Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green

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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#61 » by Mamba Mentality » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:11 pm

FVV and Jalen Green 7-34 (21%) 17 points
Moody and Podz 7-18 (39%) 21 points

The fact that this game was even competitive in the 4th quarter is mindblowing.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#62 » by picc » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:17 pm

I think a good measure of how smart/dumb a player is, is if they get offensive fouls on a fastbreak. Its a super rookie, inexperienced thing to do, when you just launch into the lane when a guy is already there and you can see him setting up to take a charge, with no trying to maneuver around him or euro step or stop for a floater, etc.

Green did that last night and it was so avoidable. You can't be a 4th year player, who's supposed to be a team leader, and be picking up charges on fastbreaks because you think the defender is a wall you have to smash through.

He would also do this thing where he launched himself into the air for a contested layup in traffic, with no breathing room. He would miss, but that isn't the point. The point is that he compromises himself so much physically, in high risk low reward attempts, that he ends up face down 2 rows into the stands while the other team is going on a 5 on 4 fastbreak the other way. He's not even up by the time the play is finished.

That's just two examples, but of course there are more confoundingly stupid things he did that were entirely unnecessary and avoidable. I just don't like watching low IQ players. There's something about consistent unforced errors that's more offensive than just missing a shot or getting the ball stolen.

He's gone this offseason if I'm Houston. Maybe he starts to get it at some point, but if you're making rookie errors in your 4th year and not doing much else, I'd like you to get it somewhere else.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#63 » by QingJames » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:47 pm

Jalen Green still fooling some of y’all I see.
When will folks learn that combo guard chuckers who don’t play defense aren’t taking your team anywhere?

Green is just another LaVine - a player with no value around the league and who was dumped for nothing.
eyeatoma wrote:You guys still dont' get it. Playoff accomplishment don't matter when you're up for your 1st MVP. When you're up for your 3rd in a row, damn straight it matters, as the only ones who done it are top 15 players of all time who have won rings.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#64 » by QingJames » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:51 pm

LockoutSeason wrote:Van Vleet is worse than Jalen Green. At least Jalen is young.

I’m pretty sure Reed Sheppard is capable of shooting 4-19 and 2-12 from 3. Give the young guy a shot.

At least Fred can run an offense and playmake even when his shot isn’t falling. He’s nowhere near the defensive player he was a couple of years ago (especially on the perimeter) but he’s still an excellent post defender at the guard position.

When Jalen Green is bricking (very frequently) he’s providing literally nothing else.
eyeatoma wrote:You guys still dont' get it. Playoff accomplishment don't matter when you're up for your 1st MVP. When you're up for your 3rd in a row, damn straight it matters, as the only ones who done it are top 15 players of all time who have won rings.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#65 » by tsherkin » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:51 pm

QingJames wrote:Jalen Green still fooling some of y’all I see.
When will folks learn that combo guard chuckers who don’t play defense aren’t taking your team anywhere?

Green is just another LaVine - a player with no value around the league and who was dumped for nothing.


Lavine, at least, is actually good at scoring.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#66 » by shi-woo » Mon Apr 21, 2025 4:57 pm

I know HOU gave his that conract to make it easier to trade for a star going forward, but I think they expected to see some improvement from him. Idk what team is going to look at Green as a great asset when he's making 30 mil per, and is looking like he is in the Collin Sexton/Simons category of SG's, except not nearly as good of outside shooters as those guys.

This team needs to get rid of this guy ASAP, if he ever "gets it" he'll be solid, but in that Monte Ellis type of way but without the heart and grit of Monte. That is not worth it for a team looking to contend, and any trade for a legit star like Booker/KD/Herro is going to take much more than Green and Picks at this point.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#67 » by kenwood3333 » Mon Apr 21, 2025 5:08 pm

how about deport to el salvador?
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#68 » by boomershadow » Mon Apr 21, 2025 6:36 pm

lethalizer wrote:
ScrantonBulls wrote:That FVV contract was always a headscratcher to me.


It made perfect sense and still does actually, they got a vet on a short period of time. Good contract too, 2+1 for a vet leadership? Can't complain.

Now they do need to let him go this summer if you ask me, as the squad's needs evolved over time, and they need an absolute elite offensive player insted of a floor raiser vet playmaker like FVV.

Amen should be promoted to lead PG and they need to find a tough shotmaker to round out the roster.


The FVV deal was i tended as a culture move and floor raiser for a young upcoming team. I do think it worked as that, but he might not be a perfect piece of the puzzle on a team that seems ahead of schedule.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#69 » by Jadoogar » Mon Apr 21, 2025 7:37 pm

liquidswords wrote:FVV has had one of the most aggressive fall offs in NBA history. 6MOY candidate to virtually unplayable in a matter of years.


?? he was the starting point guard for the #2 team in the West. pretty far from "unplayable".

He's shot poorly in the playoffs before, go back and watch the 2019 Raptors playoff run. He's never been efficient, he's not a great pullup shooter and way too small to finish around the rim. The problem for the Rockets is that he's being asked to do too much. They definitely need to run more offense through Sengun and hope Green can go on one of his hot streaks. Only use FVV as the facilitator and a C&S outlet. Asking him to take 10 pull-up threes per game is just asking for trouble.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#70 » by tsherkin » Mon Apr 21, 2025 7:46 pm

Jadoogar wrote:He's shot poorly in the playoffs before, go back and watch the 2019 Raptors playoff run. He's never been efficient, he's not a great pullup shooter and way too small to finish around the rim. The problem for the Rockets is that he's being asked to do too much.


No, the problem is that he's a crap scorer who is useless at scoring if his 3pt shot isn't falling. In the RS, he was taking under 13 FGA/g, which wasn't so bad, so the issue wasn't exacerbated.

Their present issue is one of strategy.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#71 » by Kurtz » Mon Apr 21, 2025 7:57 pm

This Houston team is a KD-trade away from being a legit, legit contender.

FVV is just incredibly streaky. You never know if he's giving you 1/10 or 6/10 from the 3 on any given night. I predict he'll have a couple of games this series where he'll hit 5-6 3s.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#72 » by tsherkin » Mon Apr 21, 2025 8:05 pm

Kurtz wrote:This Houston team is a KD-trade away from being a legit, legit contender.

FVV is just incredibly streaky. You never know if he's giving you 1/10 or 6/10 from the 3 on any given night. I predict he'll have a couple of games this series where he'll hit 5-6 3s.


That is how the 3pt shot works. It's entirely feast or famine. And for most guys, especially non-Steph guys, it's a lot more famine than feast. Fred's a career 37.1% shooter from 3, which isn't bad. But objectively, that means he misses a lot more than he makes. Last year, when he shot 38.7% (which was pretty good!), he still had 24 games under 30% from 3, and a pair right at 30%. That's just shy of 36% of his total games played where he was a total waste beyond the arc.

That really highlights how problematic it is when a guy has absolutely nothing inside the arc, like FVV.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#73 » by RRR3 » Mon Apr 21, 2025 10:45 pm

QingJames wrote:Jalen Green still fooling some of y’all I see.
When will folks learn that combo guard chuckers who don’t play defense aren’t taking your team anywhere?

Green is just another LaVine - a player with no value around the league and who was dumped for nothing.

He wishes he was Lavine. Lavine is at least efficient.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#74 » by Wingy » Tue Apr 22, 2025 3:03 am

cupcakesnake wrote:Until I see Homeland security in this thread, confirming they're going to pick him up, I think the criticism needs to continue!

(I get that I'm piling on, but I think the fans that have been waiting for him to become a superstar need to hear it. Or fans that still believe in Derozan, or Lavine, or Cam Thomas, or Tyler Herro, or CJ, or Brandon Ingram when he stops passing and playing d.)


I mean, I believe in Herro and Lavine as high-level players in specific situations. I certainly don’t believe in them carrying a team. That’s utterly crazy delusion if anyone thinks that, but I don’t think anyone actually does think that, nor do I think anyone’s holding out hope. Goes for them, and all those you mentioned. Lavine does get insane criticism. Certainly understand it to an extent, but think it’s to the point where it’s exaggerated and everyone is piling.

Unlike those guys, people will hold out hope for Green since he is 23. But as we are both pointing out, youth doesn’t guarantee anything, and the light may never fully turn on.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#75 » by jasonxxx102 » Wed Apr 23, 2025 2:17 pm

Wingy wrote:
cupcakesnake wrote:Until I see Homeland security in this thread, confirming they're going to pick him up, I think the criticism needs to continue!

(I get that I'm piling on, but I think the fans that have been waiting for him to become a superstar need to hear it. Or fans that still believe in Derozan, or Lavine, or Cam Thomas, or Tyler Herro, or CJ, or Brandon Ingram when he stops passing and playing d.)


I mean, I believe in Herro and Lavine as high-level players in specific situations. I certainly don’t believe in them carrying a team. That’s utterly crazy delusion if anyone thinks that, but I don’t think anyone actually does think that, nor do I think anyone’s holding out hope. Goes for them, and all those you mentioned. Lavine does get insane criticism. Certainly understand it to an extent, but think it’s to the point where it’s exaggerated and everyone is piling.

Unlike those guys, people will hold out hope for Green since he is 23. But as we are both pointing out, youth doesn’t guarantee anything, and the light may never fully turn on.


People who fall back on the "he's young" just don't understand how to evaluate players and think development is linear.

We have seen 4 years of Jalen Green. He's never improved, I mean seriously you cannot point to a single thing he improved. He's not going to. He is what he is.

The guy has horrible IQ, complete lack of awareness of the floor, lazy off-ball defender...
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#76 » by jasonxxx102 » Wed Apr 23, 2025 2:19 pm

Lavine is another guy who doesn't add to winning basketball. It's not a coincidence that he's never been on a winning team in his decade long career. He occupies so much of the offensive possessions while not scoring efficiently, and not making things easier for his teammates. That's a losing combo.

90% of the players in the NBA can score 20ppg if given enough shots, but scoring is the least impactful and most abundant skill.
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#77 » by Ice Man » Wed Apr 23, 2025 3:58 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:Lavine is another guy who doesn't add to winning basketball. It's not a coincidence that he's never been on a winning team in his decade long career. He occupies so much of the offensive possessions while not scoring efficiently, and not making things easier for his teammates. That's a losing combo.

90% of the players in the NBA can score 20ppg if given enough shots, but scoring is the least impactful and most abundant skill.


One correct to what you wrote: LaVine scores efficiently, which is why he is a good player. However, the rest is accurate, which is why even though he scores a lot and scores efficiently, he's not better than good.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#78 » by hardenASG13 » Thu Apr 24, 2025 11:32 am

Hmmm maybe Jalen Green isn't so bad after all. 38 points in his second playoff game, Butler banged up. Houston could easily be headed to the WCF.
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#79 » by reamily » Thu Apr 24, 2025 11:41 am

Will Jalen green take the fvv spot( tyrese maxey rome) and go homerun for kd?..no matter how you do analytics on it.. kevin durant will hit all the open three pointers van vleet had missed.. and much more often streaky enough than not.

Kd might be the next placehilder for this houston team, and who knows jalen green might take the stephen curry role in this..and amen thompson the westbrook role
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Re: Homeland security needs to detain FVV and Jalen Green 

Post#80 » by QingJames » Thu Apr 24, 2025 12:44 pm

hardenASG13 wrote:Hmmm maybe Jalen Green isn't so bad after all. 38 points in his second playoff game, Butler banged up. Houston could easily be headed to the WCF.

Nah, Green is awful. Yes he can go off like a flamethrower and score a ton of points on any given night. He is far more likely to chuck and brick most of those chucks while doing nothing else for his team. He remains one of the worst defenders in the league with no awareness when he’s playing off-ball defense.

But again, a guy can score a lot of points in a game and that fools some of you. Even moreso when it’s a playoff game. Speaking of which… how’s Terance Mann doing these days? Anyone clamouring to give that scrub a max?
eyeatoma wrote:You guys still dont' get it. Playoff accomplishment don't matter when you're up for your 1st MVP. When you're up for your 3rd in a row, damn straight it matters, as the only ones who done it are top 15 players of all time who have won rings.

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