Can we have real talk about LaMelo Ball

[thelead]

This. I’ve been watching him since he was in 8th grade. What always struck me about him is how naturally gifted he was. I don’t use this term often, but he was pretty much a basketball prodigy who was mishandled throughout high school.

Lavar did him a serious disservice moving him around so much through his formative years. Should’ve never messed around in Lithuania after pulling him out of Chino Hills. Then there was the JBA stint, and then the move to Spire all while still in HS. Seems like any time there was any adversity, Lavar moved him instead of sticking it out. Lavar will claim LaMelo’s development was a success- as he’s getting supermax money. But I think under the guidance of someone else, LaMelo could’ve been a special player in the NBA.

It’s quite sad. He really has the talent to be an MVP-level player.

This has to be trolling

No trolling. LaMelo with SGA’s mindset/seriousness would be a top-5 talent in this league. People need to stop undervaluing IQ/maturity. Ball has the handles, shot, speed, and passing ability to be much better than he currently is.

[DusterBuster]

At some point the Hornets need to hire an assistant coach that LeMelo actually respects and will listen to. Make LeMelo part of the interview process with the final candidates and hope for the best. If that doesn't work, it's probably time to move on.

The Hornets should start by adding a few veterans to their roster that can help teach all their young guys how to play winning basketball. Miles Bridges, an injured Grant Williams, Collin Sexton and Mason Plumlee are the veterans on that roster. Bridges is a scumbag off the court, and while Sexton plays really hard, he’s not someone I would look to for veteran leadership.

I'm not sure I'm one who believes in karma... but - LaMelo aside - the Hornets sure sold their soul when they not only brought Bridges back but then signed him to a FAT new contract. At a certain point we have to be like... what are we doing here.

Rebuilding is hard, I argue with some of my fellow Blazer fans who hate the GM because of how long the rebuild has taken, but rebuilding a roster is legitimately difficult and an inexact science. Rebuilding a roster is a minimum 3-5yr process. On top of that, luck plays SUCH a huge part in the process.

But when you rebuild a team with absolutely zero account for character - you've set yourself up for failure. That's one absolutely proven metric throughout the history of the NBA.

[DusterBuster]

It’s quite sad. He really has the talent to be an MVP-level player.

This has to be trolling

No trolling. LaMelo with SGA’s mindset/seriousness would be a top-5 talent in this league. People need to stop undervaluing IQ/maturity. Ball has the handles, shot, speed, and passing ability to be much better than he currently is.

I'll agree with you on this.

This post isn't to **** on LaMelo's talent what-so-ever.

[tsherkin]

This. I’ve been watching him since he was in 8th grade. What always struck me about him is how naturally gifted he was. I don’t use this term often, but he was pretty much a basketball prodigy who was mishandled throughout high school.

Lavar did him a serious disservice moving him around so much through his formative years. Should’ve never messed around in Lithuania after pulling him out of Chino Hills. Then there was the JBA stint, and then the move to Spire all while still in HS. Seems like any time there was any adversity, Lavar moved him instead of sticking it out. Lavar will claim LaMelo’s development was a success- as he’s getting supermax money. But I think under the guidance of someone else, LaMelo could’ve been a special player in the NBA.

It’s quite sad. He really has the talent to be an MVP-level player.

This has to be trolling

I don't know about trolling so much as exaggeration.

He IS a high-end playmaker with height and handles. He isn't good in close, and he is far from elite on his short and middle game. His scoring is pretty much all about mid-30s volume 3pt shooting, which isn't awesome.

I think it's probably pretty large hyperbole that he's an MVP-type talent, since he doesn't really showcase the scoring tools to really be at that level, but he'd obviously be improved over what he is if he were both healthy and as focused as some of the top guys in the league because he IS quite talented.

[Flash4thewin]

Have any of you watched any of his interviews? It's not that he has a low BBIQ. He has a very low IQ in general. I am surprised that he can find his way to the court every day.

He just has address preprogrammed on his cyber truck and lets the software and god take care of the rest lol

[threethehardway]

Some of you are just mad because he's young and rich and he did it his way.

The Hornets are a terrible organization and needs to be deleted from the NBA because it is ridiculous how long they have been bad.

I feel the same about Pelicans.

I wish it was possible for owners to lose the ability to govern their team after consecutive years of being one of the worst teams of all time.

Expecting teenage and 20 something lottery picks to be culture setters and leaders instead of coaches, GMs and the person that owns to the damn team is how organizations like the Hornets get away with being a place where young NBA careers go to die.

The Hornets and Pelicans are a graveyard. If I was a top 3 pick drafted to the Hornets or Pelicans, I wouldn't even show up. I would go to an elite European team and live a great European life til my NBA team trade me.

But this is what happens when elite organizations like the Warriors have brain farts and drafts freaking James Wiseman and giggle because he knows how to say "Hi" in Mandarin.

As if academic excellence means someone can be an elite player.

[Marvin Martian]

It’s quite sad. He really has the talent to be an MVP-level player.

This has to be trolling

No trolling. LaMelo with SGA’s mindset/seriousness would be a top-5 talent in this league. People need to stop undervaluing IQ/maturity. Ball has the handles, shot, speed, and passing ability to be much better than he currently is.

He doesn't have the shot. He has an awkward release that makes his shot unusable in mid range and in the post.

And unlike SGA, Ball is scared of contact which is why his ft rate is so low. And also unlike SGA, Ball doesn't have the greatest touch around the rim.

[sikma42]

He legit might be the best worst player I've ever seen.

He's so insanely talented, but has the BBIQ of a **** brick. He can do almost anything on the court, but is so **** lazy and selfish that it negates literally every single shred of talent he has.

Convince me I'm wrong that he's not the least winning player I've ever seen in [emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]] years of watching the NBA. Give me a reason why any team should want him.

The Hornets - IMO - should trade him for a used washing machine and a [emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]][emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]] [emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]]]th round pick tomorrow if they can so their franchise can move on. I don't care what points he can put up, those points absolutely cannibalize any semblance of a team game.

Me trying to come up with anything to defend Lamelo….

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I'll try to argue against my own point...

For one, I give credit to those who place a significant amount of blame on the Hornets roster. I'll even take some blame that I didn't know just how god awful their roster truly was until I making this thread.

Like, it's a truly trash roster, they're maybe [emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]]] players deep before that roster just goes into absolute g-league territory. What exactly is that FO doing? It'a almost impressive how little they have collected.

So, I give some credit to those faulting the roster, it's a tall order to do much with a roster THAT bad.

But my rebuttal is that I've seen it done before. The ones that are truly great can lift up sub-par or even just flat out bad rosters.

Someone mentioned it earlier... He's an influencer masquerading as a basketball player. He's playing his game to the highlight clip TikTok generation vs actually to win games.

So the rebuttal is he needs to be as effective as peak Shaq/Lebron/Jordan?

Bc that’s what it would take to even think about getting last years team to the playoffs. And I’m not sure if they’d all be able to do it either


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[thelead]

This has to be trolling

No trolling. LaMelo with SGA’s mindset/seriousness would be a top-5 talent in this league. People need to stop undervaluing IQ/maturity. Ball has the handles, shot, speed, and passing ability to be much better than he currently is.

He doesn't have the shot. He has an awkward release that makes his shot unusable in mid range and in the post.

And unlike SGA, Ball is scared of contact which is why his ft rate is so low. And also unlike SGA, Ball doesn't have the greatest touch around the rim.

Sure but SGA improved a lot over the years because of his maturity and IQ. My point is that Ball’s baseline is good enough to build upon if he was a serious person that wasn’t brain dead. SGA has a high FT rate because he has a high IQ. He is always waiting from anyone to even slightly jump or stick a hand out to fish for fouls. IMO that’s IQ (along with the speed and skill to pull it off).

[Lalouie]

He legit might be the best worst player I've ever seen.

He's so insanely talented, but has the BBIQ of a **** brick. He can do almost anything on the court, but is so **** lazy and selfish that it negates literally every single shred of talent he has.

Convince me I'm wrong that he's not the least winning player I've ever seen in 30 years of watching the NBA. Give me a reason why any team should want him.

The Hornets - IMO - should trade him for a used washing machine and a 2032 4th round pick tomorrow if they can so their franchise can move on. I don't care what points he can put up, those points absolutely cannibalize any semblance of a team game.

i don't think he cares about winning

he plays "playground" style. no rules no structure no coaching - he doesn't want to be encumbered. it's all about the flash, and playing for the crowd sitting on the fences at rucker

i liken him to a "free soul".

he is everything i don't like in a player. what he's doing now, he will be doing until he retires. he will never change as this is the only way he plays

[Lalouie]

Have any of you watched any of his interviews? It's not that he has a low BBIQ. He has a very low IQ in general. I am surprised that he can find his way to the court every day.

it has nothing to do with bbIQ

he speaks like he's 13years old. i don't get it since he's so 180 from lonzo

this is what people are paying $100per to watch.......a child

[Black Jack]

White Chocolate 2.0

Maybe if he goes to a vet team that has a strong coach and fo focused on actually winning he can be reined in but yeah in Charlotte its a circus show

[Marvin Martian]

No trolling. LaMelo with SGA’s mindset/seriousness would be a top-5 talent in this league. People need to stop undervaluing IQ/maturity. Ball has the handles, shot, speed, and passing ability to be much better than he currently is.

He doesn't have the shot. He has an awkward release that makes his shot unusable in mid range and in the post.

And unlike SGA, Ball is scared of contact which is why his ft rate is so low. And also unlike SGA, Ball doesn't have the greatest touch around the rim.

Sure but SGA improved a lot over the years because of his maturity and IQ. My point is that Ball’s baseline is good enough to build upon if he was a serious person that wasn’t brain dead. SGA has a high FT rate because he has a high IQ. He is always waiting from anyone to even slightly jump or stick a hand out to fish for fouls. IMO that’s IQ (along with the speed and skill to pull it off).

SGA always had the strength and skill to attack the rim. The only thing he was missing was a consistent jump shot and that is the easiest thing for a player to fix.

Lamelo is nowhere near elite shooting the 3, mid range or attacking the rim. He just doesn't have the scoring talent to be an MVP level player.

[Lalouie]

White Chocolate 2.0

Maybe if he goes to a vet team that has a strong coach and fo focused on actually winning he can be reined in but yeah in Charlotte its a circus show

i think a vet team or any team with aspirations would be making a mistake. playing his way might be the only way he can play. as i am a huge believer in what goes on upstairs, i don't think people change. the biggest reason players fail to reach their potential is their mindset, not their talent. the medula is as native to a talent as the talent itself

[jordanwilliams6]

I actually cannot stand watching the guy play. It would be infuriating to watch on a regular basis.

He certainly has the talent level to be a winning player if he accepted the role of a third option type. Unfortunately he’s as dumb as a bag of rocks so that will never happen.

[Mr Peanut]

That's a laughable statement. The Cade All-Star, All-NBA 3rd team, 7th in MVP voting and leading his team to the playoffs last season should've put the Cade vs LaMelo debate to bed.

Detroit's roster is much better... and there is still the difference in health which I noted The Hornets were the 24th-ranked D and the 2nd-worst O in the league last year, but in the 47 games Ball played, they were actually winning more even with the dearth of any talent around him.

It isn't a laughable statement. It's valid to make a pro-Cade argument, and availability is still a very relevant consideration, but it's worth noting that there is a large difference in roster/organization quality between the two and that health is the larger difference between them individually.

Rosters aside, both the raw and advanced stats from last season are largely in favor of Cade over LaMelo. This is a pretty telling graphic:



And for a gauge of national opinion, Cade was recently named the 13th best player in the NBA by The Ringer and 12th by ESPN. LaMelo was 46th in the former and didn't register in the top 50 for the latter.

The health factor is important, but if LaMelo can't stay on the floor (and he has now had three consecutive seasons where he couldn't reach 50 games) then that has to be factored in to how he is valued as a player.

I don't want to derail this thread with a player comparison discussion but thought that statement should be called out when both the stats and analyst opinion are so clearly against that.

[DusterBuster]

Me trying to come up with anything to defend Lamelo….

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I'll try to argue against my own point...

For one, I give credit to those who place a significant amount of blame on the Hornets roster. I'll even take some blame that I didn't know just how god awful their roster truly was until I making this thread.

Like, it's a truly trash roster, they're maybe [emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]]]][emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6][emoji6]][emoji[emoji[emoji6]][emoji[emoji6]]]]] players deep before that roster just goes into absolute g-league territory. What exactly is that FO doing? It'a almost impressive how little they have collected.

So, I give some credit to those faulting the roster, it's a tall order to do much with a roster THAT bad.

But my rebuttal is that I've seen it done before. The ones that are truly great can lift up sub-par or even just flat out bad rosters.

Someone mentioned it earlier... He's an influencer masquerading as a basketball player. He's playing his game to the highlight clip TikTok generation vs actually to win games.

So the rebuttal is he needs to be as effective as peak Shaq/Lebron/Jordan?

Bc that’s what it would take to even think about getting last years team to the playoffs. And I’m not sure if they’d all be able to do it either


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

That’s a pretty dense interpretation of my point, even non-HOF but still high level All Stars bring up the talent of lesser players. So no, I’m not asking him to be a top 10 all time player, I’m asking him to be a Pacers era Paul George.

[og15]

Some of you are just mad because he's young and rich and he did it his way.

The Hornets are a terrible organization and needs to be deleted from the NBA because it is ridiculous how long they have been bad.

I feel the same about Pelicans.

I wish it was possible for owners to lose the ability to govern their team after consecutive years of being one of the worst teams of all time.

Expecting teenage and 20 something lottery picks to be culture setters and leaders instead of coaches, GMs and the person that owns to the damn team is how organizations like the Hornets get away with being a place where young NBA careers go to die.

The Hornets and Pelicans are a graveyard. If I was a top 3 pick drafted to the Hornets or Pelicans, I wouldn't even show up. I would go to an elite European team and live a great European life til my NBA they trade me.

But this is what happens when elite organizations like the Warriors have brain farts and drafts freaking James Wiseman and giggle because he knows how to say "Hi" in Mandarin.

As if academic excellence means someone can be an elite player.

Basketball IQ has nothing to do with academic excellence if that's what you're citing here.

In terms of organization, yea, some organizations simply aren't carrying their weight

[threethehardway]

Basketball IQ has nothing to do with academic excellence if that's what you're citing here.

In terms of organization, yea, some organizations simply aren't carrying their weight

Of course BBall IQ has nothing to do with being an intelligent or academically inclined person.

I am talking about the stupid non-basketball reasons why James Wiseman was drafted over superior basketball players that actually know how to play...like Hali and Lamelo.

And one was those reason was literally..."He seems smart enough to figure out how to play basketball because he took Chinese classes...and look at him practice his step back 3."

[Dominator83]

Some of you are just mad because he's young and rich and he did it his way.

The Hornets are a terrible organization and needs to be deleted from the NBA because it is ridiculous how long they have been bad.

I feel the same about Pelicans.

I wish it was possible for owners to lose the ability to govern their team after consecutive years of being one of the worst teams of all time.

Expecting teenage and 20 something lottery picks to be culture setters and leaders instead of coaches, GMs and the person that owns to the damn team is how organizations like the Hornets get away with being a place where young NBA careers go to die.

The Hornets and Pelicans are a graveyard. If I was a top 3 pick drafted to the Hornets or Pelicans, I wouldn't even show up. I would go to an elite European team and live a great European life til my NBA they trade me.

But this is what happens when elite organizations like the Warriors have brain farts and drafts freaking James Wiseman and giggle because he knows how to say "Hi" in Mandarin.

As if academic excellence means someone can be an elite player.

The funny irony here too is, both franchises are the Hornets ! The current Hornets are an expansion team posing as the Hornets