Westbrook on Vogel: “I don’t know what his issue was with me”

[bigbreakfast]

......in terms of difficulty to coach? Which is the entire topic of conversation? My point is prime Bosh/Wade/Bron were much tougher to coach than old LeBron/Westbrook and Davis. Spolstra handed it to the tune of 4 straight Finals and 2 rings and Ty Lue handled it the same way in MUCH higher stakes than Vogel did.

Point being, Vogel didnt have that hard of a coaching situation comparatively. Maybe hes just not a good coach. Spo/Lue got it done 4 years a piece in harder situations. Vogel failed in 4 years in a easier situation.

Ty Lue and Eric Spoelstra are both great coaches. So is Frank Vogel. I don't get this comparison you're trying to make though. Miami were supposed to win not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6, not 7... and only ended up with 2. Also, Vogel has only been coach of the Lakers for 3 seasons... and AD got injured in the playoffs last season, missed a whole bunch of games this season... and none of Lebron, Wade, Bosh or AD are as boneheaded as Westbrick.

The comparison I was trying to make was the OP saying "Imagine trying to deal with headcases like Westbrook/LeBron"

and thats why I cited Lue/Spo as examples of coaches that have coached multiple 'headcases' in harder situations and ended up still looking a lot better than Vogel has.

so you're saying ty lue or spoelstra would've coached this team to success? i'm not sure that would be the case. I seem to recall spoelstra was always in the news/hot seat as well in the big 3era, riley was the stabilizing force. even though spoelstra was coaching well his name was the first that came up whenever something went wrong. it's just the nature of of the gig. i also think winning has alot of stabilizing effect and minimizes dysfunction. it just so happens this team is poorly constructed and dealt w/ significant injuries to their stars and if you're implying spoelstra or lue would've done significantly better under the same circumstances, i dont think so.

[Vampirate]

Westbrook really can't say crap about Vogel, simply put Vogel has a championship, Westbrook does not.

[Kilroy]

Everyone knows Vogel is a Defense oriented coach and tends to play those players around AD and LeBron who play good D...

Does this trigger any revelations Russell?

[TOStateofMind]

Good luck to whoever gets this dude next. Simply the last guy id ever want on my team.

[Karate Diop]

KD was right about Russ. Ain't nobody winning with him.

[LakersLegacy]

They asked WB if he got coaching instructions to try different strategies when LeBron and AD were injured.

WB replied that the coach never did that but it would have been a good idea and appreciated

[TheLand13]

Ty Lou and Eric Spolstra have had zero problem doing it with many more stars/egos than Vogel has.

Maybe the problem isnt the players....maybe its the coach.

Whats harder than coaching LeBron/Russ/AD? Probably coaching LeBron/Wade/Bosh after in their primes after they turned into Public Enemy #1 across the entire NBA. Also probably dealing with LeBrons ego, Kyries insanity and Loves emotion while going to 4 straight NBA Finals.

Cmon. Vogel just isnt a good coach for star players.

How are you going to compare a wash up Lebron and Westbrook to a prime Bosh, Wade and lebron.

......in terms of difficulty to coach? Which is the entire topic of conversation? My point is prime Bosh/Wade/Bron were much tougher to coach than old LeBron/Westbrook and Davis. Spolstra handed it to the tune of 4 straight Finals and 2 rings and Ty Lue handled it the same way in MUCH higher stakes than Vogel did.

Point being, Vogel didnt have that hard of a coaching situation comparatively. Maybe hes just not a good coach. Spo/Lue got it done 4 years a piece in harder situations. Vogel failed in 4 years in a easier situation.

Spo had the full backing and support of Pat Riley, to the point where when LeBron wanted a different coach, Riley told him to **** off. At that point, LeBron had no choice but to fully buy into the system or go somewhere else. That doesn't mean he didn't have his moments of leeway, but he still in the end had to swallow his pride and do what he was told.

Vogel was in a different situation entirely. LeBron still had a pretty good amount of control over what went on, and then there was Russ to deal with on top of it. There's a reason Russ still got his way, even if Vogel got sick of it eventually and benched him. I'm not going to act like Vogel did everything right, but he is getting an unfair amount of flack for how this season went down. He was dealt a very poor hand and had very little room to work with. I don't see how firing him is the right direction to go.

Let me put it another way giving my team as an example. When LeBron James came to Cleveland, David Blatt, one of the great basketball minds of the world, couldn't fully implement the offensive schemes that he wanted to because LeBron James didn't think they would work. Now imagine that happening in LA, only in this case LeBron somehow has even more leeway and it's with a coach who isn't on Blatt's level. You can imagine why that must have been a major challenge for Vogel.

[canada_dry]

Westbrook is the most stubborn and least self-aware player I've ever seen. This is a major prediction but I don't think he will be in the NBA after next year. Even though he can still play, no team will want his attitude. He will be like Melo before Melo humbled himself. I don't see Russell ever humbling himself.

Allen Iverson situation all over again.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

[Pharmcat]

Everyone knows Vogel is a Defense oriented coach and tends to play those players around AD and LeBron who play good D...

Does this trigger any revelations Russell?

Then why did lakers trade away all those defenders and bring in WB? Surely WB thought his way to play was the reason…

[Pharmcat]

How are you going to compare a wash up Lebron and Westbrook to a prime Bosh, Wade and lebron.

......in terms of difficulty to coach? Which is the entire topic of conversation? My point is prime Bosh/Wade/Bron were much tougher to coach than old LeBron/Westbrook and Davis. Spolstra handed it to the tune of 4 straight Finals and 2 rings and Ty Lue handled it the same way in MUCH higher stakes than Vogel did.

Point being, Vogel didnt have that hard of a coaching situation comparatively. Maybe hes just not a good coach. Spo/Lue got it done 4 years a piece in harder situations. Vogel failed in 4 years in a easier situation.

Spo had the full backing and support of Pat Riley, to the point where when LeBron wanted a different coach, Riley told him to **** off. At that point, LeBron had no choice but to fully buy into the system or go somewhere else. That doesn't mean he didn't have his moments of leeway, but he still in the end had to swallow his pride and do what he was told.

Vogel was in a different situation entirely. LeBron still had a pretty good amount of control over what went on, and then there was Russ to deal with on top of it. There's a reason Russ still got his way, even if Vogel got sick of it eventually and benched him. I'm not going to act like Vogel did everything right, but he is getting an unfair amount of flack for how this season went down. He was dealt a very poor hand and had very little room to work with. I don't see how firing him is the right direction to go.

Let me put it another way giving my team as an example. When LeBron James came to Cleveland, David Blatt, one of the great basketball minds of the world, couldn't fully implement the offensive schemes that he wanted to because LeBron James didn't think they would work. Now imagine that happening in LA, only in this case LeBron somehow has even more leeway and it's with a coach who isn't on Blatt's level. You can imagine why that must have been a major challenge for Vogel.

Vogel did some bad things , but no one is winning anything with these nursing home roster. He was just the low hanging fruit to get rid of

[Ballerhogger]

Everyone knows Vogel is a Defense oriented coach and tends to play those players around AD and LeBron who play good D...

Does this trigger any revelations Russell?

or how about being TO MACHINE.. Think hes magic...... Michael Jordan come get your man

[Baski]

“Russ [Westbrook) never respected Frank [Vogel] from Day 1,” said one Lakers staff member with knowledge of the situation. “The moment Frank said anybody who gets the rebound can bring it up the court, which is just how the NBA is played these days, Russ was like, ‘Naw, I’m the point guard. Give the ball to me. Everybody run. Frank was like, ‘No, we have Talen [Horton-Tucker)] We have Austin [Reaves]. We have Malik. We have LeBron. We have AD. They can all bring the ball up.’ He was like, ‘Nope, I’m the point guard. Give me that s—. Everybody get out the way.

“From that point on, in training camp, it was a wrap, ‘cause now Russ is a fish out of water. He doesn’t know what to do. That’s how that started.”

https://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/story/2022-04-08/inside-la-lakers-disappointing-season-lebron-james-anthony-davis

This has got to be fake. Either a lie or whoever gave this account greatly exaggerated the exchange. If this was how Westbrook behaved normally there wouldn't be as many former teammates of his singing his praises. This is just a comical display of disrespect and arrogance that only the most delusional and entitled players would show. Strongly believe this isn't how it went down.

[Pablo Escobar]

Vogel wanted 3nD guys. And Lebron goes and gets him a bricklayer.

[SD2042]

Why do I have a feeling that the Lakers are going to dominate media coverage even with the playoffs going on? If the Nets lose early it'll probably go into overdrive.

If LBJ is on a team, trust that he will get the coverage. The Lakers have been a sports opera series all season long. The more drama th more coverage it gets. Just because the Lakers season is over. It doesn't mean the drama has ended just yet.

[Yeggo Poleggo]

I genuinely feel bad for any franchise whom has had Russell Westbrook or will have him throughout the rest of his career.

It's such a disaster.

[ChaseDown]

“Russ [Westbrook) never respected Frank [Vogel] from Day 1,” said one Lakers staff member with knowledge of the situation. “The moment Frank said anybody who gets the rebound can bring it up the court, which is just how the NBA is played these days, Russ was like, ‘Naw, I’m the point guard. Give the ball to me. Everybody run. Frank was like, ‘No, we have Talen [Horton-Tucker)] We have Austin [Reaves]. We have Malik. We have LeBron. We have AD. They can all bring the ball up.’ He was like, ‘Nope, I’m the point guard. Give me that s—. Everybody get out the way.

“From that point on, in training camp, it was a wrap, ‘cause now Russ is a fish out of water. He doesn’t know what to do. That’s how that started.”

https://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/story/2022-04-08/inside-la-lakers-disappointing-season-lebron-james-anthony-davis

That's quite disgusting if it's true. Even though I should not believe things without question, I find this easy to believe because we saw something similar in that game when Vogel first benched Russ. At a moment in the game when the Lakers were down, Russ went to Lebron and AD to supposedly "support them" by telling them that he wished he could help them but Vogel didn't have him playing. You could even see on Lebron and AD's faces that what he said was a WTF moment for them.

Do you happen to have a link to this? I’m curious to see.

[Sedale Threatt]

See...**** like this is what makes me dislike Russ a lot. Get this bum of the team. Go be Russ in the Iraqi div 6 league.

He led the Lakers in almost every category statistically this season. Keep hating though.

Probably -- and I'm just theorizing here -- because our two vastly superior star players missed 26 and 42 games.

[Sedale Threatt]

Lol we just un-stickied the Lakers mega thread and immediately got a new Vogel thread, a new Bron thread, a new Russ thread, there's an Austin Reaves thread, and an old Lakers thread was bumped.

Bless your poor heart.

What I can never figure out is that the Lakers forum is basically dead. It was never one of the bigger groups, certainly not like the Knicks or the Bulls or Bucks or definitely not the Raptors. But it was relatively vibrant when I joined and for years after that. And it's just withered away to almost nothing recently. But you head out here to the GB and every other topic is about them. It's weird.

[Tracymcgoaty]

See...**** like this is what makes me dislike Russ a lot. Get this bum of the team. Go be Russ in the Iraqi div 6 league.

He led the Lakers in almost every category statistically this season. Keep hating though.

I actually watched the games. He was awful for about 90% of them. Looked decent the last 10%. If MJ is stupid enough to have him i'll be ecstatic. Get this cancer of the team let him infect some other team stupid enough to get him.

[slicedbread2]

Keep in mind that the LA times are owned by Patrick Soon-Shiong, a minority owner of the Lakers who bought Magic Johnson's 5% stake in 2010 for $60M.

With that out of the way, are we really surprised? The Lakers made the cardinal sin of giving away 2 good role players in Kuzma+KCP and a 1st+Harrell who wasn't a good fit on the team for a glorified bricklayer who refuses to acknowledge the reality that he's in. Plus he and LBJ weren't gonna play off the ball and combined with the fact that he's a low IQ player that makes dumb decisions no wonder Vogel looked miserable most of the year knowing that LBJ's decision to bring him in meant it was gonna be a long year.

Best thing for the Lakers if you can't get a trade done is to just buy him out. Don't stretch him and just bite the bullet.