NBA MVP Discussion '20-'21, Part 2 (Poll created 21 March '21)

[Alatan]

The Jokic narrative that he has an amazing supporting cast is really something, like the narrative changes daily to not get him the MVP (which other MVP candidate doesn't have a second all star right now?)

Basically pull up any Murray, Porter Jr and Gordon highlights. It will feature Jokic getting them wide open looks. Like not just simple double team pass out doubles, it's legitimately him doing point guard **** in a center sized body and forcing multiple defenders out of position.

Ty Lue said it best in the post game today. The Clippers didn't lack awareness or effort on defense, they just had to deal with Jokic on the floor.

I believe when people think of the Nuggets, they thinking of those performances in the bubble. It’s a casual view but a view shared by a lot of people. Jamal Murray looked unstoppable and that viewpoint has carried into this season

Yeah, the hypocrisy that annoys me. If the media and the fans think he is so good why didnt they award Jamal with an allstar appearance?

[eathb_au]

Another thing, Denver has had the best defense in the league since acquiring Aaron Gordon.

Like how Embiid is credited with Simmons and Philly's defense and how LeBron is credited with Davis' and the Lakers defense, is it time to do the same for Jokic now that the Nuggets appear to finally have the pieces defensively.

Or is the narrative going to shift and we'll praise Gordon instead despite him never being an all NBA defender

[irfunk_]

Lebron injured
Embiid injured
Harden is out of consideration because of how he handled situation in Rockets IMO
Jazz and Suns is more of a team effort like 60 win Hawks
Giannis is out of consideration because of his playoff performances IMO

So, Jokic is obvious choose to go with.

[yoyoboy]

Another thing, Denver has had the best defense in the league since acquiring Aaron Gordon.

Like how Embiid is credited with Simmons and Philly's defense and how LeBron is credited with Davis' and the Lakers defense, is it time to do the same for Jokic now that the Nuggets appear to finally have the pieces defensively.

Or is the narrative going to shift and we'll praise Gordon instead despite him never being an all NBA defender

Are you actually using a 3 game sample size to draw a conclusion?

[yoyoboy]

Jokic is my pick for MVP because his offense has been so valuable that his average to slightly below average defense doesn’t detract from him enough. Trying to make him out to be some All-NBA defender in order to strengthen his case when none of the advanced metrics, tracking data, lineup data, or the eye test support that is just hilarious though.

[Ballerhogger]

its good to know general consensus think Jokic is the mvp by over double of Giannis . People say nuggets playoff run wasnt good i disagree. They pulled off amazing upset. AD made game winner 3 buzzer beater that really changed the outlook of the next series.

[LoneyROY]

Anyone know why ESPN's PER is all out of wack? It's like 3+ points higher than basketball-reference's.

[NADALalot]

Another thing, Denver has had the best defense in the league since acquiring Aaron Gordon.

Like how Embiid is credited with Simmons and Philly's defense and how LeBron is credited with Davis' and the Lakers defense, is it time to do the same for Jokic now that the Nuggets appear to finally have the pieces defensively.

Or is the narrative going to shift and we'll praise Gordon instead despite him never being an all NBA defender

And without Embiid in the last 10 games, Philly have only conceded 102.8 points per game.
On the season Philly are conceding 109.1 points per game....

[Sharkboy242]

You get a point guard or have Murray. Offense can run through Embiid from the post. Nuggets have shooters so it would be fine.

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Talking about portability to fit in the same team so no new point guard. Murray can make some amazing highlight worthy passes from time to time but your team is doomed if he is expected to run the show.

Not sure how you think Philly defense well hold up without Embiid buddy.

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Philly in their last 10 games without Embiid have posted up a better defensive rating than with him...

[DCasey91]

Our defense has been superb which surprised me with Embiid out but we are more defensive minded.

Green, Thybulle, Simmons, Howard, that’s one heck of a defensive core.

Our problems has always been on the outside scoring department. We’re not as bad as GSW on the offensive end but it isn’t elite by any means.

Anyway Jokic is my MVP only one adjustment and now it should be smooth sailing from here on out. Not a bad run of games coming up. Hopefully Murray is consistent

The Nets/Nuggets game in the future will be very interesting to see (might be the headline for MVP from the media).

Can’t reward players missing nearly 20 games.

And adding in Hardens whole year he’s behind Jokic for me. Alternatively Harden does have the capability to go bananas so it could get tight down the stretch, but looking at it holistically from start until now Jokic has a better case than all the MVP candidates. Top 3 seed should be a 100% lock.
Barely gets any media attention but people here know he’s the favorite that should tell you something lol
He’s had a quietish week hes def earned it

[trickshot]

Another thing, Denver has had the best defense in the league since acquiring Aaron Gordon.

Like how Embiid is credited with Simmons and Philly's defense and how LeBron is credited with Davis' and the Lakers defense, is it time to do the same for Jokic now that the Nuggets appear to finally have the pieces defensively.

Or is the narrative going to shift and we'll praise Gordon instead despite him never being an all NBA defender

Really got to vet statements like this before posting, AD was 2nd in DPOY voting last year however this season he has barely played so Lebron was the anchor. You don't just arbitrarily give credit for defense if it isn't supported by they eye or stat test

[rzzzzz]

And without Embiid in the last 10 games, Philly have only conceded 102.8 points per game.
On the season Philly are conceding 109.1 points per game....

As your stat Prof in grad school will tell you, Watch out for them confounding variables. Any notion that Embiid ain’t the biggest monster under the rim on both ends of the court is woefully misguided. Which goes exponential with the looming post season half court. “You want numbers? I got plenty numbers” Chico Marx

[eathb_au]

Another thing, Denver has had the best defense in the league since acquiring Aaron Gordon.

Like how Embiid is credited with Simmons and Philly's defense and how LeBron is credited with Davis' and the Lakers defense, is it time to do the same for Jokic now that the Nuggets appear to finally have the pieces defensively.

Or is the narrative going to shift and we'll praise Gordon instead despite him never being an all NBA defender

Really got to vet statements like this before posting, AD was 2nd in DPOY voting last year however this season he has barely played so Lebron was the anchor. You don't just arbitrarily give credit for defense if it isn't supported by they eye or stat test

There still has to give and take. Jokic definitely deserves to be regarded as an elite defender if Denver maintains their defense from since they've acquired Gordon. His defensive stats along with the rest of his team are going to jump up which will support it.

[Ballerhogger]

could Giannis win the mvp if jokic missed time? hes had amazing night tonight 47 points 12 boards 3 blks

[JoeyLightYears]

could Giannis win the mvp if jokic missed time? hes had amazing night tonight 47 points 12 boards 3 blks

If the Bucks get the first seed and the Nuggets stay where they are, it'll put a real dilemma with the voters since Giannis would definitely be the most deserving candidate based on all historical metrics.

And why is Curry on this poll lol

[dygaction]

Another great performance from MDP Giannis.

[Ballerhogger]

could Giannis win the mvp if jokic missed time? hes had amazing night tonight 47 points 12 boards 3 blks

If the Bucks get the first seed and the Nuggets stay where they are, it'll put a real dilemma with the voters since Giannis would definitely be the most deserving candidate based on all historical metrics.

And why is Curry on this poll lol

Idk why curry got the poll other than they were 8th when it was made . Definelty put wrench into Jokic mvp season

[JayMKE]

could Giannis win the mvp if jokic missed time? hes had amazing night tonight 47 points 12 boards 3 blks

If the Bucks get the first seed and the Nuggets stay where they are, it'll put a real dilemma with the voters since Giannis would definitely be the most deserving candidate based on all historical metrics.

And why is Curry on this poll lol

Really the main narrative against Giannis is nonsensical given it’s a regular season award and Jokic(and Harden, and Embiid, and Doncic) haven’t accomplished anything more than he has. Stats are nice but defense is pretty important, Giannis can dominate both sides of the ball which the haters don’t seem to appreciate as much as a pretty outlet pass or the novelty of running your offense thru your center(nevermind that Giannis is a 7 footer bringing the ball up and initiating the offense too)

Narrative voting is just dumb in general, for as much people love the raw numbers they don’t like any tangible metric to determining the MVP.

[dygaction]

Why is Dame #2 in NBA.com mvp latter but not even top 5 in voting on this board?

[GSP]

Why is Dame #2 in NBA.com mvp latter but not even top 5 in voting on this board?

I think ppl might be expecting Portland to come down to earth which they might start doing soon. Their point differential is really bad but Dame has pulled out so many absurd wins in the clutch in games they shouldve lost that theyve been tied with Denver for most of the season. You gotta think that point differential and win loss record is gonna start evening out soon thats prolly why but Dame should be easily top 5 ATM