than Euroleague. So is elementary school while we are at it. Do you realize how dumb it is to start in the NBA and go backward? It means you only take into consideration those who succeeded.

There are just more guys playing in the NCAA . 500/5000 is less than 50/200 (or whatever the ratios are). You can’t only look at the first number to decide how great a league is.

And that’s whitout considering that the guys in the NCAA aren’t at their peak.

[D3ko]

He wil be a bust. If someone calls him before 14 I wuold be seriously angry.

LOL , BUST COMMENT OF THE THREAD , you are going to be really angry then.
He is without any doubt the best player of the draft right now , MAYBE , someone will be better than him in the future, but without hesitate , that he will be top 3 in players coming in this draft.

I cannot believe that someone who see Jokic & his impact on the game daily is not on Doncic train
NO WORRY , YOU CAN PAY 18 MILLIONS PER YEAR TO GARY HARRIS and stay as a almost playoff team years to come ,would be even funnier when Doncic team kick your team out of playoffs.
Doncic is going to have Jokic impact in day 1, they are difference player but his mains strength's are passing and shooting. And without any doubt with much better defence .



* I like Gary Harris as a player just to exemplify that Doncic at least for 4 years is going to be a bargain.

[papidulo]

That's way, way off. There have been dozens upon dozens of guys that played in EuroLeague and NBA. It probably reaches into the hundreds easily.

Also, NCAA champs couldn't even compete with most average teams in most European national leagues - they lose by 30-50 points against any decent EuroLeague team.

The other part is factually and statistically incorrect. A much larger percentage of EuroLeague players play in the NBA and than NCAA players. A much larger percentage. That's factually statistically incorrect to claim more NCAA players play in the NBA. It's actually not even close how much larger the percentage is for EuroLeague (easily much higher than NCAA).

Cmon man, i hope youre just trolling now...

I get that youre trying to say that alot of Euroleague players have played in the NBA, but its not even close to compare Euroleague players in the NBA to former NCAA players. Almost everyone in the NBA played college ball, except for the “dozens and dozens” of Euroleague players you refer to. The number of former NCAA players in the NBA in the thousands lol.

The NBA and the rest of the world are so far apart that the US is about to just start sending a 25 and under team as the US team.

I still feel justified in my skepticism on Doncic

Your argument doesn’make any sense. You say that the NCAA is better than the Euroleague, because more guys in the NBA have played in the NCAA. By that logic, high school basketball in the USA is better than Euroleague. So is elementary school while we are at it. Do you realize how dumb it is to start in the NBA and go backward? It means you only take into consideration those who succeeded.

There are just more guys playing in the NCAA . 500/5000 is less than 50/200 (or whatever the ratios are). You can’t only look at the first number to decide how great a league is.

And that’s whitout considering that the guys in the NCAA aren’t at their peak.

That wasn’t my argument. If you care to, go back and read the thread, bc this splintered into a bunch of different sub-debates.

My initial point was that I’m skeptical of Doncic over Ayton, and I’m skeptical of European pgs in general AS TOP PICKS. I never said he’s a scrub, I said not number 1 overall. Phoenix has wasted at least 4 lottery picks on bigs, and from what I have seen of Ayton, and even Marvin Bagley, I think they are more sure things than Doncic. There is no history of Euroleague players’ dominance translating to the NBA, and Doncic is a pg, but not quick. Therefore I think Ayton should go 1. Phx already has Devin Booker, and need a foundational big more than a guard.

Euroleague might well be better than NCAA, but I still think NCAA is a better prep league for the NBA than Euroleague.Euroleague is played differently, it’s more team-based than star-based, Euroleague players minutes are limited, most high level NCAA coaches have coached dozens of future NBA players, and schedules are set up so that likely NBA draft picks play each other regularly; if a one-and-done guy wants the best prep for the NBA, I still think that for a young prospect like Ayton or Doncic, NCAA is better prep for the NBA than Euroleague.

Euroleague vs NCAA argument came up when the other guy tried to falsely claim more NBA players came internationally than from NCAA.

[Potedon]

Bad attitude?
He doesn’t project to be a star in your eyes, that’s ok you can have your opinion.
Don’t start making things up though like he has a bad attitude.
The thing a lot of people are getting wrong with him is they think that he is slow.
He picks the defence apart with crafty moves in the half court. He isn’t always just going to blow by his man, he breaks them down with hesitations.
When he pushes the ball up the court he is fine, he isn’t the fastest, but his speed isn’t a concern. The main concern I have with him is his defence. There aren’t too many rookies that are going to be good defenders next year right off the bat, but what I’m looking at is whether he can become a good enough defender that it doesn’t matter.
Some people don’t like him as a prospect and that’s all well and good, but seriously they need to stick to the facts because when you start to make things up it just hurts your argument.

He has a bad attitude this is known by anyone that follows him. Some try to write it off as immaturity or competitiveness, but NBA vets aren't really going to appreciate it. Doncic is slow for a ballhandler if he was just an off ball shooter his speed would be fine, struggles to beat Euroleague guys off the dribble, sorry but Adreian Payne isn't a lockdown defender or world class athlete.

That's crazy talk. On youtube, his comparison is listed as Drazen Petrovic and that could be a fair comparison.

Uh Petrovic is a terrible comparison, and not even that flattering, Petrovic wasn't a star when he played and his game would be further exposed in todays NBA.

Wow, someone still living in the 1980s?

The only player that fits his description is probably Spanoulis

On Doncic's own team we have Rudy Fernandez who could have had a decent NBA career, but was took his ball and went back to Spain when he hit a rough patch. And we have Llull who's too scared to even try.

But yeah the 80's

Yes, as the season has gone on, he has clearly been dropping, because it is clear he is exhausted. He has been playing 18 months straight, the only time he got time off was a few weeks when he tweaked an ankle... And yet he has played well enough to still be both Finals and Regular Season MVP...

Next year once he has a proper summer to rest and work out he will be a beast imo.

Played 18 months straight but still has a high bf% hmm...

[JHFVF07]

Luka strugled to score against euroleague guys? How many fuure NBA/Euroleague players Buffalo had when beated Ayton 's team by 20 points, on the first round? While holding him to 14 points (on 13 shots).

Luka won playing against grown men, doing what the team needed from him, playmaking, scoring and defending (at least you can see the effort on this side of ball).

[UcanUwill]

Llull and Fernandez got good offers to play in Madrid. SO wanting to play at hope equals bad attitude? NBA is not a center of the universe, so what if they not interested in NBA offers? That doesn't equal bad attitude, and Doncic surely isn't known for bad attitude at all.

[dipodenis]

Reading all this comments, it might not be too crazy to hope Doncic fall to #7. Keep up the hate and skepticism guys, maybe it'll catchup to the pro-ranks, and Doncic slides.

If Luka drops to Chicago it would be the biggest draft steal in recent memory.

[Pachinko_]

I don't know why people get into those chaotic, dead end discussions, trying to weigh the competition level across totally different leagues etc

Things are really really simple with that guy: if you like or liked any Euro player, ever, there's a 99% chance that Doncic is better at the same age. It's so simple really. Now how much this is worth to you and your team, well that's really up to you.

In my mind the most legit concern is that the guy's game is so freakishly polished, and he's already so experienced, that it's really hard to imagine exactly where his game is going to improve. I mean nobody is perfect but there's definitely no low hanging fruits with his game. It's not like Giannis where you say OMFG if he ever gets an average jumpshot etc, Doncic is already above average to good at pretty much everything.

Maybe there's a chance we'll see a guy who is at some level of good early on, and then stays at that level for years? I don't know.

[sacking123]

Bad attitude?
He doesn’t project to be a star in your eyes, that’s ok you can have your opinion.
Don’t start making things up though like he has a bad attitude.
The thing a lot of people are getting wrong with him is they think that he is slow.
He picks the defence apart with crafty moves in the half court. He isn’t always just going to blow by his man, he breaks them down with hesitations.
When he pushes the ball up the court he is fine, he isn’t the fastest, but his speed isn’t a concern. The main concern I have with him is his defence. There aren’t too many rookies that are going to be good defenders next year right off the bat, but what I’m looking at is whether he can become a good enough defender that it doesn’t matter.
Some people don’t like him as a prospect and that’s all well and good, but seriously they need to stick to the facts because when you start to make things up it just hurts your argument.

He has a bad attitude this is known by anyone that follows him. Some try to write it off as immaturity or competitiveness, but NBA vets aren't really going to appreciate it. Doncic is slow for a ballhandler if he was just an off ball shooter his speed would be fine, struggles to beat Euroleague guys off the dribble, sorry but Adreian Payne isn't a lockdown defender or world class athlete.

That's crazy talk. On youtube, his comparison is listed as Drazen Petrovic and that could be a fair comparison.

Uh Petrovic is a terrible comparison, and not even that flattering, Petrovic wasn't a star when he played and his game would be further exposed in todays NBA.

Wow, someone still living in the 1980s?

The only player that fits his description is probably Spanoulis

On Doncic's own team we have Rudy Fernandez who could have had a decent NBA career, but was took his ball and went back to Spain when he hit a rough patch. And we have Llull who's too scared to even try.

But yeah the 80's

Yes, as the season has gone on, he has clearly been dropping, because it is clear he is exhausted. He has been playing 18 months straight, the only time he got time off was a few weeks when he tweaked an ankle... And yet he has played well enough to still be both Finals and Regular Season MVP...

Next year once he has a proper summer to rest and work out he will be a beast imo.

Played 18 months straight but still has a high bf% hmm...

Surely you will provide a link to these articles that show he has a bad attitude then? I'll wait.
If you can't, your simply making it up.