OKC is a disgrace

[Ayt]

T Wolves have been a bad team forever. How about you list some recent examples like Trae Young, Luka, Booker, Tatum, etc.

How would that make your argument any less terrible?

You’re arguing that a superstar doesn’t help a team win a good enough games. Enough said lol. Also u bring up Kobe as a comparison… that alone is laughable given the success of Kobe’s lakers

If you can't understand my very basic point, you aren't worth talking to.

[bkseven]

How would that make your argument any less terrible?

You’re arguing that a superstar doesn’t help a team win a good enough games. Enough said lol. Also u bring up Kobe as a comparison… that alone is laughable given the success of Kobe’s lakers

If you can't understand my very basic point, you aren't worth talking to.

Well my point is that a “superstar” coming off their rookie contract should help their team win a good amount of games (I.e. okc shouldn’t be a high lotto team).

So don’t understand why u tryna to argue if u are the one responding to my post

[Pointgod]

Good for you, you noticed that Giddey is Australian so he must be like Ingles.

Don't attempt to analyze a player if you haven't watched them.

Oh wow I didn’t know that so many of Josh Giddey’s family members post on here. I’ve read enough scouting reports and listened to scouts and basketball analysts talk about Josh Giddey. The whole glamour around Giddey is that he’s tall and a natural PG. But it doesn’t seem like he can shoot, defend or has the athleticism in a league the prioritizes all 3. To me he sounds like another Dante Exum…oh can’t compare him to another Australian, Evan Turner. I’m sure he’ll be a solid starter, but if you’re in the top half of the lottery you should be thinking allstar potential and OKC took him much earlier than most mocks had him going.

When your fanbase’s whole argument for getting behind Presti not bothering to even try to field an NBA is that it will help your draft position, I’m not sure Josh Giddey is the franchise savior you’re expecting.

So you’ve “read and listened” but you haven’t watched? No offence dude, but you’re way off base with Giddey.

He plays nothing like Exum, nothing like Turner and he sure as hell doesn’t play like Joe Ingles.

He has control and drives like a poor mans Luka. Handle doesn’t seem tight, he doesn’t seem fast yet he somehow always gets to where he wants. His passing is elite.

After watching him and Ball in the NBL, I can do you that he’s right on par, if not better than Lamelo at passing. In your scouting reports I’m sure you would’ve read he’s the best passer in this draft.

He rebounds at an elite level for a PG as well. He needs to work on his shot but he was a better shooter in the NBL than Lamelo and he turned out pretty good.

Don’t underestimate him putting up triple doubles in a league against men which is much harder competition than NCAA.

There is a reason the Warriors were going to draft him and the Grizzlies were desperately trying to move up to get him.

Well none of the draft analysts had Giddey as high as number 6. And it’s irrelevant where other teams were going to take him. The comparison to Lamelo always sounds like someone trying to justify picking Giddey so high.

LaMelo averaged 17 points, 7.5 rebounds and 7 assists while Giddey averaged 10 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists. LaMelo played about 1 minute more than Giddey. On the surface you can look at their FG% and 3pt % which is equal but Giddey shot 67% from the free throw line while LaMelo shot 72%. This leads me to believe that LaMelo was relied on as a scoring threat and saw more defensive attention and took harder shots considering he increased his FG% to 43% in the NBA. Another reason the comparison doesn’t make sense is that LaMelo is more athletic and his best quality is his irrational confidence. LaMelo was in conversation for the 1st pick in the draft all of last year.

I’m watching Giddey in summer league and he seems like a decent prospect (hope he’s fine after hurting his leg) but just based off what I’ve seen so far he needs to work on his outside shot and in between game. Anyways my original comment wasn’t meant to hate on Giddey, I never said he’d be a bust, but I do think he was picked too high. But I was laughing at the fact that OKC fans were expecting to get a shot at the top 4 from all the tanking, but ended up with someone who will most likely be a solid rotation player.

[AussieCeltic]

Oh wow I didn’t know that so many of Josh Giddey’s family members post on here. I’ve read enough scouting reports and listened to scouts and basketball analysts talk about Josh Giddey. The whole glamour around Giddey is that he’s tall and a natural PG. But it doesn’t seem like he can shoot, defend or has the athleticism in a league the prioritizes all 3. To me he sounds like another Dante Exum…oh can’t compare him to another Australian, Evan Turner. I’m sure he’ll be a solid starter, but if you’re in the top half of the lottery you should be thinking allstar potential and OKC took him much earlier than most mocks had him going.

When your fanbase’s whole argument for getting behind Presti not bothering to even try to field an NBA is that it will help your draft position, I’m not sure Josh Giddey is the franchise savior you’re expecting.

So you’ve “read and listened” but you haven’t watched? No offence dude, but you’re way off base with Giddey.

He plays nothing like Exum, nothing like Turner and he sure as hell doesn’t play like Joe Ingles.

He has control and drives like a poor mans Luka. Handle doesn’t seem tight, he doesn’t seem fast yet he somehow always gets to where he wants. His passing is elite.

After watching him and Ball in the NBL, I can do you that he’s right on par, if not better than Lamelo at passing. In your scouting reports I’m sure you would’ve read he’s the best passer in this draft.

He rebounds at an elite level for a PG as well. He needs to work on his shot but he was a better shooter in the NBL than Lamelo and he turned out pretty good.

Don’t underestimate him putting up triple doubles in a league against men which is much harder competition than NCAA.

There is a reason the Warriors were going to draft him and the Grizzlies were desperately trying to move up to get him.

Well none of the draft analysts had Giddey as high as number 6. And it’s irrelevant where other teams were going to take him. The comparison to Lamelo always sounds like someone trying to justify picking Giddey so high.

LaMelo averaged 17 points, 7.5 rebounds and 7 assists while Giddey averaged 10 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists. LaMelo played about 1 minute more than Giddey. On the surface you can look at their FG% and 3pt % which is equal but Giddey shot 67% from the free throw line while LaMelo shot 72%. This leads me to believe that LaMelo was relied on as a scoring threat and saw more defensive attention and took harder shots considering he increased his FG% to 43% in the NBA. Another reason the comparison doesn’t make sense is that LaMelo is more athletic and his best quality is his irrational confidence. LaMelo was in conversation for the 1st pick in the draft all of last year.

I’m watching Giddey in summer league and he seems like a decent prospect (hope he’s fine after hurting his leg) but just based off what I’ve seen so far he needs to work on his outside shot and in between game. Anyways my original comment wasn’t meant to hate on Giddey, I never said he’d be a bust, but I do think he was picked too high. But I was laughing at the fact that OKC fans were expecting to get a shot at the top 4 from all the tanking, but ended up with someone who will most likely be a solid rotation player.

His total season stats are a bit lower because he didn’t play much to start the season being a young rookie. Once he got given the reigns he was putting up near triple double every night.

The fact you say there is a big difference between the FT percentage (5% difference) when it favours Ball but say their FG percentage (5%) and 3point percentage (4.2%) is equal when it favours Giddey shows you’re being disingenuous about the topic.

The comparison to Melo is just, because they were the same age, same league, putting up similar numbers as starters, it’s about as close as you can get. I remember people were hating on the Lamelo pick at the time but I was saying his skills would transfer better to NBA. Giddey is the same and will surprise people.

Also he was pretty consensus to be in the 10-12 range so picking him at 6 isn’t a stretch. This isn’t Josh Primo territory where the Spurs could’ve got him in the second round but picked him 12.

I think if you’re going to make comments on someone, at least make it your own opinion. You admitted you were only basing it off scouting reports and podcasts so the fact you’re in here arguing with people who have watched the kid for a full season is pretty funny to me.

[triple_threat]

And what is the cause of blatant tanking. It's the advent of superteams that leaves the middle of the pack literally helpless. In that it is worse to be a 8 seed than the worst team in the league.

Hinkies and Prestis didn't exist in the 90s when more than 1-2 teams felt like they had a shot at a title

Guess how San Antonio got David Robinson? It was the tank of all tanks.

It's okay to not be a historian of the game and to have only started following it recently. But please trust me that this didn't start with Hinkie. Not even close.

You mean Tim Duncan right？that was a one time opportunistic tank since their franchise player got injured for the year.

Show me a 90s team that actively fielded the worst teams they can before the season even started, and stockpiled picks like Presti and Hinkie did

Lol at you chuck lecturing me about the history.of the game when you cant even get Robinson/Duncan right

Texas Chuck did you respond to this? Honestly looking for your response in the thread. In the event that you didn't, lol.

[jake_swivel]

I’m watching Giddey in summer league and he seems like a decent prospect (hope he’s fine after hurting his leg) but just based off what I’ve seen so far he needs to work on his outside shot and in between game.

Bro, he played four possessions.

[Dupp]

How can they pay Kemba so much not to play. That’s really a terrible direction for any team. Walker could have worked well and found some hornets form and maybe even been trade bait at the least.

[Pointgod]

So you’ve “read and listened” but you haven’t watched? No offence dude, but you’re way off base with Giddey.

He plays nothing like Exum, nothing like Turner and he sure as hell doesn’t play like Joe Ingles.

He has control and drives like a poor mans Luka. Handle doesn’t seem tight, he doesn’t seem fast yet he somehow always gets to where he wants. His passing is elite.

After watching him and Ball in the NBL, I can do you that he’s right on par, if not better than Lamelo at passing. In your scouting reports I’m sure you would’ve read he’s the best passer in this draft.

He rebounds at an elite level for a PG as well. He needs to work on his shot but he was a better shooter in the NBL than Lamelo and he turned out pretty good.

Don’t underestimate him putting up triple doubles in a league against men which is much harder competition than NCAA.

There is a reason the Warriors were going to draft him and the Grizzlies were desperately trying to move up to get him.

Well none of the draft analysts had Giddey as high as number 6. And it’s irrelevant where other teams were going to take him. The comparison to Lamelo always sounds like someone trying to justify picking Giddey so high.

LaMelo averaged 17 points, 7.5 rebounds and 7 assists while Giddey averaged 10 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists. LaMelo played about 1 minute more than Giddey. On the surface you can look at their FG% and 3pt % which is equal but Giddey shot 67% from the free throw line while LaMelo shot 72%. This leads me to believe that LaMelo was relied on as a scoring threat and saw more defensive attention and took harder shots considering he increased his FG% to 43% in the NBA. Another reason the comparison doesn’t make sense is that LaMelo is more athletic and his best quality is his irrational confidence. LaMelo was in conversation for the 1st pick in the draft all of last year.

I’m watching Giddey in summer league and he seems like a decent prospect (hope he’s fine after hurting his leg) but just based off what I’ve seen so far he needs to work on his outside shot and in between game. Anyways my original comment wasn’t meant to hate on Giddey, I never said he’d be a bust, but I do think he was picked too high. But I was laughing at the fact that OKC fans were expecting to get a shot at the top 4 from all the tanking, but ended up with someone who will most likely be a solid rotation player.

His total season stats are a bit lower because he didn’t play much to start the season being a young rookie. Once he got given the reigns he was putting up near triple double every night.

The fact you say there is a big difference between the FT percentage (5% difference) when it favours Ball but say their FG percentage (5%) and 3point percentage (4.2%) is equal when it favours Giddey shows you’re being disingenuous about the topic.

The comparison to Melo is just, because they were the same age, same league, putting up similar numbers as starters, it’s about as close as you can get. I remember people were hating on the Lamelo pick at the time but I was saying his skills would transfer better to NBA. Giddey is the same and will surprise people.

Also he was pretty consensus to be in the 10-12 range so picking him at 6 isn’t a stretch. This isn’t Josh Primo territory where the Spurs could’ve got him in the second round but picked him 12.

I think if you’re going to make comments on someone, at least make it your own opinion. You admitted you were only basing it off scouting reports and podcasts so the fact you’re in here arguing with people who have watched the kid for a full season is pretty funny to me.

I got the numbers from Josh Giddey from here:
https://www.sportingnews.com/au/nba/news/nbl-next-stars-how-does-josh-giddey-stack-up-to-lamelo-balls-rookie-season-in-the-nbl/18s5gdm8e3sic15imiwlza8xzr

Not sure we’re you’re getting your numbers but based on this Giddey shot 37.9% to 37.5% in FGs and 26.1% to 25% in 3 point shooting. Not sure where the discrepancy is I’m just going off the numbers I have and those numbers pretty much show equal performance shooting performance but Lamelo was a better scorer.

I pulled 8 mock drafts and threw in some ones from lesser known guys so you wouldn’t accuse me of media bias. To a T, all of them had Giddey as the number 10 pick, except one who had him as the number 12 pick. I even threw out a lesser known mock that had him at 16 which is think is ridiculously low. There was way more variety regarding where guys like Bouknight, Moody and Sengun should be picked, but it looks like the consensus was that Giddey was around the 10 pick. So at best he was picked 3 or 4 picks too early and at worst he was around 8 picks too early. Either way I don’t see him as the type of player you rest your tanking hopes on.

https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-drafts/
https://www.si.com/nba/2021/07/29/nba-mock-draft-2021-rumors-cade-cunningham-jalen-green-evan-mobley
https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31867997/2021-nba-mock-draft-top-players-jockeying-lottery-position
https://ca.nba.com/news/2021-nba-mock-draft-top-prospects-player-comparisons-profiles-measurements/1ltzgbvbz5ln51gi28a84nybxd
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft
https://watchstadium.com/jeff-goodmans-2021-nba-mock-draft-3-0-final-predictions-07-28-2021/
https://raptorsinsider.ca/2021-nba-mock-draft-lottery-picks/
https://uproxx.com/dimemag/nba-mock-draft-2021-final-cade-cunningham-jalen-green-evan-mobley/

[Darthlukey]

Guess how San Antonio got David Robinson? It was the tank of all tanks.

It's okay to not be a historian of the game and to have only started following it recently. But please trust me that this didn't start with Hinkie. Not even close.

You mean Tim Duncan right？that was a one time opportunistic tank since their franchise player got injured for the year.

Show me a 90s team that actively fielded the worst teams they can before the season even started, and stockpiled picks like Presti and Hinkie did

Lol at you chuck lecturing me about the history.of the game when you cant even get Robinson/Duncan right

Texas Chuck did you respond to this? Honestly looking for your response in the thread. In the event that you didn't, lol.

Boston tanked for Duncan too. and Houston tanked for Akeem. I think why Hinkie attracts so much attention (aside from recency bias) is that Philly brutally tanked for multiple years rather than just 1 season. Mind you, they grabbed injured players (Embiid and Simmons) that couldnt play their rookie years, reducing their chances of competing via high impact lottery picks

[Texas Chuck]

Guess how San Antonio got David Robinson? It was the tank of all tanks.

It's okay to not be a historian of the game and to have only started following it recently. But please trust me that this didn't start with Hinkie. Not even close.

You mean Tim Duncan right？that was a one time opportunistic tank since their franchise player got injured for the year.

Show me a 90s team that actively fielded the worst teams they can before the season even started, and stockpiled picks like Presti and Hinkie did

Lol at you chuck lecturing me about the history.of the game when you cant even get Robinson/Duncan right

Texas Chuck did you respond to this? Honestly looking for your response in the thread. In the event that you didn't, lol.

I didn't. I didn't think a basic typo required a mea culpa. But hey if you want to dunk on me for it, I'm not going to stop you or anyone else. I did make the mistake and did look stupid doing so.

[The_Hater]

Considering they tanked for 4 years and nobody said a word I guess you are right, you have a huge double standard.

and their tanking worked by allowing them to amass enough talent to trade for AD.

Considering AD made it clear that he was only going to the Lakers I don't think their young talent was much of a factor.

It don’t think were getting AD without Ingram, Ball and Hart caliber young talent in the deal. And Magic gave away just about every other good young player they drafted.

But I would also argue that it was a 5 year tank/rebuild. 27-55 on the front end and the 35-47 season before signing Bron on the other end.

[Dr Aki]

What is OKC's plan about the FRPs?

Are they waiting on a superstar with a long contract demanding out?

[triple_threat]

You mean Tim Duncan right？that was a one time opportunistic tank since their franchise player got injured for the year.

Show me a 90s team that actively fielded the worst teams they can before the season even started, and stockpiled picks like Presti and Hinkie did

Lol at you chuck lecturing me about the history.of the game when you cant even get Robinson/Duncan right

Texas Chuck did you respond to this? Honestly looking for your response in the thread. In the event that you didn't, lol.

I didn't. I didn't think a basic typo required a mea culpa. But hey if you want to dunk on me for it, I'm not going to stop you or anyone else. I did make the mistake and did look stupid doing so.

Don't care about the typo lol. It's the actual debate I was interested in.

[LakersSoul]

Back on track:

OKC has executed well. They have a billion draft picks and traded away most vets to give the minutes to their rookies.

Point Guards: Shai / Giddy
Combo G: Maledon / Dort / Mann
Forward: Jerome / Wiggins
PF: Bazley / Roby / Robinson-Earl
C (Bigs): Poku / Brown / Muscala

I like this young and hungry lineup led by Shai. Not enough for playoff but they will fight and after 1-2 more seasons the FO can add the proper vet support to fight for the playoffs.

FO has a great vision and game plan.

[Pointgod]

and their tanking worked by allowing them to amass enough talent to trade for AD.

Considering AD made it clear that he was only going to the Lakers I don't think their young talent was much of a factor.

It don’t think were getting AD without Ingram, Ball and Hart caliber young talent in the deal. And Magic gave away just about every other good young player they drafted.

But I would also argue that it was a 5 year tank/rebuild. 27-55 on the front end and the 35-47 season before signing Bron on the other end.

Lakers didn’t tank. They had a post Achilles tear Kobe on the team and his contract took up a ton of cap room. They tried to be players in free agency going after guys like Melo and Lamarcus Aldridge but they were spurned. Them sucking was a result of front office ineptitude, they signed Deng and Mozgov to 4 year contracts for Christ’s sales. They literally let Julius Randle go for nothing, traded Russell to clear cap space and generally overvalued signing their own mediocre players (Jordan Hill, Nick Young anyone?). They were bad as a result of a garbage front office and just drafted really, really well. They were essentially the anti Presti because they actually tried to sign free agents instead of just accumulating assets, they just failed miserably at it.

[The_Hater]

Considering AD made it clear that he was only going to the Lakers I don't think their young talent was much of a factor.

It don’t think were getting AD without Ingram, Ball and Hart caliber young talent in the deal. And Magic gave away just about every other good young player they drafted.

But I would also argue that it was a 5 year tank/rebuild. 27-55 on the front end and the 35-47 season before signing Bron on the other end.

Lakers didn’t tank. They had a post Achilles tear Kobe on the team and his contract took up a ton of cap room. They tried to be players in free agency going after guys like Melo and Lamarcus Aldridge but they were spurned. Them sucking was a result of front office ineptitude, they signed Deng and Mozgov to 4 year contracts for Christ’s sales. They literally let Julius Randle go for nothing, traded Russell to clear cap space and generally overvalued signing their own mediocre players (Jordan Hill, Nick Young anyone?). They were bad as a result of a garbage front office and just drafted really, really well. They were essentially the anti Presti because they actually tried to sign free agents instead of just accumulating assets, they just failed miserably at it.

I hate the word tank, but I used it in response to one of those posters who thinks any losing season is a tank job.

[Dan Z]

What is OKC's plan about the FRPs?

Are they waiting on a superstar with a long contract demanding out?

I'd be surprised if a superstar asked for a trade to OKC.

[Big J]

What is OKC's plan about the FRPs?

Are they waiting on a superstar with a long contract demanding out?

I'd be surprised if a superstar asked for a trade to OKC.

Another reason that multi year tanks are idiotic. Hell, as a rookie I wouldn't want to go there because you would be competing with a bunch of other rooks & 2nd year guys for time.

[Dr Aki]

What is OKC's plan about the FRPs?

Are they waiting on a superstar with a long contract demanding out?

I'd be surprised if a superstar asked for a trade to OKC.

The point of a long contract is that they can't ask out

I.e. that have no leverage

[Dan Z]

What is OKC's plan about the FRPs?

Are they waiting on a superstar with a long contract demanding out?

I'd be surprised if a superstar asked for a trade to OKC.

The point of a long contract is that they can't ask out

I.e. that have no leverage

Players have leverage despite the length of their contracts. Lets say Damian Liliard does asks to be traded. Do you really think that he won't have some say as to where he wants to go?