Would James Harden and Blake Griffin for Lonzo Ball and Nikola Vucevic trade be upgrade for the Nets ?

[Magic_Johnny12]

Wow, if last year you would have proposed a Lonzo/Vucevic for Harden trade the post would probably get immediately locked and clown face emojis everywhere.

Look how far we've gone.

[DarkXaero]

Nets laugh and hang up. Ridiculous trade idea.

Neither team is making a move like this in reality. They have the top 2 records in the east.

When you take that out of the equation... Harden either walks or gets paid this summer. If they don't win it all this year, do they pay KD and Harden 100M a year into their mid 30s?

Yes, Nets have made a huge investment in James Harden, he has to be re-signed. People are acting like Harden is suddenly terrible now, he's still playing at all star level despite the struggles. He'll get better over the course of the season, I'm optimistic about that. Once the Nets roster is healthy and available (including Kyrie), he'll be back to his best or near his best.

[DarkXaero]

Wow, if last year you would have proposed a Lonzo/Vucevic for Harden trade the post would probably get immediately locked and clown face emojis everywhere.

Look how far we've gone.

It still deserves clown emojis and an immediate lock.

[InsideInfo]

I still want to believe james harden is ten times better than anyone on bulls roster.. but with him and durant jn brooklyn, anything less than a championship would already would validate that I am wrong that Harden wouldnt do anything better on a team that has 2 dominant scorers and is already on his 30s and in line on a huge payday

Ten times better huh?

Harden can lead scrubs to 50 wins while putting up MVP numbers. We've seen him to do it.

Who on the Bulls can do that? Put DeRozan, LaVine, etc. with scrubs and that team wouldn't even crack 22 wins.

When was he doing that? 16/17 was the last 50 win team that you could argue he was playing with scrubs.

My mistake, i thought we were talking about current James Harden. If we are talking about making this trade for 28 year old James Harden making under 30M a season, then sure lets talk trade.

FOH. Ppl are so blinded by a star name. James Harden is not 10x better than DDR or Lavine.

[panthermark]

The one thing the Bulls DON'T need is a ball dominant, no defense playing, scoring wing.
This is a no from the Bulls because he does not really fit what the Bulls need.

The Bulls need three things:
*A good 3&D PF (it would be nice if Patrick Williams could turn into this, but we will see what shakes loose at the deadline).

*Some bench scoring (it would be nice of Coby White could do this on a consistent basis, but we will see what shakes loose at the deadline).

*Vuc to get back to his old self (he is starting to show signs of heating up). Over his last 3 games (all wins), he has shot 23 of 45 (51.1%), including 7 of 17 from deep (41.2%). He is averaging 17.6 ppg and 11.3 rpb over that stretch....and is actually on the good side of +/- for those games as well.

[Optms]

Ten times better huh?

Harden can lead scrubs to 50 wins while putting up MVP numbers. We've seen him to do it.

Who on the Bulls can do that? Put DeRozan, LaVine, etc. with scrubs and that team wouldn't even crack 22 wins.

When was he doing that? 16/17 was the last 50 win team that you could argue he was playing with scrubs.

My mistake, i thought we were talking about current James Harden. If we are talking about making this trade for 28 year old James Harden making under 30M a season, then sure lets talk trade.

FOH. Ppl are so blinded by a star name. James Harden is not 10x better than DDR or Lavine.

Harden hasn't left his prime. He was the MVP favorite before he got hurt last season and he's been putting MVP numbers without KD this season, particular lately.

I'm not blinded by anything. I am just going by what I have seen and Harden took a bum team to 50+ wins in 2019. And carried Russell Westbrook and a bum Rockets team to the playoffs in 2020. What have any of those Bulls players done? I'll wait.

[InsideInfo]

Nets laugh and hang up. Ridiculous trade idea.

Neither team is making a move like this in reality. They have the top 2 records in the east.

When you take that out of the equation... Harden either walks or gets paid this summer. If they don't win it all this year, do they pay KD and Harden 100M a year into their mid 30s?

Yes, Nets have made a huge investment in James Harden, he has to be re-signed. People are acting like Harden is suddenly terrible now, he's still playing at all star level despite the struggles. He'll get better over the course of the season, I'm optimistic about that. Once the Nets roster is healthy and available (including Kyrie), he'll be back to his best or near his best.

So youre telling me if the Nets dont win it all, you would like to see your team who is already paying KD just under 50M per season at age 34, 35, 36, and 37... resign Harden for similar pay to play with him at age 33, 34, 35, and 36?

Have fun with that.

[pipfan]

I agree that neither team would do it
But, as a Bulls' fan I wouldn't trade Ball for Harden, straight up. Part of it is that I like watching players who I enjoy, and Harden is one of my least favorite players ever.
Part of it is we already have Lavine and DDR-elite scorers. Plus, Vuc seems to be coming around and is an elite 3rd option. Ball is a first team All Defense guy who spreads the floor and plays his ass off.
Harden is a HoF guy, but his attitude would not be welcome in Chic

[ImSlower]

You guys keep vaunting Harden's scoring acumen, which is absolutely there. He's amazing at getting his team points. Of course he's far more valuable than Vuc and Ball.

He's be absolutely ruinous to Bulls roster he'd be coming to. You guys are looking at this amazing player and think he automatically upgrades a roster without looking at the team that'd be around him post trade.

This trade would make the Bulls flimsy frontcourt absolutely, comically pitiful. It would negate the synergy the Bulls have going with LaVine and DeRozan. DDR goes from top5 scorer and 4th quarter hero to an afterthought as Harden does his usual tunnel vision dribble iso garbage. Zach becomes a spot-up 3pt shooter. Both those guys are immediately unhappy that their roles, which have led to the most successful Bulls start in a decade, would be upended by the enormous gravity Harden requires. The entire momentum this team has built up would disappear in one day. Then Harden opts for 54 million and there's zero room to actually create a roster around him. Or he more likely bolts to a far better situation on a big new contract.

I understand that Harden is a great player and gets the Nets wins. This specific trade, to this specific team, would be an unmitigated disaster. It's completely illogical. Neither team would have an iota of interest.

[Bulls2021]

LOL.

The Bulls don't need elite scoring.

I'm done.

Take a quick peek at the top 10 scorers in the league. I think you’re still living in 2020. Chicago is also sixth in offensive rating.

And they couldn't use another one? This is a serious conversation?

There's no need to defend this dumb trade idea because one of your players is involved. It's obvious this would be a **** trade for the Bulls. Do a little more research into these players this year. It seems you've done little into the Bulls players involved.

[InsideInfo]

Harden can lead scrubs to 50 wins while putting up MVP numbers. We've seen him to do it.

Who on the Bulls can do that? Put DeRozan, LaVine, etc. with scrubs and that team wouldn't even crack 22 wins.

When was he doing that? 16/17 was the last 50 win team that you could argue he was playing with scrubs.

My mistake, i thought we were talking about current James Harden. If we are talking about making this trade for 28 year old James Harden making under 30M a season, then sure lets talk trade.

FOH. Ppl are so blinded by a star name. James Harden is not 10x better than DDR or Lavine.

Harden hasn't left his prime. He was the MVP favorite before he got hurt last season and he's been putting MVP numbers without KD this season, particular lately.

I'm not blinded by anything. I am just going by what I have seen and Harden took a bum team to 50+ wins in 2019. And carried Russell Westbrook and a bum Rockets team to the playoffs in 2020. What have any of those Bulls players done? I'll wait.

Chris Paul is a bum?

[InsideInfo]

You guys keep vaunting Harden's scoring acumen, which is absolutely there. He's amazing at getting his team points. Of course he's far more valuable than Vuc and Ball.

He's be absolutely ruinous to Bulls roster he'd be coming to. You guys are looking at this amazing player and think he automatically upgrades a roster without looking at the team that'd be around him post trade.

This trade would make the Bulls flimsy frontcourt absolutely, comically pitiful. It would negate the synergy the Bulls have going with LaVine and DeRozan. DDR goes from top5 scorer and 4th quarter hero to an afterthought as Harden does his usual tunnel vision dribble iso garbage. Zach becomes a spot-up 3pt shooter. Both those guys are immediately unhappy that their roles, which have led to the most successful Bulls start in a decade, would be upended by the enormous gravity Harden requires. The entire momentum this team has built up would disappear in one day. Then Harden opts for 54 million and there's zero room to actually create a roster around him. Or he more likely bolts to a far better situation on a big new contract.

I understand that Harden is a great player and gets the Nets wins. This specific trade, to this specific team, would be an unmitigated disaster. It's completely illogical. Neither team would have an iota of interest.

This.

Good god you nets fans are so overprotective of this guy it's not even funny.

Bulls say no. Im sorry this happened to you.

Every single person in here saying otherwise has a nets icon next to their name.

[DarkXaero]

Neither team is making a move like this in reality. They have the top 2 records in the east.

When you take that out of the equation... Harden either walks or gets paid this summer. If they don't win it all this year, do they pay KD and Harden 100M a year into their mid 30s?

Yes, Nets have made a huge investment in James Harden, he has to be re-signed. People are acting like Harden is suddenly terrible now, he's still playing at all star level despite the struggles. He'll get better over the course of the season, I'm optimistic about that. Once the Nets roster is healthy and available (including Kyrie), he'll be back to his best or near his best.

So youre telling me if the Nets dont win it all, you would like to see your team who is already paying KD just under 50M per season at age 34, 35, 36, and 37... resign Harden for similar pay to play with him at age 33, 34, 35, and 36?

Have fun with that.

Yes, these are still all-star and all NBA caliber players at their ages, and we're trying to win a title. So many kept telling Nets fans that KD wouldn't be the same after achilles injury, that he would be Khris Middleton level, and he's a MVP candidate at age 33 right now. Demar Derozan himself is 32 btw.

[DarkXaero]

You guys keep vaunting Harden's scoring acumen, which is absolutely there. He's amazing at getting his team points. Of course he's far more valuable than Vuc and Ball.

He's be absolutely ruinous to Bulls roster he'd be coming to. You guys are looking at this amazing player and think he automatically upgrades a roster without looking at the team that'd be around him post trade.

This trade would make the Bulls flimsy frontcourt absolutely, comically pitiful. It would negate the synergy the Bulls have going with LaVine and DeRozan. DDR goes from top5 scorer and 4th quarter hero to an afterthought as Harden does his usual tunnel vision dribble iso garbage. Zach becomes a spot-up 3pt shooter. Both those guys are immediately unhappy that their roles, which have led to the most successful Bulls start in a decade, would be upended by the enormous gravity Harden requires. The entire momentum this team has built up would disappear in one day. Then Harden opts for 54 million and there's zero room to actually create a roster around him. Or he more likely bolts to a far better situation on a big new contract.

I understand that Harden is a great player and gets the Nets wins. This specific trade, to this specific team, would be an unmitigated disaster. It's completely illogical. Neither team would have an iota of interest.

This.

Good god you nets fans are so overprotective of this guy it's not even funny.

Bulls say no. Im sorry this happened to you.

Every single person in here saying otherwise has a nets icon next to their name.

You two do realize that Lonzo Ball + Vuc in place of Harden for Nets is even worse than all that, right? Nets don't even like playing with proper centers, Vuc would be an awful fit here.

[InsideInfo]

Yes, Nets have made a huge investment in James Harden, he has to be re-signed. People are acting like Harden is suddenly terrible now, he's still playing at all star level despite the struggles. He'll get better over the course of the season, I'm optimistic about that. Once the Nets roster is healthy and available (including Kyrie), he'll be back to his best or near his best.

So youre telling me if the Nets dont win it all, you would like to see your team who is already paying KD just under 50M per season at age 34, 35, 36, and 37... resign Harden for similar pay to play with him at age 33, 34, 35, and 36?

Have fun with that.

Yes, these are still all-star and all NBA caliber players at their ages, and we're trying to win a title. So many kept telling Nets fans that KD wouldn't be the same after achilles injury, that he would be Khris Middleton level, and he's a MVP candidate at age 33 right now. Demar Derozan himself is 32 btw.

DDR makes half the money... and for a shorter duration. His deal ends when he is 34.

[Goomba3666]

Would be a HUGE upgrade for the Nets for no reason at all. Lol.

Wouldn't make sense for the Bulls to do this.

[InsideInfo]

You guys keep vaunting Harden's scoring acumen, which is absolutely there. He's amazing at getting his team points. Of course he's far more valuable than Vuc and Ball.

He's be absolutely ruinous to Bulls roster he'd be coming to. You guys are looking at this amazing player and think he automatically upgrades a roster without looking at the team that'd be around him post trade.

This trade would make the Bulls flimsy frontcourt absolutely, comically pitiful. It would negate the synergy the Bulls have going with LaVine and DeRozan. DDR goes from top5 scorer and 4th quarter hero to an afterthought as Harden does his usual tunnel vision dribble iso garbage. Zach becomes a spot-up 3pt shooter. Both those guys are immediately unhappy that their roles, which have led to the most successful Bulls start in a decade, would be upended by the enormous gravity Harden requires. The entire momentum this team has built up would disappear in one day. Then Harden opts for 54 million and there's zero room to actually create a roster around him. Or he more likely bolts to a far better situation on a big new contract.

I understand that Harden is a great player and gets the Nets wins. This specific trade, to this specific team, would be an unmitigated disaster. It's completely illogical. Neither team would have an iota of interest.

This.

Good god you nets fans are so overprotective of this guy it's not even funny.

Bulls say no. Im sorry this happened to you.

Every single person in here saying otherwise has a nets icon next to their name.

You two do realize that Lonzo Ball + Vuc in place of Harden for Nets is even worse than all that, right? Nets don't even like playing with proper centers, Vuc would be an awful fit here.

Thats fine. You dont have an argue that the nets would be worse. The point everyone is arguing is that the bulls would be better with Harden.

[Lunartic]

If you take into account the contract status issue, it's a hard no from the Bulls simply b/c Harden may not re-sign.

If he verbally agrees to sign for another 3-4 years, then I do the trade and then immediately start looking to shop Harden for players better than Ball/Vuc. Something like Brogdon/Sabonis/picks or KAT or Lamelo/whatever.

All the people arguing that Harden would instantly upgrade the Bulls, you're probably not watching Bulls games. Harden is averaging 21/9/8 which is solid but he's also hugely ball dominant, shot jacker that can freeze out teammates while he's setting the table/stepback shooting. Lavine is arguably as good a scorer as he is this season and DDR has been a legit MVP candidate. Harden is good and talent wins games so I imagine they could make it work with a couple additional trades for a bigman.

If Harden were 28/29, I'd do it in a heartbeat but he's 32 and clearly declining so it's not a clearcut decision.

[Funcrusher]

RealGM makes me think half the posters are borderline inbreds at this point, and i say that respectfully

[bearadonisdna]

You guys keep vaunting Harden's scoring acumen, which is absolutely there. He's amazing at getting his team points. Of course he's far more valuable than Vuc and Ball.

He's be absolutely ruinous to Bulls roster he'd be coming to. You guys are looking at this amazing player and think he automatically upgrades a roster without looking at the team that'd be around him post trade.

This trade would make the Bulls flimsy frontcourt absolutely, comically pitiful. It would negate the synergy the Bulls have going with LaVine and DeRozan. DDR goes from top5 scorer and 4th quarter hero to an afterthought as Harden does his usual tunnel vision dribble iso garbage. Zach becomes a spot-up 3pt shooter. Both those guys are immediately unhappy that their roles, which have led to the most successful Bulls start in a decade, would be upended by the enormous gravity Harden requires. The entire momentum this team has built up would disappear in one day. Then Harden opts for 54 million and there's zero room to actually create a roster around him. Or he more likely bolts to a far better situation on a big new contract.

I understand that Harden is a great player and gets the Nets wins. This specific trade, to this specific team, would be an unmitigated disaster. It's completely illogical. Neither team would have an iota of interest.

This.

Good god you nets fans are so overprotective of this guy it's not even funny.

Bulls say no. Im sorry this happened to you.

Every single person in here saying otherwise has a nets icon next to their name.

You two do realize that Lonzo Ball + Vuc in place of Harden for Nets is even worse than all that, right? Nets don't even like playing with proper centers, Vuc would be an awful fit here.

1st I want to say what defines better?
Here seems like a lateral , the team is already in1st place?

Basically the debate is set , bulls won’t do this based on contract . Right now it’s really just semantics about on the court , which makes for interesting discussion.

Like some have said , Harden is kind of Westbrook lite with a jumper .

Harden doesn’t seem valued up there because it seems he needs bailing out every night . He has the ball all night , left to his own devices and generally KD has to be Superman every night.

Now Vuc brings in a double double just like harden . Vuc can get to 20 ppg but even when he is hot the game usually does not require the volume because of Zach and Demar , and sometimes Lonzo as a 1a ball handler with elite 3 point shooting .

There In brings the value of value of the trade to the Nets . He gives you a big 2 with a pointguard vs just a big 2 who doubles as a pointguard .