2022-23 NBA MVP Discussion (Pt.1)

[California Gold]

Weird that Giannis is leading this poll as he hasn’t played at anything resembling an MVP level in 3 weeks now. I’ve long wondered what his game would look like when his athleticism would wane or all the beatings he takes really starts to accumulate. If those knee issues are chronic than his career after his prime might not look too pretty.

People are just ready to given Giannis a 3rd MVP. Rightly so, he had them well placed the first 1.5 weeks of the league, and he was dominating. I agree about his current knee issues which been plagueing him over the last 3-4 years.

IMO MVP right now is

Luka
Tatum/Embiid

If Embiid continues to play like this fo rthe next month I think he overtakes, especialy with Harden and Maxey out right now.

And if Luka and Tatum continue to play the way they are then they keep the lead.

Sorry but no chance Embiid is getting it over Tatum if the Celtics finish higher and he stays on his current pace.

[bisme37]

Weird that Giannis is leading this poll as he hasn’t played at anything resembling an MVP level in 3 weeks now. I’ve long wondered what his game would look like when his athleticism would wane or all the beatings he takes really starts to accumulate. If those knee issues are chronic than his career after his prime might not look too pretty.

The poll needs to be restarted.

The poll is set up so people are free to change their vote whenever and as often as they like.

[shoresy69]

Luka and Mavericks fans truly are the reincarnation of Harden and Rockets fans. Big counting stats, baby!

[Zespetjest]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

[sunsbg]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

[BoatsNZones]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

Worth noting KP looks better without Luka, Brunson looks as good or better. And their bench as a whole has been among the best in the league. It’s not a championship cast, but the record indicates as much.

[Zespetjest]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

Worth noting KP looks better without Luka, Brunson looks as good or better. And their bench as a whole has been among the best in the league. It’s not a championship cast, but the record indicates as much.

Can you support your claims about KP and JB with some data please?

[Zespetjest]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

KP was far from all star with mavs. Partly his fault partly Carlisles’ by using him wrong IMHO.

[Exp0sed]

Luka and Mavericks fans truly are the reincarnation of Harden and Rockets fans. Big counting stats, baby!

big counting stats?

dude is the best post up player in the league this season

he has 11.5 FTA lol, only Giannis has more per game (and he gets hacked more cuz he can't hit them obviously) Luka is tied with Embiid at 11.5 FTA for 2nd in the NBA

90.8% of his 2 pt makes have been unassisted - that's second among starters with Suggs being first obviously at a much lower volume

i just picked 3 random examples, there are more
but I think those are "non counting stats" that kind of illustrate best how unstopabble he has been

yes, his usage is insane and he is leading the league in FGA, not by much and he has been much more prolific in those shots than just about anyone, only SGA is really challenging him there

and yes, taking a bit more shots inflates his pts by a bit, do you think we would rate his season thus far that differently if he was taking something like 19-20 FGA (which would put him around 15th) and scoring 32 instead of 35?

ur tripping bro

and fwiw this isn't the "whose the best player in the world" thread, it's the MVP discussion and counting stats always mattered for MVP (as they should).

[sunsbg]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

KP was far from all star with mavs. Partly his fault partly Carlisles’ by using him wrong IMHO.

The later doesn't have anything to do with how Luka plays, right ?

[Johnny Firpo]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

I don't know why anyone would read your comments about Luka, when you are so clearly negatively biased towards him. It really is a waste of time. Zero objectivity (yes, before you "smartly" come back with it, I am, and just about any Luka fan here are very obviously more objective about his play as you are).

[Zespetjest]

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

KP was far from all star with mavs. Partly his fault partly Carlisles’ by using him wrong IMHO.

The later doesn't have anything to do with how Luka plays, right ?

Right. But he was still far from all star. You said he was fringe all star and even that is far from reallity as oftentimes availability is the best ability.

[sunsbg]

I like how other players fans (or stans as you like to call us, Luka’s fans) cry about their MVP candidates has to play without their 2nd or even 3rd (fringe)all stars due to injuries/ilness, but they all like to forget that Luka has to play without one all the time. Man I really can’t wait to see him play with another really good player instead of bunch of role players. Hope it will happen on Mavs.

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

I don't know why anyone would read your comments about Luka, when you are so clearly negatively biased towards him. It really is a waste of time. Zero objectivity (yes, before you "smartly" come back with it, I am, and just about any Luka fan here are very obviously more objective about his play as you are).

LOL objectivity from Luka fanboys. I'm saying he's great skill-wise, but has a ball hoggish style/mentality, which is obvious to me since he stepped a foot on NBA floor. Kinda surprising for ex-Euroleague player if you have ever watched how game is played there. It's opinion shared by many and I don't care if you read it. With DFS, Bullock and Dinwiddie he won a second round series. Are they really that bad and it was pure luck ?

[dygaction]

Are other fans guilty Mavs traded an injury prone fringe all star in Porzingis, so Luka fans can't cry about the same ? Also Wood appears to provide a bit of what people expected from KP.

I don't know why anyone would read your comments about Luka, when you are so clearly negatively biased towards him. It really is a waste of time. Zero objectivity (yes, before you "smartly" come back with it, I am, and just about any Luka fan here are very obviously more objective about his play as you are).

LOL objectivity from Luka fanboys. I'm saying he's great skill-wise, but has a ball hoggish style/mentality, which is obvious to me since he stepped a foot on NBA floor. Kinda surprising for ex-Euroleague player if you have ever watched how game is played there. It's opinion shared by many and I don't care if you read it. With DFS, Bullock and Dinwiddie he won a second round series. Are they really that bad and it was pure luck ?

If Luka did not have a ball hoggish style but the mentality of CP3 and Booker, maybe it would not have been a 7 game series

[DonaldSanders]

Updated (19.11.2022):

1. Luka Doncic - 10.02
2. Stephen Curry - 8.89
3. Jayson Tatum - 8.36
4. Nikola Jokic - 6.70
5. Giannis Antetokounmpo - 6.16

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm

I don't mind people preferring Luka over Steph (they are mighty close in terms of impact and either fanbase is gonna prefer their guy) but the DRPM stuff is just wild. Apparently Kelly Oubre is the 4th most impactful defender in the league and Luka is close on Mobley's heels for defensive impact


Steph/Luka still going #1 and #2 for EPM, interesting that EPM has KD at #3 and RPM has KD at #18. None of these stats are perfect of course, Fred Van Vleet is #11 in EPM, really big stretch to call FVV #11 in the league.

[sunsbg]

I don't know why anyone would read your comments about Luka, when you are so clearly negatively biased towards him. It really is a waste of time. Zero objectivity (yes, before you "smartly" come back with it, I am, and just about any Luka fan here are very obviously more objective about his play as you are).

LOL objectivity from Luka fanboys. I'm saying he's great skill-wise, but has a ball hoggish style/mentality, which is obvious to me since he stepped a foot on NBA floor. Kinda surprising for ex-Euroleague player if you have ever watched how game is played there. It's opinion shared by many and I don't care if you read it. With DFS, Bullock and Dinwiddie he won a second round series. Are they really that bad and it was pure luck ?

If Luka did not have a ball hoggish style but the mentality of CP3 and Booker, maybe it would not have been a 7 game series

Finally a Luka fanboy admitting it. Didn't hurt, right ? Ball-hogging is generally an NBA thing, it just happens that ex-EL player is on top of the tree. Booker is somewhere there as well. CP3 is not. And don't forget CP3 and Booker made the finals, while Luka has not.

See, I won money betting on Jokic's MVPs, will win from Luka most likely and being an euro I have no problem rooting for the guys. I'm just annoyed by all the crying of his fanboys about be it Mavs or NT teammates being always the worst and denying the obvious about his style, thus my initial reply.

[Bob8]

LOL objectivity from Luka fanboys. I'm saying he's great skill-wise, but has a ball hoggish style/mentality, which is obvious to me since he stepped a foot on NBA floor. Kinda surprising for ex-Euroleague player if you have ever watched how game is played there. It's opinion shared by many and I don't care if you read it. With DFS, Bullock and Dinwiddie he won a second round series. Are they really that bad and it was pure luck ?

If Luka did not have a ball hoggish style but the mentality of CP3 and Booker, maybe it would not have been a 7 game series

Finally a Luka fanboy admitting it. Didn't hurt, right ? Ball-hogging is generally an NBA thing, it just happens that ex-EL player is on top of the tree. Booker is somewhere there as well. CP3 is not. And don't forget CP3 and Booker made the finals, while Luka has not.

See, I won money betting on Jokic's MVPs, will win from Luka most likely and being an euro I have no problem rooting for the guys. I'm just annoyed by all the crying of his fanboys about be it Mavs or NT teammates being always the worst and denying the obvious about his style, thus my initial reply.

It looks to me that Luka has a little more time to win a title than CP3. Not being ball-hog didn't help him much in that regard, but he has set some difficult to break records in playoffs.

[rocketsfan100]

Embiid will be without harden and Maxey now so this is his chance to really cement himself. He is already well and truly in the mix with last 4 games

[sunsbg]

It looks to me that Luka has a little more time to win a title than CP3. Not being ball-hog didn't help him much in that regard, but he has set some difficult to break records in playoffs.

Looking at the history of ball hogs winning a title, time may not be on his side. Maybe he's the exception though. Changing style still looks like a better option to me.

[eyeatoma]

Weird that Giannis is leading this poll as he hasn’t played at anything resembling an MVP level in 3 weeks now. I’ve long wondered what his game would look like when his athleticism would wane or all the beatings he takes really starts to accumulate. If those knee issues are chronic than his career after his prime might not look too pretty.

People are just ready to given Giannis a 3rd MVP. Rightly so, he had them well placed the first 1.5 weeks of the league, and he was dominating. I agree about his current knee issues which been plagueing him over the last 3-4 years.

IMO MVP right now is

Luka
Tatum/Embiid

If Embiid continues to play like this fo rthe next month I think he overtakes, especialy with Harden and Maxey out right now.

And if Luka and Tatum continue to play the way they are then they keep the lead.

Sorry but no chance Embiid is getting it over Tatum if the Celtics finish higher and he stays on his current pace.

Tatum's numbers have already started going down, and the Sixers are only 4 games behind.