Lakers FTA advantage since March

[bebit]

Again, Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games. Before that, they went 2-9

Utah has it's BEST stretch of games during what people call ref fixing. Both GS & Hou have doing good too. Take off the tinfoil.

YOU DON'T GET IT. FTA IS NOT THE ABSOLUTE DETERMININE FACTOR IN A W/L. REF'S CAN'T WIN OR LOSE A GAME. THEY CAN ONLY CALL MORE/LESS FOULS TO TRY TO MANIPULATE THE GAME. TEAMS CAN STILL WIN IN SPITE OF THE REFS IF THEY PLAY GOOD ENOUGH, WHICH IS WHAT THE JAZZ HAVE BEEN DOING.

During the season, Utah had 23 FTA per game. During the battle for 8th seed, they've had 14 FTA per game. Utah has been playing with a disadvantage while the Lakers have been getting help.

The Laker's FTs over the last 5 games is nearly the same as their season average, what advantage do you speak of? They are taking a whopping 2 more FTs, and that's with Kobe playing crazy minutes, and hack-a-Dwight. The stats refute your very argument.

And you don't fix games by giving a huge volume of FTs. You fix them by getting star players in foul trouble. Stern must be the worst fixer of alltime considering that Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games, after going 2-9.

Don't get why you keep bringing up GSW and Hou as they have already clinched the playoffs. It's the Jazz that stand in the Lakers way.

because they are only a few games above LA, and Stern could have easily screwed them to increase LA's chances. GS/Hou/Utah have all been winning, so where is the fixing?

GSW and Houston CLINCHED. It doesn't matter if they lose or win the rest of there games, they have 0 impact on the Lakers making the playoffs.

[tfmiii]

Honestly, after what happened to Kobe last night, why are people still talking about this? The Laker season is over. They might make the playoffs, they might not, but it's over for them, who cares?

because, believe it or not, it is really not about the lakers... it is about the league and manipulation of the product to bias outcomes.

I'd be just as upset if it were miami or even, heaven forbid, the Celtics - although as long as Heinsohn is calling games there is likely an upper limit on how much favorable treatment the Cs could receive from the refs

[Tubal]

Again, Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games. Before that, they went 2-9

Utah has it's BEST stretch of games during what people call ref fixing. Both GS & Hou have doing good too. Take off the tinfoil.

YOU DON'T GET IT. FTA IS NOT THE ABSOLUTE DETERMININE FACTOR IN A W/L. REF'S CAN'T WIN OR LOSE A GAME. THEY CAN ONLY CALL MORE/LESS FOULS TO TRY TO MANIPULATE THE GAME. TEAMS CAN STILL WIN IN SPITE OF THE REFS IF THEY PLAY GOOD ENOUGH, WHICH IS WHAT THE JAZZ HAVE BEEN DOING.

During the season, Utah had 23 FTA per game. During the battle for 8th seed, they've had 14 FTA per game. Utah has been playing with a disadvantage while the Lakers have been getting help.

The Laker's FTs over the last 5 games is nearly the same as their season average, what advantage do you speak of? They are taking a whopping 2 more FTs, and that's with Kobe playing crazy minutes, and hack-a-Dwight. The stats refute your very argument.

And you don't fix games by giving a huge volume of FTs. You fix them by getting star players in foul trouble. Stern must be the worst fixer of alltime considering that Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games, after going 2-9.

Don't get why you keep bringing up GSW and Hou as they have already clinched the playoffs. It's the Jazz that stand in the Lakers way.

because they are only a few games above LA, and Stern could have easily screwed them to increase LA's chances. GS/Hou/Utah have all been winning, so where is the fixing?

It's like you really are Skip Bayless. Amazing how clueless someone can be.

[drexlerfan11]

Again, Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games. Before that, they went 2-9

Utah has it's BEST stretch of games during what people call ref fixing. Both GS & Hou have doing good too. Take off the tinfoil.

YOU DON'T GET IT. FTA IS NOT THE ABSOLUTE DETERMININE FACTOR IN A W/L. REF'S CAN'T WIN OR LOSE A GAME. THEY CAN ONLY CALL MORE/LESS FOULS TO TRY TO MANIPULATE THE GAME. TEAMS CAN STILL WIN IN SPITE OF THE REFS IF THEY PLAY GOOD ENOUGH, WHICH IS WHAT THE JAZZ HAVE BEEN DOING.

During the season, Utah had 23 FTA per game. During the battle for 8th seed, they've had 14 FTA per game. Utah has been playing with a disadvantage while the Lakers have been getting help.

Your rationale is absolutely sound (about FTA not determining W/L) but your overall claim is also naive to a wider spectrum of possibility. I can see you already have your mind made up as to why the refs are calling more/less fouls, so that doesn't help your case. Consider this, Utah is 8-2 over their last 10 games (80%). Well during the season they are about a .500 team (4 games over at .525). It can be said that this has not been a "norm" stretch of games for the Jazz as their success has been better. So are they doing something differently maybe to make this push for the playoffs (rotation, pace, shot distribution, etc.)? Has this effected free throw shooting in the slightest? Any injuries to players who would typically get fouls? Who did they play in that stretch and what are their tendencies? Was it similar to games in which the two teams played at a different time in the season? So many variables and possibilities. I'm not even saying they are playing any differently as I haven't watched any Jazz games, just pointing out that there is more significance to An Unbiased Fan's point that maybe he didn't even realize.

[An Unbiased Fan]

GSW and Houston CLINCHED. It doesn't matter if they lose or win the rest of there games, they have 0 impact on the Lakers making the playoffs.

Read the thread title. The Lakers are only 2 games behind both teams in the loss column, so the refs could have easily screwed those teams to allow LA into the playoffs.

Instead GS/HOU/Utah have ALL done fine the last 10 games. So where is this fixing you speak of? Where's the logic? No, I just see a lot of crying, and blatant bitterness because people were rooting for LA to miss the playoffs.

The only fixing I have seen Stern do is with the CP3 trade against the Lakers.

[Tubal]

Again, Utah is 8-2 in their last 10 games. Before that, they went 2-9

Utah has it's BEST stretch of games during what people call ref fixing. Both GS & Hou have doing good too. Take off the tinfoil.

YOU DON'T GET IT. FTA IS NOT THE ABSOLUTE DETERMININE FACTOR IN A W/L. REF'S CAN'T WIN OR LOSE A GAME. THEY CAN ONLY CALL MORE/LESS FOULS TO TRY TO MANIPULATE THE GAME. TEAMS CAN STILL WIN IN SPITE OF THE REFS IF THEY PLAY GOOD ENOUGH, WHICH IS WHAT THE JAZZ HAVE BEEN DOING.

During the season, Utah had 23 FTA per game. During the battle for 8th seed, they've had 14 FTA per game. Utah has been playing with a disadvantage while the Lakers have been getting help.

Your rationale is absolutely sound (about FTA not determining W/L) but your overall claim is also naive to a wider spectrum of possibility. I can see you already have your mind made up as to why the refs are calling more/less fouls, so that doesn't help your case. Consider this, Utah is 8-2 over their last 10 games (80%). Well during the season they are about a .500 team (4 games over at .525). It can be said that this has not been a "norm" stretch of games for the Jazz as their success has been better. So are they doing something differently maybe to make this push for the playoffs (rotation, pace, shot distribution, etc.)? Has this effected free throw shooting in the slightest? Any injuries to players who would typically get fouls? Who did they play in that stretch and what are their tendencies? Was it similar to games in which the two teams played at a different time in the season? So many variables and possibilities. I'm not even saying they are playing any differently as I haven't watched any Jazz games, just pointing out that there is more significance to An Unbiased Fan's point that maybe he didn't even realize.

Actually it's because 8 of 10 have been at home, and in the last 10 games, they've only beat 2 opponents over .500 (Brooklyn and Golden State)

So they're mostly 8-2 because they've had a really weak schedule.

[cookie monster]

This sort of goes hand in hand with Dallas losing +5 games or so due to bad officiating and no calls (they must have received atleast 5 apologies from the NBA officals on the top of my head).

I don't like being a conspiracy theorist.. but with the death of Jerry Buss and everything thats happened so far with the lakers and officiating with regards to that 8th seed, one has to wonder if they are really trying favor one team over the other. Its funny that it all backfired with Kobe's injury.

[hammel123]

This sort of goes hand in hand with Dallas losing +5 games or so due to bad officiating and no calls (they must have received atleast 5 apologies from the NBA officals on the top of my head).

I don't like being a conspiracy theorist.. but with the death of Jerry Buss and everything thats happened so far with the lakers and officiating with regards to that 8th seed, one has to wonder if they are really trying favor one team over the other. Its funny that it all backfired with Kobe's injury.

More about money LA generates via tv ratings which allow for exceeding lux tax which gets distributed to small market teams

Last few games for the Lakers, good stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MhmGyZ7KF0

[cookie monster]

This sort of goes hand in hand with Dallas losing +5 games or so due to bad officiating and no calls (they must have received atleast 5 apologies from the NBA officals on the top of my head).

I don't like being a conspiracy theorist.. but with the death of Jerry Buss and everything thats happened so far with the lakers and officiating with regards to that 8th seed, one has to wonder if they are really trying favor one team over the other. Its funny that it all backfired with Kobe's injury.

More about money LA generates via tv ratings which allow for exceeding lux tax which gets distributed to small market teams

Last few games for the Lakers, good stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MhmGyZ7KF0

That youtube clip sums the situation up pretty nice Oh wow, I didn't see some of those games but that was pretty damn bad.

/thread.

[cookie monster]

Just look at some of the players facial expressions

[drexlerfan11]

Your rationale is absolutely sound (about FTA not determining W/L) but your overall claim is also naive to a wider spectrum of possibility. I can see you already have your mind made up as to why the refs are calling more/less fouls, so that doesn't help your case. Consider this, Utah is 8-2 over their last 10 games (80%). Well during the season they are about a .500 team (4 games over at .525). It can be said that this has not been a "norm" stretch of games for the Jazz as their success has been better. So are they doing something differently maybe to make this push for the playoffs (rotation, pace, shot distribution, etc.)? Has this effected free throw shooting in the slightest? Any injuries to players who would typically get fouls? Who did they play in that stretch and what are their tendencies? Was it similar to games in which the two teams played at a different time in the season? So many variables and possibilities. I'm not even saying they are playing any differently as I haven't watched any Jazz games, just pointing out that there is more significance to An Unbiased Fan's point that maybe he didn't even realize.

Actually it's because 8 of 10 have been at home, and in the last 10 games, they've only beat 2 opponents over .500 (Brooklyn and Golden State)

So they're mostly 8-2 because they've had a really weak schedule.

Fair enough. Subsequent questions could be asked based on that info (effect of weak schedule on FT for one). However my main goal is to prevent credulity rather than promote absolute skepticism (i.e. I could ask infinite number of questions and maybe you'd never fully convince me). I'm hoping that people aren't buying into the conspiracy theory merely because of a strong allegiance to their team (although definitely understandable) or an irrational grudge against the Lakers. Detachment is necessary as is investigating other possibilities/data. This particular data set of FT differential does not necessarily conclude a conspiracy on its own. While I believe the video cookiemonster posted is a good form of evidence, I feel a video documenting the Jazz lack of calls would be far more interesting and telling.

[Tubal]

Your rationale is absolutely sound (about FTA not determining W/L) but your overall claim is also naive to a wider spectrum of possibility. I can see you already have your mind made up as to why the refs are calling more/less fouls, so that doesn't help your case. Consider this, Utah is 8-2 over their last 10 games (80%). Well during the season they are about a .500 team (4 games over at .525). It can be said that this has not been a "norm" stretch of games for the Jazz as their success has been better. So are they doing something differently maybe to make this push for the playoffs (rotation, pace, shot distribution, etc.)? Has this effected free throw shooting in the slightest? Any injuries to players who would typically get fouls? Who did they play in that stretch and what are their tendencies? Was it similar to games in which the two teams played at a different time in the season? So many variables and possibilities. I'm not even saying they are playing any differently as I haven't watched any Jazz games, just pointing out that there is more significance to An Unbiased Fan's point that maybe he didn't even realize.

Actually it's because 8 of 10 have been at home, and in the last 10 games, they've only beat 2 opponents over .500 (Brooklyn and Golden State)

So they're mostly 8-2 because they've had a really weak schedule.

Fair enough. Subsequent questions could be asked based on that info (effect of weak schedule on FT for one). However my main goal is to prevent credulity rather than promote absolute skepticism (i.e. I could ask infinite number of questions and maybe you'd never fully convince me). I'm hoping that people aren't buying into the conspiracy theory merely because of a strong allegiance to their team (although definitely understandable) or an irrational grudge against the Lakers. Detachment is necessary as is investigating other possibilities/data. This particular data set of FT differential does not necessarily conclude a conspiracy on its own. While I believe the video cookiemonster posted is a good form of evidence, I feel a video documenting the Jazz lack of calls would be far more interesting and telling.

I think anyone could look at a specific call or even a specific game and come up with a hundred reasons why or why not it should/shouldn't have been a foul. That's why taking an average over a number of games I would think would be more convincing.

Personally I was leaning pretty heavily before last night that there was some manipulation by the refs just because Utah and Dallas FTA were down so much over the last 2 weeks. But the LA/GS game and the 50-16 FTA disparity put me over the top.

[th87]

No guys, this FT disparity is just a coincidence.

Because the refs never helped the Lakers force an undeserved Game 7 or anything.

[CoreyGallagher]

It's very obvious that they're getting preferential treatment, some conspiracies are factual people...

[Carmelofan]

Here are some facts about the 2013 Lakers FTA advantage since March.

21 games is not a small sample size. It is a quarter of a season worth of games.

1. They have shot an avg of 12.4 more FTA per game than the opposition.
2. No team in NBA history has ever averaged that more FTA per game over an 82 game season. Basically since the beginning of March the 2013 LAL, a team stuck around .50, has been the greatest team in NBA history at drawing a free throw advantage.
3. Teams playing LAL has shot 5.36 less FTA than their season average.
4. They have shot under their seasonal FTA in 19 of 21 games.

Lol...

I'm telling you the chris paul botched trade was done by the league to make people think the league doesn't give preferential treatment to the lakers.

It is so obvious they did it to act as a cover up for the pau/kwame trade which they made as well.

[Carmelofan]

It's very obvious that they're getting preferential treatment, some conspiracies are factual people...

Most conspiracies are usually true. This is a fact.

This is an evil world driven by greed and lust for power. That's why conspiracies exist and are real.

[mr_sunshine]

It's very obvious that they're getting preferential treatment, some conspiracies are factual people...

Most conspiracies are usually true. This is a fact.

This is an evil world driven by greed and lust for power. That's why conspiracies exist and are real.

No way man! The NBA is 100% legit. That's why they have their draft lotto audited by an accounting firm...yet they won't show it out in the open. It's totally legit though! However, there's no footage or photos of the lotto allowed.

[amb1ent]

right, because ernst & young would risk its reputation to be on the take for the draft.

[DijonRondo]

It's not like the refs have ever fixed a game for the Lakers, oh wait.

[HeatRing2012]

Here are some facts about the 2013 Lakers FTA advantage since March.

21 games is not a small sample size. It is a quarter of a season worth of games.

1. They have shot an avg of 12.4 more FTA per game than the opposition.
2. No team in NBA history has ever averaged that more FTA per game over an 82 game season. Basically since the beginning of March the 2013 LAL, a team stuck around .50, has been the greatest team in NBA history at drawing a free throw advantage.
3. Teams playing LAL has shot 5.36 less FTA than their season average.
4. They have shot under their seasonal FTA in 19 of 21 games.

Lol...

I'm telling you the chris paul botched trade was done by the league to make people think the league doesn't give preferential treatment to the lakers.

It is so obvious they did it to act as a cover up for the pau/kwame trade which they made as well.

I think the CP3-to-LA thing was mainly interrupted because the Hornets were still owned by the NBA.
the best interest for the league was getting those $350m back by selling a healthy team (the LA players coming back in the CP3 trade were a joke).