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GameOver25 wrote:You take Artest off Lakers they're still at least 10th-15th best defensive team in the league. You take Howard off the Magic, we plummet to like 20th or higher. That's how much he means to this team. And it's because of his help D. Gortat can defend in spurts, but not anchor a defense for a full season. Get real.
jzmagik wrote:Phil X wrote:Ha, you either are trying to stir the pot or are not informed much about my 'agenda'. btw, I didnt bring up LBJ. Boobie did.
Boobie said in a later post that Lebron or Wade could have a run at it on eyear if they didn't slack for the first 42 minutes. Juding by your initial response, you didn't even see his post so you're still bringing Lebron into the discussion to advance your agenda.
Theres no reason to turn this into a pissing contest between the Lakers vs Lebron. Props to Boobie for not taking the bait..
— Mags
LakersSquad wrote:Pau has been terrible on defense this year don't make them into all defensive team bigs all of sudden. Yes their tall but so is dirk, shaq, Big Z, KG & wallace etc... Height doesn't = defense. Like I said before we're dead last in 3pt fg% since rons arrived. We're the best defensive team this year because of Ron.
InBoobieWeTrust wrote:Phil X wrote:InBoobieWeTrust wrote:
In my opinion, it's a sham if he gets selected over Gerald Wallace for the first team and questionable at best if he gets in over Shane Battier for the 2nd team. I think Gerald Wallace is an outstanding defender who can do a multitude of things whereas Artest can bust screens AND(Obviously you failed to read my entire post, I said he's good at being a strong physical defender on the guys who can't blow by him as well, it just so happens that his lateral speed has declined to a point where that only applies to certain players, good players, but I feel Wallace can guard a wider variety of players more effectively than Artest).
Well, I hate to use a small sample size of games as an example. But if you look at the last few games. Ron has kept younger and faster players under their season avg.
Gay
Iggy
Melo
Granger
He did that by using his strength and speed. All of these guys for all intent and purpose are not guys I would consider in the "Can't blow by" category.
Not only does he bust screens he stays up in front of the player and stays with him as they attempt to create. Forcing the player to turn the ball over,pass out /steal etc.. These type of defensive plays are what defense is about IMO.
Well, Granger, Gay, and Melo are the guys Ron Artest can still guard. They aren't lightning quick or overly explosive on their first step. Artest can guard those guys. He was brought in to guard those guys.
Ehh, actually, Gay is pretty explosive. Artest gets some serious credit for that one, but like I said, I still think Battier should get the edge because he's shown he can consistently guard multiple types of players. In-fact, if the Lakers had Battier instead of Artest right now, I'd be much more frightened of them.
Iguodala is more explosive than all of them and theoretically, but the Lakers pack the paint so effectively just as a rule of their defensive scheme that it's hard to tell whether it's Artest who's having the main impact on Iguodala rather than multiple 7 footers at the rim.
— Mags InBoobieWeTrust wrote:
Iguodala is more explosive than all of them and theoretically, but the Lakers pack the paint so effectively just as a rule of their defensive scheme that it's hard to tell whether it's Artest who's having the main impact on Iguodala rather than multiple 7 footers at the rim.
bicatmit wrote:LakersSquad wrote:Pau has been terrible on defense this year don't make them into all defensive team bigs all of sudden. Yes their tall but so is dirk, shaq, Big Z, KG & wallace etc... Height doesn't = defense. Like I said before we're dead last in 3pt fg% since rons arrived. We're the best defensive team this year because of Ron.
Basically what I'm saying though is that Dwight's impact on defense is head and shoulders above Ron's impact. Agree or disagree?
LakersSquad wrote:InBoobieWeTrust wrote:
Iguodala is more explosive than all of them and theoretically, but the Lakers pack the paint so effectively just as a rule of their defensive scheme that it's hard to tell whether it's Artest who's having the main impact on Iguodala rather than multiple 7 footers at the rim.
You mean the same 7 footers that couldn't stop him from dropping 25 and the game winner on us last year with a good defender in Ariza on him? The same bigs that couldn't stop him from getting 19pts on 56%? You should try to watch games instead of making claims like Shane has been better than Artest.
mysticbb wrote:GatorKid117 wrote:I guess it's all prefrence. But that model currently has Jameer Nelson as a better defender than Dwight, Gerald Wallace the worst defender on his team and Mo Pete as pretty much the best defender in the league. I think the normal APM is a much better indicator. Players are actually located where I would expect them to be.
Maybe you clicked on the wrong link, but Wallace has a -1.7 and is way better than Jackson with +2.0 on the Bobcats. You should also figure in the error. The difference between Nelson and Howard is 1, while the error is +/- 2.4. The difference is too small as if I would say Nelson is the better defender.
Anyway, you may be right about the preferences. I prefer stats which are independent from each other to get two seperate looks at a player via stats. If both things are in agreement with my visual oberservation I'm pretty confident that I judge the player correctly. Well, it becomes interesting, if something is not in line.
InBoobieWeTrust wrote:LakersSquad wrote:InBoobieWeTrust wrote:
Iguodala is more explosive than all of them and theoretically, but the Lakers pack the paint so effectively just as a rule of their defensive scheme that it's hard to tell whether it's Artest who's having the main impact on Iguodala rather than multiple 7 footers at the rim.
You mean the same 7 footers that couldn't stop him from dropping 25 and the game winner on us last year with a good defender in Ariza on him? The same bigs that couldn't stop him from getting 19pts on 56%? You should try to watch games instead of making claims like Shane has been better than Artest.
I mean, you can bring up all the "oh look at this one game right here versus this one game right here" evidence/anecdotal evidence that you want, but from what I have seen from Battier, Wallace, and Artest over the entire season so far(I've seen each play about 12 times....Artest maybe more), I've seen better defensive play from Battier and Wallace.
Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
bjax24 wrote:Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
No. He isn't. Take the homer glasses off. He isn't playing worse either. I just think its funny the change of mind in one year. I still love the guy. But where was the campaigning the last few years.
Phil X wrote:wreck wrote:
This thread just continues to prove how Lamar Odom continues to be underrated by people that watch LA games.
So you are implying that I underrate Lamar Odom? Please.
Jimmy76 wrote:bjax24 wrote:Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
No. He isn't. Take the homer glasses off. He isn't playing worse either. I just think its funny the change of mind in one year. I still love the guy. But where was the campaigning the last few years.
I think he amped up the defense this year
he doesnt have as big a role on offense and he's been talking a lot about bringing the defense since joining the lakers
bjax24 wrote:Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
No. He isn't. Take the homer glasses off. He isn't playing worse either. I just think its funny the change of mind in one year. I still love the guy. But where was the campaigning the last few years.
— MagsJimmy76 wrote:bjax24 wrote:Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
No. He isn't. Take the homer glasses off. He isn't playing worse either. I just think its funny the change of mind in one year. I still love the guy. But where was the campaigning the last few years.
I think he amped up the defense this year
he doesnt have as big a role on offense and he's been talking a lot about bringing the defense since joining the lakers
wreck wrote:Phil X wrote:wreck wrote:
This thread just continues to prove how Lamar Odom continues to be underrated by people that watch LA games.
So you are implying that I underrate Lamar Odom? Please.
Unless your ego has gotten so big it consists of 'people' now
But seriously, don't you agree? Just take a look at the thread. Lamar has been the best defender on the team for a while but doesn't get any respect.
you replied to my postwreck wrote:Phil X wrote:wreck wrote:
This thread just continues to prove how Lamar Odom continues to be underrated by people that watch LA games.
So you are implying that I underrate Lamar Odom? Please.
Unless your ego has gotten so big it consists of 'people' now
But seriously, don't you agree? Just take a look at the thread. Lamar has been the best defender on the team for a while but doesn't get any respect.
— MagsPhil X wrote:bjax24 wrote:Phil X wrote:I think it has alot more to do with Houston and Sacramento fans bitter that he is playing better defense for a hated team like the Lakers.
No. He isn't. Take the homer glasses off. He isn't playing worse either. I just think its funny the change of mind in one year. I still love the guy. But where was the campaigning the last few years.
ah... so it's the ole Homer Glasses schtick and what I am campaigning? I didnt agree with him being DPOY this year but he certainly has stepped up his game defensively from the Ron i have seen in recent years.
It has ZERO to do with you " still liking the guy" and ZERO to do with " Last year" and everything to do with this year and how he is playing right now.
Or is it a coincidence that the Lakers defense is number one and their entire defensive identity has changed? It is a coincidence that Ron doesn't have to be the #1 one / 2 option on a team like he has in both SAC/HOU and his entire approach the the game is different then it has been in years past.
Live.life. fluidly... not in a vaccum. Make this is about the player and not about the team/fans.
