Who Would You Rather Have: Jalen Duren Or Alperen Sengun?

[RoyceDa59]

Duran is beastin!

[sca]

Yeah I'm still trying to dissect that statement considering Jokic has Aaron Gordon to protect the rim so to say because Jokic isn't a rim protector but they just won the title and looks to be possible back 2 back winners after their start to this season.

When you're the best player in the world you get to make some exceptions. It also helps that Joker is one of the best 3 point shooters in the league. Sengun hasn't shown real range outside the paint and really shouldn't get compared to Jokic.

I'm just going by your statement, how true is it for the last 5 years

2023 - Nuggets (No Jokic)
2022 - Warriors (No Looney and Draymond)
2021 - Bucks (Yes Lopez and Giannis)
2020 - Lakers (Yes Davis)
2019 - Raptors (No - Gasol not much shot blocker that year)

This is like saying KG wasn’t a good rim protector because his BPG wasn’t high. Marc’s last season with the Lakers was his best in terms of BLK%, but he was nowhere near good defensively as he was with the Raptors (or the Grizzlies, obviously).

[sca]

Post game heavy centers with no defense are dinosaurs in today's NBA. Give me Duren

Jokic?

The myth that Jokic doesn't play defense has already been dispelled. And while Jokic has a great post game he is not solely reliant on it. He is also a two time MVP and the reigning finals MVP, arguably the best player in the NBA. He is the exception, not the rule.

More like:

Most people thought that bigs like Nowitzki and Jokic could never win a championship until they actually did and their narratives have changed dramatically. The same could also become true for a guy like Şengün.

[Patsfan1081]

Sengun is nice but probably best as offensive C off the bench.

I'll take Duren as a starting C to anchor the defense and dominate the boards.

? He had the 5th most offensive rebounds despite not even playing thirty minutes a night. And his defensive metrics put him as a above average defender. I don’t see how at this point Sengun hasn’t place himself as a starter. Fans always overreact over a small sample.

[WillyJakkz]

Denver was 40-42 in Jokic 2nd season. They improved further the following season and then an annual .600+ team. If Sengun has any impact like a Jokic then he should be able to lead his team to at least close to .500 in his 3rd season now.

0-3 start. I suggest people remove their biases and observe reality.

Sengun has an intriguing skill set but man people comparing him to Jokic are just being absurd.

There was always something special about Jokic.

Sengun has some skills but his feet are far slower than Jokic’s and he’s a much smaller player.

Sengun is far more of a Sabonis type than being the next Jokic.

Jokic had shooting and overall scoring ability from day one, other bigs just don’t have.

Hilarious acting like Jokic was MVP Champion Jokic at age 21 which is exactly what Alperen is and Sengun is putting up the same numbers as Joker at the same age. Nearly identical in every facet including percentages.

Jokic: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jokicni01.html

Sengun: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sengual01.html

So pray tell what is the difference as they both didn't have high quality of teammates at the same career stage.

[GrandTheftRondo]

Denver was 40-42 in Jokic 2nd season. They improved further the following season and then an annual .600+ team. If Sengun has any impact like a Jokic then he should be able to lead his team to at least close to .500 in his 3rd season now.

0-3 start. I suggest people remove their biases and observe reality.

Sengun has an intriguing skill set but man people comparing him to Jokic are just being absurd.

There was always something special about Jokic.

Sengun has some skills but his feet are far slower than Jokic’s and he’s a much smaller player.

Sengun is far more of a Sabonis type than being the next Jokic.

Jokic had shooting and overall scoring ability from day one, other bigs just don’t have.

Hilarious acting like Jokic was MVP Champion Jokic at age 21 which is exactly what Alperen is and Sengun is putting up the same numbers as Joker at the same age. Nearly identical in every facet including percentages.

Jokic: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jokicni01.html

Sengun: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sengual01.html

So pray tell what is the difference as they both didn't have high quality of teammates at the same career stage.

Jokic was a much more efficient scorer from
day one. Jokic was a better rebounder.

Jokic is a legit 7 footer.

They move completely differently.

Comparing numbers is hilarious considering these days everyone is putting up scoring numbers compared to when Jokic was the same age. The Rockets PPG last season would have led the league back in Jokic’s early days.

I am very comfortable in the position that Sengun will never end up like Jokic.

[WillyJakkz]

Sengun has an intriguing skill set but man people comparing him to Jokic are just being absurd.

There was always something special about Jokic.

Sengun has some skills but his feet are far slower than Jokic’s and he’s a much smaller player.

Sengun is far more of a Sabonis type than being the next Jokic.

Jokic had shooting and overall scoring ability from day one, other bigs just don’t have.

Hilarious acting like Jokic was MVP Champion Jokic at age 21 which is exactly what Alperen is and Sengun is putting up the same numbers as Joker at the same age. Nearly identical in every facet including percentages.

Jokic: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jokicni01.html

Sengun: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sengual01.html

So pray tell what is the difference as they both didn't have high quality of teammates at the same career stage.

Jokic was a much more efficient scorer from
day one. Jokic was a better rebounder.

Jokic is a legit 7 footer.

They move completely differently.

Comparing numbers is hilarious considering these days everyone is putting up scoring numbers compared to when Jokic was the same age. The Rockets PPG last season would have led the league back in Jokic’s early days.

I am very comfortable in the position that Sengun will never end up like Jokic.

Agree to disagree. I believe he can be Jokic lite.

[Ayt]

I might have to eat crow for this later, but i always felt like Sengun was overhyped along with the rest of the Rockets young core. I’m sure he’ll have a fine, and long NBA career, but he seems slow footed and looks kinda clunky. I just don't think it’s likely he’ll be a good defensive center. I'm getting Enes Kanter vibes.

What an original, thoughtful comparison.

[whatisacenter]

Sengun is overrated here.

[GrandTheftRondo]

I might have to eat crow for this later, but i always felt like Sengun was overhyped along with the rest of the Rockets young core. I’m sure he’ll have a fine, and long NBA career, but he seems slow footed and looks kinda clunky. I just don't think it’s likely he’ll be a good defensive center. I'm getting Enes Kanter vibes.

What an original, thoughtful comparison.

Almost as original as all the Jokic comparisions.

Sorry but just because a dude is tall and pass and is from Europe, doesn’t make him Jokic.

[Wargreymon]

Duren might be the second coming of Dwight Howard and that's scary. People forget that peak Howard was as 3x DPOY/ 8 time All Star/ 5 time ALL NBA First Team. The man stopped Prime LeBron James from reaching the Finals to play prime Kobe. That's nuts. Detroit probably has the 3rd best future behind OKC and Spurs.

[Ritzo]

Sengun is more of Sabonis than Jokic.

[FarBeyondDriven]

Sengun is shaping up to be like Sabonis or a Jokic lite. He has post moves, can pass and tries on defense though he's far from a good defender. Duren is essentially an old-school PF playing small ball center putting up numbers due to usage on a bad team. Any of their centers, if they were getting his minutes, would produce similarly. I like him but just prefer Sengun in today's NBA more.

[tribulations]

Duren for me.

When is Sengun going to properly break out though?

Seems to have all the tools and a green light to post empty stats for a garbage team

[BoogieTime]

I think Sengun is closer in play style to Jokic than Sabonis. I think people are maybe comparing how good they think Sengun will become with style. Sengun is closer in body type to Jokic, he will have more length than Sabonis to contest at the rim but Sabonis is more fleet of foot. Sengun will have to work to cover ground. Also, there is more "jelly" to Sengun's game, like Jokic. Sabonis is tough, and a lot of his assists come off brute screening (DHOs).

I'd rather have Sengun going forward than Duren, personally. I think he is just more skilled and can be more foundational

[WillyJakkz]

I might have to eat crow for this later, but i always felt like Sengun was overhyped along with the rest of the Rockets young core. I’m sure he’ll have a fine, and long NBA career, but he seems slow footed and looks kinda clunky. I just don't think it’s likely he’ll be a good defensive center. I'm getting Enes Kanter vibes.

What an original, thoughtful comparison.

Almost as original as all the Jokic comparisions.

Sorry but just because a dude is tall and pass and is from Europe, doesn’t make him Jokic.

Almost as original as all the Dwight Howard comparisons.

Sorry just because a dude has muscles and dunks and is African American doesn't make him him Howard.

Duren might be the second coming of Dwight Howard and that's scary.

Yeah very scary. 8pts 7rebs vs Chet and OKC.

I like Duren seeing all of these Dwight Howard comparisons are starting to be a turn off. He does not block shots like Dwight could even at the same age Dwight showed phenomenal leaping ability and timing.

Not seeing that in Duren, only physicality.

[JackTalkThai]

Sengun is shaping up to be like Sabonis or a Jokic lite. He has post moves, can pass and tries on defense though he's far from a good defender. Duren is essentially an old-school PF playing small ball center putting up numbers due to usage on a bad team. Any of their centers, if they were getting his minutes, would produce similarly. I like him but just prefer Sengun in today's NBA more.

Jokic-lite is nothing more than Sabonis and there’s a massive gap there. That’s like saying Tyler Herro is Jordan-lite. It’s an insult to Jordan and Jokic to make those weak and pointless connections.

[JackTalkThai]

What an original, thoughtful comparison.

Almost as original as all the Jokic comparisions.

Sorry but just because a dude is tall and pass and is from Europe, doesn’t make him Jokic.

Almost as original as all the Dwight Howard comparisons.

Sorry just because a dude has muscles and dunks and is African American doesn't make him him Howard.

Duren might be the second coming of Dwight Howard and that's scary.

Yeah very scary. 8pts 7rebs vs Chet and OKC.

I like Duren seeing all of these Dwight Howard comparisons are starting to be a turn off. He does not block shots like Dwight could even at the same age Dwight showed phenomenal leaping ability and timing.

Not seeing that in Duren, only physicality.

Beyond them both being physically mature, athletic freaks as rookies; You honestly don’t see any other similarities here? Are you intentionally trying to avoid seeing the similarities and trajectories?

Howard’s first two seasons:
19 years old- (per 36 mpg, .520 EFG)
13 PTS, 11 REB, 4 ORB, 1 AST, 2 BLK,

20 years old- (per 36 mpg mpg, .531 EFG)
15 PTS, 12 REB, 3 ORB, 2 AST, 1 BLK

Duren’s first two seasons:
19 years old- (per 36 mpg, .648 EFG)
13 PTS, 13 REB, 5 ORB, 2 AST, 1 BLK

20 years old- (per 36 mpg, .648 EFG)
18 PTS, 16 REB, 6 ORB, 4 AST, 2 BLK

[Adam Stern]

So you believe it's Sengun and not gunners Jalen Green (and at one point KPJ) and the other young bench guys?

KPJ was awful...godawful. He was a horrible fit at point guard but I think that may have been by design. I don't think it's a coincidence that when Houston was ready to turn the corner on development and winning, moving him from point position was their first priority.

That said, I do believe it is Sengun's defensive liabilities that have hindered Smith's growth more than anything else outside of confidence issues early last season.
Unless he improves measurably I think Senguns limited defensive awareness and height/wingspan/athleticism deficiencies will always place a burden on his front court mates.

I think that's why they drafted Thompson Twin because it seems like HOU is leaning towards Alperen and Smith Jr as their future.

Amen Thompson was drafted as their point guard for the future and they have played his as such.
Houston seems fairly confident in Green and Smith but are concerned about the ceiling with Sengun (as evidenced by their comments during the off season) so it looks like Udoka has been trying to give him a chance to prove himself.

As to the comparison, I thought Sengun was the steal of his draft and still do. He's easily the best passing big I've seen since Jokic.
And Duren has exceeded my expectation of him this early in his career.

The difference maker for me is how each would theoretically perform if their situations were switched.
I think replacing Sengun with Duren on the current Rockets squad would make them appreciably better almost instantly.
I don't think could say the same about Detroit with Sengun in place of Duren.

Of course that has a lot to do with roster construction but I think it just reveals that Duren has a decidedly more portable skillset.

[One_and_Done]

Sengun is likely a bench player, while Duren is potentially a starter so Duren probably.