This Lakers roster is extrememly unimpressive

[Slava]

I don’t see LA holding onto a top 4 spot in the West. They lost against the only real challenge they’ve had so far and they’ve had essentially one road game.

They are third in the league in defensive rating at 98.35, 4th if you adjust for the strength of opponent.
Top of the league in margin of victory, 5th if you adjust for strength of opponent.
11th in the league in 3 point % differential and 21st in attempts.
20th in rebounding differential.

So at least do some work before posting and hoping no one would check.

The rebounding, perimeter defense, and shooting have all looked bottom third of the league level, so I’m not convinced yet this is some juggernaut because of a 4-1 start.

[kobe_vs_jordan]

Has anyone ever skated on rep more than rondo? He’s been a negative for most of the decade. 2 good playoff games for the bulls and one good series for the pels and people still talk as if he can be prime rondo.

He's been a backup PG with great vision who occasionally has great games. People act like he's the worst backup in the lg or they Lakers have better options.

[LoveTheNBA23]

Lmaooooo, this thread is hilarious. People love to discredit the Lakers when they won the game while playing like **** (at least the role players). You’re going to get up and downs from the role players but LBJ and AD were able to carry them to a W on the road against a really good Mavs team. There will be games where the role players are going off and those will be blowouts.

[Slava]

I don't understand the argument that they only have AD & LeBron, what other teams in the league have sustainable options beyond their two max contract players? That's the whole point of roster building around superstars that you need players who don't need the ball in their hands.

The Lakers roster has two significant issues, lack of a secondary ball handler and another big wing to throw at Leonard and George, they have until end of February to fix that with a trade or hoping someone shakes loose from the buy out market.

[Cafu]

Not checking the stats but on top of eyes test, the Lakers has:
AD,LBJ, Green playing well on Offense and Defense
Plus Defense but neutral O: Dwight
Good D but bad O: Caruso, Bradley
Bad everything: KCP, Mcgee, Cook, Daniels

Still a lots of holes but I like their mindset and they are building their identity on Defense. Especially the second half of the games.

[yoyoboy]

I don’t see LA holding onto a top 4 spot in the West. They lost against the only real challenge they’ve had so far and they’ve had essentially one road game.

They are third in the league in defensive rating at 98.35, 4th if you adjust for the strength of opponent.
Top of the league in margin of victory, 5th if you adjust for strength of opponent.
11th in the league in 3 point % differential and 21st in attempts.
20th in rebounding differential.

So at least do some work before posting and hoping no one would check.

The rebounding, perimeter defense, and shooting have all looked bottom third of the league level, so I’m not convinced yet this is some juggernaut because of a 4-1 start.

25th in 3PM per game
23th in 3P%

24th in DREB%
22nd in OREB%
20th in Reb Diff

2018-19 DRPM:
Green: +2.07 (1/99 among SGs)
Rondo: -1.38 (50/68 among PGs)
Cook: -3.49 (65/68 among PGs)
Daniels: -1.23 (64/74 among SFs)
Caruso: +0.77 (11/99 among SGs)
Bradley: -1.22 (59/85 among SGs)
Caldwell-Pope: -2.17 (76/85 among SGs)
Kuzma: -0.77 (64/78 among PFs)


So, so far the outside shooting and rebounding have looked every part of bottom third of the league level as I said. And while there isn’t a good measure of individual defense for 5 games worth, we can look at last year’s DRPM data to see roughly how good the perimeter defenders on the team are. Note: Kuzma is listed with the PFs but he’ll most likely be defending SFs this year. As you can see above, Green is a fantastic defender. Caruso is good. And the other 6 guys are awful and in some instances right near the very bottom. The team DRTG is great now but over a larger sample size, the porous perimeter defense will probably start to take a toll, especially when Rondo comes back and starts getting minutes.

The Lakers have indeed performed well so far when you look at record, point differential, and DRTG, but again, 4 of the 5 games have essentially been at home. Memphis and Charlotte will be bottom 5 teams in the league, so those aren’t too impressive of teams to beat up on. Utah at home without Bogdanović and during the midst of an uncharacteristically awful Conley start to the season is an okay win. Dallas on the road is a good win. The Clippers without George and in a stadium of mostly Lakers fans was a bad loss. 3 games against Denver, 2 games against Philly, 2 games against Milwaukee, 2 games against Toronto, 3 games against San Antonio, 3 games against Houston, 3 games against LAC, 3 games against Utah, 3 games against Portland...all still on the horizon. And what happens when Davis inevitably goes down? Also, LeBron has been going balls to the wall so far and I don’t see that lasting a full regular season when he’s trying to preserve himself for the postseason.

I’m sticking to my prediction that the Lakers will win ~48 games and fail to earn HCA in the playoffs. And LeBron and Davis will have to play at GOAT levels for the team to advance to the WCF. I don’t see any way they make a Finals appearance though.

[BVB24]

The Lakers have 2 top-6 players... they’re the only team that can claim that. Then you throw in solid role players like Kuzma, Danny Green, and Dwight Howard... even Troy Daniels and Avery Bradley have been solid for them. They’re a top-5 team in the league easy and I’d take them over any team in the league not named the Clippers in a 7-game series.

[Pharmcat]

I don't understand the argument that they only have AD & LeBron, what other teams in the league have sustainable options beyond their two max contract players? That's the whole point of roster building around superstars that you need players who don't need the ball in their hands.

The Lakers roster has two significant issues, lack of a secondary ball handler and another big wing to throw at Leonard and George, they have until end of February to fix that with a trade or hoping someone shakes loose from the buy out market.

That's the point they wasted their 30 million in cap . Getting the 3 guys i had mentioned would have given them a much more balanced starting 5. Delon wright would be the perfect guard for this team

[the7boss]

I’m not sold 100% on this roster as champs, but they’re growing on me, I need more savvy vet play, more games like last night’s which are huge for confidence building and we lacked that last year. Kuzma is the X factor, if he blossoms as the third star and let AD and LBJ alternate off nights and rest, then we are good to go.

[yoyoboy]

If LA had Brook Lopez back taking McGee’s spot, Iguodala off the bench (which is still possible I guess), Rondo given DNPs, and Kuzma were flipped for a secondary ballhandler, they’d be a championship contender and probably even the favorites.

As of right now there are just too many holes. No reliable ballhandler aside from LeBron. Too many defensive liabilities on the perimeter. Poor rebounding (because of the guards and McGee). And Rondo is a huge net negative who’s about to mess things up when he returns.

[Slava]

I don’t see LA holding onto a top 4 spot in the West. They lost against the only real challenge they’ve had so far and they’ve had essentially one road game.

They are third in the league in defensive rating at 98.35, 4th if you adjust for the strength of opponent.
Top of the league in margin of victory, 5th if you adjust for strength of opponent.
11th in the league in 3 point % differential and 21st in attempts.
20th in rebounding differential.

So at least do some work before posting and hoping no one would check.

The rebounding, perimeter defense, and shooting have all looked bottom third of the league level, so I’m not convinced yet this is some juggernaut because of a 4-1 start.

25th in 3PM per game
23th in 3P%

24th in DREB%
22nd in OREB%
20th in Reb Diff

2018-19 DRPM:
Green: +2.07 (1/99 among SGs)
Rondo: -1.38 (50/68 among PGs)
Cook: -3.49 (65/68 among PGs)
Daniels: -1.23 (64/74 among SFs)
Caruso: +0.77 (11/99 among SGs)
Bradley: -1.22 (59/85 among SGs)
Caldwell-Pope: -2.17 (76/85 among SGs)
Kuzma: -0.77 (64/78 among PFs)


So, so far the outside shooting and rebounding have looked every part of bottom third of the league level as I said. And while there isn’t a good measure of individual defense for 5 games worth, we can look at last year’s DRPM data to see roughly how good the perimeter defenders on the team are. Note: Kuzma is listed with the PFs but he’ll most likely be defending SFs this year. As you can see above, Green is a fantastic defender. Caruso is good. And the other 6 guys are awful and in some instances right near the very bottom. The team DRTG is great now but over a larger sample size, the porous perimeter defense will probably start to take a toll, especially when Rondo comes back and starts getting minutes.

The Lakers have indeed performed well so far when you look at record, point differential, and DRTG, but again, 4 of the 5 games have essentially been at home. Memphis and Charlotte will be bottom 5 teams in the league, so those aren’t too impressive of teams to beat up on. Utah at home without Bogdanović and during the midst of an uncharacteristically awful Conley start to the season is an okay win. Dallas on the road is a good win. The Clippers without George and in a stadium of mostly Lakers fans was a bad loss. 3 games against Denver, 2 games against Philly, 2 games against Milwaukee, 2 games against Toronto, 3 games against San Antonio, 3 games against Houston, 3 games against LAC, 3 games against Utah, 3 games against Portland...all still on the horizon. And what happens when Davis inevitably goes down? Also, LeBron has been going balls to the wall so far and I don’t see that lasting a full regular season when he’s trying to preserve himself for the postseason.

I’m sticking to my prediction that the Lakers will win ~48 games and fail to earn HCA in the playoffs. And LeBron and Davis will have to play at GOAT levels for the team to advance to the WCF. I don’t see any way they make a Finals appearance though.

I'm not sure why you are comparing them against the league when your entire argument is based on them not having a rough schedule. Just look at differentials then.

The 3 point attempt rate so far has been part of the offence by design, they are trying to post up Davis and LeBron a lot and they are getting really high percentage shots out of those actions.

The rebounding differential, especially from the guards hasn't been great but it's not as bad as you are painting and certainly not bottom 3 level.

Lastly last year's drpm has little relevance, that depends a lot on team, teammates and defensive schemes. This is a team that has played 5 games together and yet the cohesiveness on defense has been one of the best attributes that has come together quickly.

You're entitled to your opinion but you cannot spin the stats to prove it.

[The_Hater]

I don’t see LA holding onto a top 4 spot in the West. They lost against the only real challenge they’ve had so far and they’ve had essentially one road game.

They are third in the league in defensive rating at 98.35, 4th if you adjust for the strength of opponent.
Top of the league in margin of victory, 5th if you adjust for strength of opponent.
11th in the league in 3 point % differential and 21st in attempts.
20th in rebounding differential.

So at least do some work before posting and hoping no one would check.

The rebounding, perimeter defense, and shooting have all looked bottom third of the league level, so I’m not convinced yet this is some juggernaut because of a 4-1 start.

25th in 3PM per game
23th in 3P%

24th in DREB%
22nd in OREB%
20th in Reb Diff

2018-19 DRPM:
Green: +2.07 (1/99 among SGs)
Rondo: -1.38 (50/68 among PGs)
Cook: -3.49 (65/68 among PGs)
Daniels: -1.23 (64/74 among SFs)
Caruso: +0.77 (11/99 among SGs)
Bradley: -1.22 (59/85 among SGs)
Caldwell-Pope: -2.17 (76/85 among SGs)
Kuzma: -0.77 (64/78 among PFs)


So, so far the outside shooting and rebounding have looked every part of bottom third of the league level as I said. And while there isn’t a good measure of individual defense for 5 games worth, we can look at last year’s DRPM data to see roughly how good the perimeter defenders on the team are. Note: Kuzma is listed with the PFs but he’ll most likely be defending SFs this year. As you can see above, Green is a fantastic defender. Caruso is good. And the other 6 guys are awful and in some instances right near the very bottom. The team DRTG is great now but over a larger sample size, the porous perimeter defense will probably start to take a toll, especially when Rondo comes back and starts getting minutes.

The Lakers have indeed performed well so far when you look at record, point differential, and DRTG, but again, 4 of the 5 games have essentially been at home. Memphis and Charlotte will be bottom 5 teams in the league, so those aren’t too impressive of teams to beat up on. Utah at home without Bogdanović and during the midst of an uncharacteristically awful Conley start to the season is an okay win. Dallas on the road is a good win. The Clippers without George and in a stadium of mostly Lakers fans was a bad loss. 3 games against Denver, 2 games against Philly, 2 games against Milwaukee, 2 games against Toronto, 3 games against San Antonio, 3 games against Houston, 3 games against LAC, 3 games against Utah, 3 games against Portland...all still on the horizon. And what happens when Davis inevitably goes down? Also, LeBron has been going balls to the wall so far and I don’t see that lasting a full regular season when he’s trying to preserve himself for the postseason.

I’m sticking to my prediction that the Lakers will win ~48 games and fail to earn HCA in the playoffs. And LeBron and Davis will have to play at GOAT levels for the team to advance to the WCF. I don’t see any way they make a Finals appearance though.

Aren’t Slava’s stats clearly more important than the ones your have provided here since the Lakers are 4-1 with the league best point differential?

You’re fighting the good fight here but every single team has statistical areas where they’re not going to be elite and aren’t wins and outscoring your opponents by a great margin more important than rebounding % and number of made 3’s? This seems like a huge reach on your part. A better direction to go here would have been just to say that you would like to see a bigger sample size of games. .

[kobe_vs_jordan]

I don't understand the argument that they only have AD & LeBron, what other teams in the league have sustainable options beyond their two max contract players? That's the whole point of roster building around superstars that you need players who don't need the ball in their hands.

The Lakers roster has two significant issues, lack of a secondary ball handler and another big wing to throw at Leonard and George, they have until end of February to fix that with a trade or hoping someone shakes loose from the buy out market.

That's the point they wasted their 30 million in cap . Getting the 3 guys i had mentioned would have given them a much more balanced starting 5. Delon wright would be the perfect guard for this team

They wasted cap b/c they waited on Kawhi.

[jehosafats]

I tend to agree they really need a point guard besides Rondo to kickstart their offense, but who they get is not obvious to me. Jarret Jack seemed like an obvious choice, but he's in the ether somewhere, out of the league. LAL is likely grappling with the dearth of talented PGs more than any other team. Experienced PGs are especially hard to find. There's some utilitarian PGs like Schroeder, Dunn, and McConnell, but each are possible trainwrecks not at all worth the trouble.

[LakersSoul]

Lakers are 4-1 and they haven’t played the best basketball yet.

Kuzma returned yesterday with minutes restriction and he will add depth. Rondo is just turning the corner and should add depth in a week or so.

Wait until the team starts to gel.
Wait until KCP, Cook, Daniels start making shots.

This is just the beginning of the team running as a productive unit. Until the team understands and buys into Vogel’s game plans. He is a huge upgrade from the hustle plays that Luke Walton ran.

[yoyoboy]

They are third in the league in defensive rating at 98.35, 4th if you adjust for the strength of opponent.
Top of the league in margin of victory, 5th if you adjust for strength of opponent.
11th in the league in 3 point % differential and 21st in attempts.
20th in rebounding differential.

So at least do some work before posting and hoping no one would check.

25th in 3PM per game
23th in 3P%

24th in DREB%
22nd in OREB%
20th in Reb Diff

2018-19 DRPM:
Green: +2.07 (1/99 among SGs)
Rondo: -1.38 (50/68 among PGs)
Cook: -3.49 (65/68 among PGs)
Daniels: -1.23 (64/74 among SFs)
Caruso: +0.77 (11/99 among SGs)
Bradley: -1.22 (59/85 among SGs)
Caldwell-Pope: -2.17 (76/85 among SGs)
Kuzma: -0.77 (64/78 among PFs)


So, so far the outside shooting and rebounding have looked every part of bottom third of the league level as I said. And while there isn’t a good measure of individual defense for 5 games worth, we can look at last year’s DRPM data to see roughly how good the perimeter defenders on the team are. Note: Kuzma is listed with the PFs but he’ll most likely be defending SFs this year. As you can see above, Green is a fantastic defender. Caruso is good. And the other 6 guys are awful and in some instances right near the very bottom. The team DRTG is great now but over a larger sample size, the porous perimeter defense will probably start to take a toll, especially when Rondo comes back and starts getting minutes.

The Lakers have indeed performed well so far when you look at record, point differential, and DRTG, but again, 4 of the 5 games have essentially been at home. Memphis and Charlotte will be bottom 5 teams in the league, so those aren’t too impressive of teams to beat up on. Utah at home without Bogdanović and during the midst of an uncharacteristically awful Conley start to the season is an okay win. Dallas on the road is a good win. The Clippers without George and in a stadium of mostly Lakers fans was a bad loss. 3 games against Denver, 2 games against Philly, 2 games against Milwaukee, 2 games against Toronto, 3 games against San Antonio, 3 games against Houston, 3 games against LAC, 3 games against Utah, 3 games against Portland...all still on the horizon. And what happens when Davis inevitably goes down? Also, LeBron has been going balls to the wall so far and I don’t see that lasting a full regular season when he’s trying to preserve himself for the postseason.

I’m sticking to my prediction that the Lakers will win ~48 games and fail to earn HCA in the playoffs. And LeBron and Davis will have to play at GOAT levels for the team to advance to the WCF. I don’t see any way they make a Finals appearance though.

Aren’t Slava’s stats clearly more important than the ones your have provided here since the Lakers are 4-1 with the league best point differential?

You’re fighting the good fight here but every single team has statistical areas where they’re not going to be elite and aren’t wins and outscoring your opponents by a great margin more important than rebounding % and number of made 3’s? This seems like a huge reach on your part. A better direction to go here would have been just to say that you would like to see a bigger sample size of games. .

LA has performed well so far. I’m just looking at their weaknesses and projecting how those will affect the Lakers’ success over the course of the whole season. Perimeter defense and rebounding are major issues. I think the 3 point shooting will bounce back a bit. And there’s a clear lack of a secondary ballhandler. I just don’t think they have very valuable players outside of LeBron, Davis, Green, and Dwight. Those 4, along with Caruso, form a fantastic lineup imo. But after that the roster is filled with a whole lot of negatives.

[The_Hater]

25th in 3PM per game
23th in 3P%

24th in DREB%
22nd in OREB%
20th in Reb Diff

2018-19 DRPM:
Green: +2.07 (1/99 among SGs)
Rondo: -1.38 (50/68 among PGs)
Cook: -3.49 (65/68 among PGs)
Daniels: -1.23 (64/74 among SFs)
Caruso: +0.77 (11/99 among SGs)
Bradley: -1.22 (59/85 among SGs)
Caldwell-Pope: -2.17 (76/85 among SGs)
Kuzma: -0.77 (64/78 among PFs)


So, so far the outside shooting and rebounding have looked every part of bottom third of the league level as I said. And while there isn’t a good measure of individual defense for 5 games worth, we can look at last year’s DRPM data to see roughly how good the perimeter defenders on the team are. Note: Kuzma is listed with the PFs but he’ll most likely be defending SFs this year. As you can see above, Green is a fantastic defender. Caruso is good. And the other 6 guys are awful and in some instances right near the very bottom. The team DRTG is great now but over a larger sample size, the porous perimeter defense will probably start to take a toll, especially when Rondo comes back and starts getting minutes.

The Lakers have indeed performed well so far when you look at record, point differential, and DRTG, but again, 4 of the 5 games have essentially been at home. Memphis and Charlotte will be bottom 5 teams in the league, so those aren’t too impressive of teams to beat up on. Utah at home without Bogdanović and during the midst of an uncharacteristically awful Conley start to the season is an okay win. Dallas on the road is a good win. The Clippers without George and in a stadium of mostly Lakers fans was a bad loss. 3 games against Denver, 2 games against Philly, 2 games against Milwaukee, 2 games against Toronto, 3 games against San Antonio, 3 games against Houston, 3 games against LAC, 3 games against Utah, 3 games against Portland...all still on the horizon. And what happens when Davis inevitably goes down? Also, LeBron has been going balls to the wall so far and I don’t see that lasting a full regular season when he’s trying to preserve himself for the postseason.

I’m sticking to my prediction that the Lakers will win ~48 games and fail to earn HCA in the playoffs. And LeBron and Davis will have to play at GOAT levels for the team to advance to the WCF. I don’t see any way they make a Finals appearance though.

Aren’t Slava’s stats clearly more important than the ones your have provided here since the Lakers are 4-1 with the league best point differential?

You’re fighting the good fight here but every single team has statistical areas where they’re not going to be elite and aren’t wins and outscoring your opponents by a great margin more important than rebounding % and number of made 3’s? This seems like a huge reach on your part. A better direction to go here would have been just to say that you would like to see a bigger sample size of games. .

LA has performed well so far. I’m just looking at their weaknesses and projecting how those will affect the Lakers’ success over the course of the whole season. Perimeter defense and rebounding are major issues. I think the 3 point shooting will bounce back a bit. And there’s a clear lack of a secondary ballhandler. I just don’t think they have very valuable players outside of LeBron, Davis, Green, and Dwight. Those 4, along with Caruso, form a fantastic lineup imo. But after that the roster is filled with a whole lot of negatives.

On the flip side they pretty much have a brand new roster who has never played together before, plus they haven’t had Kuzma or Rondo in the lineup (I agree that Rondo may or may not help) and yet they still started 4-1 with the leagues best point differential.

I’m sure they still have some flaws, I’m just not sure how anyone can spend a lot of time painting their start to the season with a negative light. And they still have 77 games to go to get healthy and add players around the edges before the important games begin.

[TheGOATWill]

Now that you mention it the patriots are unimpressive without Brady and Belichick. sandwiches are unimpressive without meat and cheese. Einstein is unimpressive without E and MC squared.

[Amare_1_Knicks]

Rondo’s going to be a very important part of this team. His ability to direct traffic, handle the ball and facilitate will prove invaluable for this team whose only play-maker right now is Lebron.

When Kuzma hits his stride he’ll fit nicely as a consistent third option behind AD/Lebron. They should only need about 15-16PPG from him at most, and he’s more than capable of producing that efficiently(or at league average efficiency anyway, which will also suffice).

Outside of those two, who haven’t really played yet, there’s Dwight and McGee — two serviceable bigs that can protect the rim, rebound and rim-run — and Danny Green who’s been phenomenal on both ends thus far.

That’s five guys surrounding AD and Lebron who can contribute in multiple areas. Then there’s some shooters whose shots haven’t been falling yet — Cook, Bradley, KCP, Daniels. How much more of a supporting cast do you need ? When healthy, this team has all the pieces to get it done.

[Black Mage]

Oooooo, 4-1 on a creampuff schedule so far, soooo impressive. The only two teams they faced that are expected to be in the playoffs were Clippers (who spanked the Lakers hard) and Utah who is off to a rough start b/c Conley caught a case of Fultzitis.

Let's see what their record is come 11/10 after facing Spurs/Heat/Raptors in 3 of 4.