Woj/Shams: Ime Udoka Suspended for 2022-23 Season - Inappropriate Relationship, Conduct Violations

[Curmudgeon]

It's pure speciulation that he was sleeping with another executive's wife. And even if he was, what does that have to do with the workplace? She is not a Celtics' employee. And what obligation does an employer have to protect executives against infidelity by their wives? That's your problem, bud.

[bballfan1three3]

At this point doing anything with a female co-worker beyond required work conduct and basic greetings should be keenly avoided by any man. Odds are entirely stacked against us in this day and age.

And before you quote me, no I don't give a damn what your opinion on equality is or your thoughts on why this is akshually a good thing.

Fool... Greeting a woman is for doormen and sexual predators. You must be immediately hostile to all women.. ask them their parentage, where they are from, what their business is. Establish they are a nuisance to be dealt with at an appropriate time. Put them in a different room if you must. Lock your door. If after all this mean behavior they still try to talk to you, report them. Even the harshest court will see your actions as correct. A man's career is more important than a strangers wellbeing. Heed my advice well, or you will be fired...

[kg01]

What consenting adults do behind closed doors is none of our business.

Pretty sure you know it's not that simple.

[Duffman100]

An entire season for this? Seems like a huge punishment for a consensual relationship.

[FlatearthZorro]

I don’t understand the controversy here. You can’t “f***” a Sr. executives wife, have it get out, and seriously think you’re going to keep your job.

The ONLY reason he’s not fired is because (I believe) he’s in a right to work state and that complicates things. If this were in Atlanta, his @$$ would be GONE GONE.

Did he really, I mean this has been confirmed that it was one of the executives' wife? Dang. Who's wife?

As for the implications- they are much bigger than people think when it comes to coorperate workplace/space. Usually, this could lead to law suits, serious league-wide blockback and potentially even the ownership being forced to sell the team. That's why in any big time coorporation, you're now allowed to sleep with women/men especially if you're in a position of power.

Back a few pages someone quoted a tweet that he actually was f***ing more than one woman connected to the Celtics, including a VP and a Sr. VP’s WIFE.

That is the only thing that lends itself to a YEAR LONG suspension making sense. They aren’t giving him this kind of work (no pun intended) for f***ing the towel girl.

Just read on our board and a story is saying that he was sleeping with one of Steve Paggliuca's best buddies wife, who's married with children. I mean, anybody would do that, tbh. If I'm owner and one of my employees is **** my best friend's wife, I would fire them nearly for sure. To me Udoka isn't the sharpest tool in the shed. There are so many women in the US. That's just plain stupid.

[bigpimpatl]

Some men just can't help themselves from plowing every field. As a matter of fact, some men are attracted to the idea that they could potentially ruin their entire life and everyone elses, just to cop one nut. Like thats part of the thrill. I know many people like this, who have actually done it, and continue seeking the same thing afterward. The idea that ALL men are like this though, is utter tripe. And it's not because "they can't", it's because they simply aren't wired that way and don't have those values. Sad as it is, a lot of men are taught from a young age that doing **** like this is something to be respected. And I'm not just talking about cheating, which I don't respect, but w/e not my business. I'm talking about dudes sticking their dick in things that spiral out and affect all kinds of other things. And they continue to compulsively do it anyway. You can say that comes with power, and I'm sure it does. But again, I know people who are regular af people who have blown up relationship after marriage after relationship, banging other peoples wives, getting them pregnant, losing jobs, losing custody of children, losing their homes, and STILL sticking their dick into anything while staying in relationships. Like why not just be SINGLE?? Oh right, "status" *sigh*. And anyway yes I'm assuming Udoka is one of these people, the fact that he is very recently separated is a minor distinction becasue full grown middle aged man sluts don't tend to be discretionary between turning it on and off due to relationship status. But why anyone would want this much drama in their life is just crazy. Can't imagine my dick costing me anything tangible. It's just a nut. You could whack off, or at the very least be way more discrete about it. That thrill of getting caught, I just can't relate to not being able to control that part of your brain. But I'm sure there are people right here on realgm who have lived this and can explain it.

I can explain it
Tube needs to expel fluid, much like a common gasket. Do you own an automobile? You can't have the clutch engaged all the time. You'll burn out the engine. You have to 'park' your 'car' so the 'car' doesn't blow up. Humans and automobiles are remarkably the same in this functioning, in my studies. The 'car' is built to drive, not to stall. If you purposely 'stall' your 'car' you'll ruin it. And get prostate cancer. Ime is trying to save us taxpayers money from his Medicaid's treatments. Good guy ime, imo

yo that's why you need that stage 3 clutch my man!

[FlatearthZorro]

An entire season for this? Seems like a huge punishment for a consensual relationship.

I believe it was to a married woman, wife of Steve Paggliuca's friend, which tbh, if it were me, I'd do the same for a good friend. I don't think the C's would suffer that much. Udoka should've been much smarter, so many women out there.

[MarcusBrody]

What is silly is arguing against actual statistics with supposition. The divorce rate is as low as it's been and has been trending down for a while:

Source:

The biggest reason is that people don't get married as young and don't feel obligated to just to have sex. It lets people wait longer and find better fits. Early (first) marriages have a higher rate of dissolution than later marriages but there are less now.

Bingo. A little digging could have cleared this up. But we hold onto dysfunction because it serves whatever narrative we are aligned with in a given day, even if it isn’t truth. People are entitled to their own opinions. We are NOT entitled to our own “facts”.

This conversation is silly because you guys don’t know the difference between a rate & a percentage.

Kinda sad actually.

I have a PhD in quantitative sociology and am currently a data science professor. I understand the difference between a rate and a percentage. Except... a percentage is a rate. A rate is just the number of occurrences per a set number of something (cases/people/etc) of interest. A percentage is just a rate where the number of occurrences per 100 cases. So when you're looking at divorce rates, you're just looking at a different number of cases (usually per 1000 of the population).

My link didn't work before, but here's one from the Census that might help you understand: https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2020/12/united-states-marriage-and-divorce-rates-declined-last-10-years.html

Now, comparing marriage and divorce rates straight up doesn't fully make sense as they are calculated per 1000 women, so divorce rates will look lower if you have fewer married people (as only married people are eligible for divorce). But we can look at the change in percentages. Marriage rates drop slightly, but divorce rates drop even more. That provides no evidence that divorce is becoming more common (to the contrary, the number of married people is going to be: Number married at T1 + number married - number divorced - number dead - number widowed. Now, things do change a little bit with cohort size, as it's calculated for people over 15, and young people aren't a super large cohort compared to historical numbers (due to the low birth rate) and the group that is now moving into their major mortality risk era is very large, so we're seeing lower proportion of married people in the population as a large, more often married generation is dying/being widowed.

So to make the best comparison, you have to take all that into account, but it's really hard to be in a situation where divorce is increasing while the divorce rate is dropping faster than the marriage rate. You need some very specific demographic shifts, which we're not seeing at the moment.

Now, I'm open to a counterargument, but you're going to need to show me some math to show that it's happening.

[Curmudgeon]

If the Celtics try to suspend or fine him, he will resign and have another had coaching job in two months.

[DaeDae]

It's pure speciulation that he was sleeping with another executive's wife. And even if he was, what does that have to do with the workplace? She is not a Celtics' employee. And what obligation does an employer have to protect executives against infidelity by their wives? That's your problem, bud.

Are you in Sr. Management for a high profile organization? Because I am, and rule number 1 for every one I’ve ever been in is DO NOT **** UP a thriving culture, by creating unnecessary drama in the workplace. This isn’t about protecting the executive. This is about remedying what almost certainly would be a hostile work environment, as a result of private actions. People get fired for their private social media posts and you think f*cking the bosses wife comes with immunity because it’s “private”?

[DaPessimist]

What consenting adults do behind closed doors is none of our business.

The issue is the ambiguity of 'consent'. Maybe she's sleeping with him to move up in the company. Maybe he coerced her into sleeping with him to keep her job.

There are issues with having sex with a subordinate in the corporate power structure, and that's why most large corporations have rules against it. The company I work for won't even allow family members to work in the same region or manage one another.

[UcanUwill]

Sooooo you're saying in the history of the NBA, in which probably 90% of the coaches, executive, and owners have been white, you believe there's never been an instance where an member of the organization had a consensual relationship with a subordinate?

sorry, I need to see FACTS before I accept blatant race baiting as ok.

So you believe Stephen A should air out white executives and coaches to prove a point here?

You guys really debating SAS as in serious manner? Dude is just a racist clown, he has the job for being a jester character that some tasteless people find amusing, but then he has audacity to talk racism problems and accuse people with no evidence. Dude has no self awareness at all, all you are missing is hat with bells, never forget that, no one listens to you for intelligence, they just want to see a clown. We all know SAS is racist, he sees race in everything and is incredibly biased.

[DaeDae]

Right.

Did he really, I mean this has been confirmed that it was one of the executives' wife? Dang. Who's wife?

As for the implications- they are much bigger than people think when it comes to coorperate workplace/space. Usually, this could lead to law suits, serious league-wide blockback and potentially even the ownership being forced to sell the team. That's why in any big time coorporation, you're now allowed to sleep with women/men especially if you're in a position of power.

Back a few pages someone quoted a tweet that he actually was f***ing more than one woman connected to the Celtics, including a VP and a Sr. VP’s WIFE.

That is the only thing that lends itself to a YEAR LONG suspension making sense. They aren’t giving him this kind of work (no pun intended) for f***ing the towel girl.

Just read on our board and a story is saying that he was sleeping with one of Steve Paggliuca's best buddies wife, who's married with children. I mean, anybody would do that, tbh. If I'm owner and one of my employees is **** my best friend's wife, I would fire them nearly for sure. To me Udoka isn't the sharpest tool in the shed. There are so many women in the US. That's just plain stupid.

[Dubnation]

I am almost certain this is a sex in the office type deal.

Damn, I'm glad I didn't get caught.

[DaeDae]

Bingo. A little digging could have cleared this up. But we hold onto dysfunction because it serves whatever narrative we are aligned with in a given day, even if it isn’t truth. People are entitled to their own opinions. We are NOT entitled to our own “facts”.

This conversation is silly because you guys don’t know the difference between a rate & a percentage.

Kinda sad actually.

I have a PhD in quantitative sociology and am currently a data science professor. I understand the difference between a rate and a percentage.

My link didn't work before, but here's one from the Census that might help you understand: https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2020/12/united-states-marriage-and-divorce-rates-declined-last-10-years.html

Now, comparing marriage and divorce rates straight up doesn't fully make sense as they are calculated per 1000 women, so divorce rates will look lower if you have fewer married people (as only married people are eligible for divorce). But we can look at the change in percentages. Marriage rates drop slightly, but divorce rates drop even more. That provides no evidence that divorce is becoming more common (to the contrary, the number of married people is going to be: Number married at T1 + number married - number divorced - number dead - number widowed. Now, things do change a little bit with cohort size, as it's calculated for people over 15, and young people aren't a super large cohort compared to historical numbers (due to the low birth rate) and the group that is now moving into their major mortality risk era is very large, so we're seeing lower proportion of married people in the population as a large, more often married generation is dying/being widowed.

So to make the best comparison, you have to take all that into account, but it's really hard to be in a situation where divorce is increasing while the divorce rate is dropping faster than the marriage rate. You need some very specific demographic shifts, which we're not seeing at the moment.

Now, I'm open to a counterargument, but you're going to need to show me some math to show that it's happening.

You have much more resilience than I do. Respect. When i suggested he Google the data 3 times and he still opted out, I knew there was nothing left to discuss.

But I salute you.

[Duke4life831]

I think may be disingenuous here.

I've read every page of this thread, and general consensus is it's inappropriate to date people who are under you.

That's exactly what Buss did, so it should be seen as equally inappropriate, regardless of team policy.

I mean it really all depends. Ive worked at a place where they said no interoffice relationships were allowed (even people who had even level power). While my dad has worked at a big time research institute and the CEO is married to a lower level supervisor. Some places have a strict no go policy with stuff like this, some places have them fill out forms stating their personal life wont interfere with work. With stuff like this, it really can come down to individual work environments. Unless the NBA as a general corporation has a blanket policy on this.

I understand. Am I alone in hearing the idea of NEVER dating your subordinate as a very general, blanketed unwritten rule across all professions?

It's been expressed in this thread alone at least a handful times.

Your response is fair and measured. Most people when speaking of this say it should never happen because the subordinate is placed in a position of fear to say no. This is the general perception I'm speaking of. I think there's a ton of nuance in these situations that get ignored.

No I dont think youre alone in hearing that. I hear it all the time. And I would think that in the majority of places that is the rule. Im just throwing out personal anecdotal situations that I know of first hand where its not always like that. Where again they have both parties sign some forms stating they wont let their personal life interfere and so on. But yes I think the majority of times you will see the rule of no dating a subordinate.

But again with that said when it comes to this specific scenario. Im not sure we would be seeing this kind of reaction from the Celtics organization if it was as simple as Ime dating a subordinate. Again I think we would see more of rising scale of punishment, like starting out with Ime being suspended for the opening night for conduct detrimental to the team. And if nothing changes after that, maybe harsher and harsher punishments. I have a hard time seeing them going straight to talks of firing him or suspending him for a full year.

And I know many have brought up Rosas being fired for a consensual relationship, if I recall correctly. It was a lot more than just that for why he got fired. That was kind of just viewed as the last straw with him. I believe I read multiple articles describing how the Wolves had received many complaints over and over again about him and how he created a very toxic and dysfunctional workplace (this was all prior to them finding out he was dating someone in the organization).

[mademan]

I don’t understand the controversy here. You can’t “f***” a Sr. executives wife, have it get out, and seriously think you’re going to keep your job.

The ONLY reason he’s not fired is because (I believe) he’s in a right to work state and that complicates things. If this were in Atlanta, his @$$ would be GONE GONE.

Reason he isnt fired is because he has a contract and the C's dont want to pay him to coach on some other team

I still wonder how that works in a R2W state. Contracts are terminated all the time down here. Maybe it’s a Union issue. Because we largely don’t have unions down here either.

Im sure there’s vague wording on coaching contracts that will enable the C’s to terminate his contract. But his contract is like 10 millish and the coaches union will fight it. For a multi billion dollar organization, is this worth the fight? They’re probably hoping he resigns, but I don’t see why he would. Which is why I see a settlement. I have no idea how a full season suspension is supposed to work. He’s just gonna show up in a year like nothing happened? Lol

[Froob]

I think Ime will resign.

[Capn'O]

Everyone out here having this moral argument and I'm just over here like "JUICAYYYYY!"

An entire season for this? Seems like a huge punishment for a consensual relationship.

Somebody high up got big mad.

I think Ime will resign.

He can't come back. The level of passive/aggressive would be off the chain. They'll do **** like move his office to North Station, put laxatives in his coffee, and "accidentally" erase everything on his whiteboard if he tries. To the extent that I ever feel bad for Celtics fans I feel for you guys as he was a damn good coach for you.

[azcatz11]

In what world is a job like "Team service Manager" considered high ranking , public facing or expected to come with public exposure like this? Can you name a single person in a similar role in any other NBA team? Or any other professional sports organization? Could you even find that information online if you tried?

I think if you work for an NBA team your position is pretty public. Is it in bad taste? Yes, probably. But I don't think it's a huge deal. I don't thin it's defamation.

Most positions in an NBA organization are NOT public, in any form. Come on. General manager? Sure. How do we know this? Because when a team hires a GM, or President or Personnel, or Lead Scout, there's a press release. I worked for the Sixers for two years, trust, you've NEVER heard of me. LOL

Your information would be public on the sixers website (email address etc)

We can agree to disagree