Dolan/MSG losing corporate sponsors to Rox over Linsanity

[ccvle]

They already dropped 90-100 mill in stock value and are losing sponsors and fans rapidly. Which should matter since they are a business. But like I said, we'll see.

Typical. People who talk about other people not knowing what they're talking about usually don't have a clue themselves.

You know what the MSG stock price was during the height of Linsanity, when he torched the Lakers? $31.15.

The highest the stock has gone for this year? $38.91 on July 3rd.

Knicks declined to match the Lin offer on July 17.

Do you know what the stock price is now? $37.99

So this "argument" that the Garden stock "dropped 90-100 million" is nothing but a huge lie. Go look at the numbers instead of just posting crap.

I don't know what planet you must be on to think total share value is equivalent to the price an individual share. Here are some pictures to help you.

How much is MSG today? How much is MSG up since beginning of the year? How much is MSG up since IPO? Why are talking about 100million? when MSG is up well over 1 billion in two years. What stock doesn't go up and down? MSG went from 38 to 32 and now is back to 37. No body loss 100 million. Collectively, MSG as a company is down 100 million in market cap since its 52 week high. I don't know how many shares of MSG Dolan owns, but his share of loss is probably a couple millions to 10millions (assuming 5-10% ownership).

[Winsome Gerbil]

Somehow I think the New York Knicks will do just fine when it comes to ad revenue.

[BubbaTee]

why are Knicks fans still butthurt about him leaving. they didn't offer anything in the first place. reads like Stephen A has multiple accounts.

I'm more puzzled as to why they (or anyone, really) think Ray Felton is anything but garbage on a basketball court.

[Crackfool]

you sound like Stephen A Smith w/ this stuff about the locker room being upset that he wouldn't play at '85%' in the playoffs.

no Knicks fan can think this was a good decision. you're capped out so the 'cap-space' is useless. absolute worst case scenario you trade him and let someone else take the ^above^ risks

You know why I believe SAS? Because he's in the locker room talking to players, and gets the truth. You didn't hear anyone refute what he said. Also, I grew up in NY and lots of my friends who are long-time fans of the team were saying the same thing about Lin not playing.

It was undoubtedly a smart business decision on his part, but it didn't endear him to the Knicks locker room.

As to your last point, if the Knicks had re-signed Lin with that poison pill third year, there's no way they could have traded him. Who would be dumb enough to do that, except Houston? And if the Knicks had matched the offer, I seriously doubt if the Rockets would have traded for Lin.

It's pretty clear here that you're grasping for straws and simply regurgitating biased and uninformed NY media reports that serve little more than to damage control the incompetency of the Knicks front office. Praising Stephen A. Smith as someone who "gets the truth" when he is close to a caricature of an opinionated and uninformed Bleacher Report writer is laughable.

The fact of the matter is that the Knicks were hoping to keep Lin, and then failed spectacularly on so many levels. They failed to understand the CBA and how poison pill contracts work. They failed to anticipate a poison pill contract when every analyst and armchair general manager saw it coming a mile away. They failed to understand that in free agency, a free agent is entitled to seek out the best offer for himself, not for his former team. They failed to realize that wasting two max contracts on the modern day iterations of Glenn Robinson and Shawn Kemp is generally not the way to build a winning basketball team, nor is surrounding them with roleplayers with low basketball IQ. They failed to understand that giving away long-term contracts with no foresight will result in future repercussions.

But go ahead and keep believing that a young point guard that saved the Knicks from lottery and pulled them out of a hole created by those "superstar" max contracts will revert back to being a scrub. Go ahead and keep believing that the Knicks won't be stuck in mediocrity with the best case scenario being a first round sweep for the next three years. Go ahead and keep believing that a savvy and competent front office like the Rockets' don't know how to build a team with young talent, draft picks, and cap space (all assets that the Knicks foolishly gave away). Go ahead and keep living in that New York bubble, where the only sports news reports are those feverishly praising the wonderful Knicks.

[ibraheim718]

Only in New York with the Knicks would headcases like JR and to a lesser extent Melo be miffed at Lin's presence in the locker room. Whatever resentment they had towards Lin would've been swept aside once they understood Lin was their best chance at earning that championship.

To me, Dolan made a purely monetary decision when he decided to go with Felton over Lin. To him, the drop-off right now between Felton and Lin was minimal. I agree, and in that sense I believe that Dolan made the right decision in grabbing Felton over Lin.

However, at the same time, for every 1 bad distraction Lin caused, he brought twice the fun and atmosphere in the Garden. He is certainly an exciting player to watch, whether or not you believe he is capable of becoming a go-to scorer does not take away from the fact that he glues people to their TV sets and non-fans to the NYK scene.

Yet Dolan believes the team is in a win-now mode, and for me the only reason why he could've let Lin go was because he truly, truly believed either a) Felton was better than Lin b) they were equal, or c) the drop-off was minimal.

And worst of all, I cannot help but feel sorry for Knicks fans when they watch Lin progress over the next decade. There is no doubt in my mind Lin will eventually surpass Felton. If that happens within the next 3 years, then Dolan would've made a terrible mistake.

No, no, no, no.

The locker room issue extended far beyond just Melo and JR, and had a lot to do with Lin's refusal to play at only "85%" in the playoffs. Not a good way to support your team by leaving them in the lurch.

You obviously have an idealized view of Lin's abilities that isn't backed up by reality. The Knicks do not need a "shoot first" point guard (with a low FG%). They need a pure point (Felton) who can get the ball to their proven scorers (Melo, Amare).

Lin isn't progressing anywhere. There's a reason that he went undrafted and was cut so many times. Once teams started to focus on his weaknesses, he wasn't good enough to overcome them. Wait until he has to go up against the elite guards in the WC on a nightly basis. Lin is lucky he's in Houston. They'll be more gentle when he continuously gets exposed for the good role player that he is.

The problem with some posters on this board is that they're not looking critically enough at Lin as a basketball player. There's a propensity to idealize him based on Linsanity, but that only encompassed a few games. He was in the process of being exposed when he got injured.

You'll see next season what his true worth is. The Knicks will ultimately be justified in letting him go. He's more of a marketing show than a player.

Who gets left in the lurch if Lin re-injures the surgically repaired knee? And why didn't team doctors clear him to play?

And how are you going to see what "Lin's true worth is" next year when he'll be just a 2nd year player.. why not judge his "true worth" over the life of his contract?

And any time a team prefers to deal with JR Smith's circus over Jeremy Lin's circus that should tell you about the decision making of said team.

[Durant Durant]

why are Knicks fans still butthurt about him leaving. they didn't offer anything in the first place. reads like Stephen A has multiple accounts.

I'm more puzzled as to why they (or anyone, really) think Ray Felton is anything but garbage on a basketball court.

they do that intelligence-insulting schtick to ease the pain.

[ibraheim718]

why are Knicks fans still butthurt about him leaving. they didn't offer anything in the first place. reads like Stephen A has multiple accounts.

I'm more puzzled as to why they (or anyone, really) think Ray Felton is anything but garbage on a basketball court.

Times have been so rough for we knicks fans that a simple gesture like the one I posted below is enough to get you inducted into the annals of Knicks basketball history.

[RunSunRun]

Knicks fan perspectives in stages...

Lin on Knicks = great player, huge marketability, no chance Knicks don't match, Knicks will match up to "1 billion", soon to be the G.O.A.T. point guard in the league

Lose Lin initial reaction = how dare Dolan, greatest tragedy ever, some want to become Nyets fans

Lin on Houston currently = no big deal, Lin is nothing but hype, other fans have no idea what they are talking about, Felton is now the G.O.A.T., championship in the making

Honestly, it's like observing Kubler-Ross stages of grief,
Sorry not trying to pick on you Knicks fans, but its just funny to me. And to make fun of my own fanbase, most Suns fans are in denial about Nash with many not even acknowledging him by name on our forums, lol

[KnickswiththeKnack]

Does this mean I have to go back to seeing Seaman's Furniture ads during games?!?!

[Froob]

Tough break because the knicks are struggling so much for money right? Especially playin in a city where they will sell out no matter how mediocre the team is.

[East_Coast]

It's pretty clear here that you're grasping for straws and simply regurgitating biased and uninformed NY media reports that serve little more than to damage control the incompetency of the Knicks front office. Praising Stephen A. Smith as someone who "gets the truth" when he is close to a caricature of an opinionated and uninformed Bleacher Report writer is laughable.

The fact of the matter is that the Knicks were hoping to keep Lin, and then failed spectacularly on so many levels. They failed to understand the CBA and how poison pill contracts work. They failed to anticipate a poison pill contract when every analyst and armchair general manager saw it coming a mile away. They failed to understand that in free agency, a free agent is entitled to seek out the best offer for himself, not for his former team. They failed to realize that wasting two max contracts on the modern day iterations of Glenn Robinson and Shawn Kemp is generally not the way to build a winning basketball team, nor is surrounding them with roleplayers with low basketball IQ. They failed to understand that giving away long-term contracts with no foresight will result in future repercussions.

But go ahead and keep believing that a young point guard that saved the Knicks from lottery and pulled them out of a hole created by those "superstar" max contracts will revert back to being a scrub. Go ahead and keep believing that the Knicks won't be stuck in mediocrity with the best case scenario being a first round sweep for the next three years. Go ahead and keep believing that a savvy and competent front office like the Rockets' don't know how to build a team with young talent, draft picks, and cap space (all assets that the Knicks foolishly gave away). Go ahead and keep living in that New York bubble, where the only sports news reports are those feverishly praising the wonderful Knicks.

Here's another rose-colored glasses wearing, soapbox standing ranter who's prays in front of the altar to the god-like Jeremy Lin. You just put together a cockeyed sermon that's wrong on virtually every count. Truly pathetic, yet amusing at the same time.

I have news for you -- I don't think the Knicks wanted Lin all that much. Do you remember that the early free agent talk in NY was for acquiring Steve Nash? Why would the Knicks FO engage in that type of discussion if Lin was the presumed answer at guard? As I've explained over and over in this thread, Lin's skillset doesn't fit in on the Knicks. But this falls on deaf ears for the Linsantiacs, who are all in a pout because their dear little Jeremy was "wronged" by the big, bad Knicks and that mean old James Dolan.

As far as Lin "saving the season", he did provide an initial spark but when the going got tough -- down the stretch -- he was injured. The team went 18-6 (.750) to make it to the playoffs, without so much of a hint of help from Jeremy Lin. You can't go around saying that he "saved the season" without mentioning what the team did without him.

The Knicks will be very good this coming year. They've not "mediocre" at all, but will contend in the East with the Heat and Boston. Melo, from his showing in the Olympics, is primed for a great year.

Houston will be turrible. We'll see how Lin will cope with having a bullseye on his back when dealing nightly with all those quick, elite-level guards out in the West. It will be interesting.

[ChartFiction]

The team went 18-6 (.750) to make it to the playoffs, without so much of a hint of help from Jeremy Lin.

They went 11-5, not 18-6.

You're including the 8 games Lin had with Woodson where they went 7-1.

[nykballa2k4]

During Linsanity, Maxxis Tires became the first Taiwanese corporate sponsor that signed with Madison Square Garden. Revenue from corporate sponsorships, based on signage inside a team's arena, is not shared with the rest of the league. Acer is leaving, too. Although Acer is international, it is based in Taiwan and has major assets there. I have no idea if Coca-cola is going to continue to pay to run Chinese language signs courtside inside MSG in the hopes that people overseas in Asia see the signs when they air Knicks games.

Maxxis follows Lin from New York to Houston

Taiwan-based tyre manufacturer Maxxis Tires have signed a one-year sponsorship deal with the Houston Rockets NBA franchise, the new team of Taiwanese-American basketball sensation Jeremy Lin.

Maxxis, which backed Lin's previous team the New York Knicks last year, will be entitled to courtside signage on LED boards at the Rockets' home arena, and will serve as presenting sponsor of a promotional giveaway night at some point during the coming season.
---snip---
At the same time, Maxxis and computer manufacturer Acer declined to renew one-year sponsorship deals with the Knicks.
http://www.sportspromedia.com/news/maxx ... o_houston/

Good

I HATE Knicks management for allowing Lin to walk. It was dumb on every level, so I love seeing Dolan lose money over this.

[noto12ious]

You know why I believe SAS? Because he's in the locker room talking to players, and gets the truth. You didn't hear anyone refute what he said. Also, I grew up in NY and lots of my friends who are long-time fans of the team were saying the same thing about Lin not playing.

well, well. time to put your credibility to the test. stephen a smith is a proven liar, by the way. and a proven racist who was fired for racism before

so, stephen a smith claims Lin was medically cleared for the playoffs, yes? if so, why did the knicks medical staff say lin was not medically cleared for the playoffs? why did woodson say Lin was not medically cleared? how about the new york times? were they also lying? or was it just stephen a smith lying with mythical unnamed sources? uh oh. looks like you have a problem.

one of many reports:
http://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/ ... -a-return/


"With Baron Davis and Iman Shumpert both lost to knee injuries, the Knicks, who trail the Heat, three games to one, have never needed Lin more.

The stage would seem set for a storybook return, but the reality is more complicated. Lin is not in game shape, has yet to play five-on-five and has not received medical clearance."

those pesky medical facts, huh? also, not a single person from the knicks has disputed these medical facts. nor have any players disputed lin's accounts. seems we have one proven racist making up lies and slandering for various reasons. inc dodge.

[dznutzz]

lin was a cash cow. the only reason i can think of that new york would let him walk is because the injury was worse than expected.

not only that but he went to houston. that's a team begging to make the playoffs. the media will turn on lin once they miss the playoffs

[East_Coast]

The team went 18-6 (.750) to make it to the playoffs, without so much of a hint of help from Jeremy Lin.

They went 11-5, not 18-6.

You're including the 8 games Lin had with Woodson where they went 7-1.

Actually, the team went 12-5 (.705) down the stretch without Lin -- which is still pretty impressive, I'd say.

[East_Coast]

well, well. time to put your credibility to the test. stephen a smith is a proven liar, by the way. and a proven racist who was fired for racism before

so, stephen a smith claims Lin was medically cleared for the playoffs, yes? if so, why did the knicks medical staff say lin was not medically cleared for the playoffs? why did woodson say Lin was not medically cleared? how about the new york times? were they also lying? or was it just stephen a smith lying with mythical unnamed sources? uh oh. looks like you have a problem.

My credibility? What proof do you have that SAS is a "proven liar". If you don't have said proof and you were a mainstream journalist, your newspaper could be sued for slander.

And don't be so naive. Of course, a team's medical staff will back up a player coming off of injury, rather than throwing him under the bus by saying that he could have played.

Duh!

[Mr. E]

lin was a cash cow. the only reason i can think of that new york would let him walk is because the injury was worse than expected.

not only that but he went to houston. that's a team begging to make the playoffs. the media will turn on lin once they miss the playoffs

Exactly. This is exactly right.

This is EXACTLY why Houston jettisoned all of the respected, veteran role players who had been keeping this team very competitive in a deep conference in favor of going with a ton of rookies and Kevin Martin.

It all makes perfect sense now!!!

[noto12ious]

well, well. time to put your credibility to the test. stephen a smith is a proven liar, by the way. and a proven racist who was fired for racism before

so, stephen a smith claims Lin was medically cleared for the playoffs, yes? if so, why did the knicks medical staff say lin was not medically cleared for the playoffs? why did woodson say Lin was not medically cleared? how about the new york times? were they also lying? or was it just stephen a smith lying with mythical unnamed sources? uh oh. looks like you have a problem.

My credibility? What proof do you have that SAS is a "proven liar". If you don't have said proof and you were a mainstream journalist, your newspaper could be sued for slander.

And don't be so naive. Of course, a team's medical staff will back up a player coming off of injury, rather than throwing him under the bus by saying that he could have played.

Duh!

of course it's about your credibility. i just gave you proof that lin was never medically cleared, directly contradicting the lies spewed forth by stephen a smith, whose entire credibility has already been tarnished from being a proven racist. unless you are able to provide a single shred of evidence or source contradicting such basic medical facts, bow down and enjoy your crow.

[East_Coast]

of course it's about your credibility. i just gave you proof that lin was never medically cleared, directly contradicting the lies spewed forth by stephen a smith, whose entire credibility has already been tarnished from being a proven racist. unless you are able to provide a single shred of evidence or source contradicting such basic medical facts, bow down and enjoy your crow.

I think not. Players have performed on the court, though not 'officially cleared' before. All a player has to do is make it plain that no matter what, he wants to play. If he isn't in danger of re-injuring himself, the team and coach may say ok. Its happened before, and I'm sure it will again.

I listened to a show where SAS addressed this matter. Unless I'm mistaken, he didn't use the terms 'medically cleared to play', but intimated that it was common locker room knowledge that he could have produced something on the court.

The words that SAS quoted from team members was, "Can you give us 15 minutes"? Words so that effect.

So, its my belief that if Lin really wanted to get out on the floor even for a few minutes during the playoffs, just to provide a spark for the team, he probably would have been allowed to. That's what SAS was addressing.

As already noted, the 'official medical clearance' issue can be thorny, because naturally teams will opt to protect a player, rather than announcing that he was ok to play and chose not to.