Semi-OT: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread

dhsilv2 · Post #881 » by **dhsilv2** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:03 pm

BadMofoPimp wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
DowJones wrote:This isn't a Trump issue when it comes to America's response. Everyone was caught with their pants down. Heck, Fauci himself said he wasn't overly concerned towards the end of February. Part of that can be blamed on the lack of transparency coming out of Wuhan.

It was WELL known that this was a major deal and coming honestly by min jan, but certainly by the end of it. Worse is that it had been brought up that this kind of thing was more likely that not and that the US wasn't ready. It's not political to be critical of government's when they aren't ready for disasters, especially ones they absolutely should have been aware of, not months but years prior. There's no excuse for the US to have not restrocked masks from the last event that happened under the prior administration. This isn't some budget destroying expense. Everyone makes mistakes, and everyone should get criticized at some point, that's just part of life and being in leadership. This was a big screw up and it seems the US is still playing catch up.

I remember mid to late January up into February very well. Nobody was thinking the Virus was a big deal including the Who. Mainly because, the Chinese Government was declaring it was no big deal and they had it under control. But now, mass media will make it like we knew all along that a disaster was coming, but I remember well, the news wasn't saying jack back the nor a single world leader of any impending worldwide disaster.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/08-04-2020-who-timeline---covid-19

By mid January the WHO had made it clear that this could be a much wider outbreak. By the end of January they had a consensus that this was serous. Hell by the end of January we were talking about stocking up toilet paper....i thought that was a bit crazy but it seems I was wrong there, lol.

So not sure what you were reading or seeing, but the general public certainly knew this was at the VERY least concerning and if the federal government wasn't WELL into researching how prepared they were for this, well that's absolutely a massive failing of leadership. Leadership should be acting BEFORE a crisis, especially on the supply chain and defense side.

Pointgod · Post #882 » by **Pointgod** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:28 pm

dhsilv2 wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
It was WELL known that this was a major deal and coming honestly by min jan, but certainly by the end of it. Worse is that it had been brought up that this kind of thing was more likely that not and that the US wasn't ready. It's not political to be critical of government's when they aren't ready for disasters, especially ones they absolutely should have been aware of, not months but years prior. There's no excuse for the US to have not restrocked masks from the last event that happened under the prior administration. This isn't some budget destroying expense. Everyone makes mistakes, and everyone should get criticized at some point, that's just part of life and being in leadership. This was a big screw up and it seems the US is still playing catch up.

I remember mid to late January up into February very well. Nobody was thinking the Virus was a big deal including the Who. Mainly because, the Chinese Government was declaring it was no big deal and they had it under control. But now, mass media will make it like we knew all along that a disaster was coming, but I remember well, the news wasn't saying jack back the nor a single world leader of any impending worldwide disaster.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/08-04-2020-who-timeline---covid-19

By mid January the WHO had made it clear that this could be a much wider outbreak. By the end of January they had a consensus that this was serous. Hell by the end of January we were talking about stocking up toilet paper....i thought that was a bit crazy but it seems I was wrong there, lol.

So not sure what you were reading or seeing, but the general public certainly knew this was at the VERY least concerning and if the federal government wasn't WELL into researching how prepared they were for this, well that's absolutely a massive failing of leadership. Leadership should be acting BEFORE a crisis, especially on the supply chain and defense side.

Jan. 5

The WHO reported a "pneumonia of unknown cause" in Wuhan, China.

The health organization advised against restrictions to China: "WHO advises against the application of any travel or trade restrictions on China based on the current information available on this event."

Jan. 9

The WHO released a statement announcing the source of the disease: "Chinese authorities have made a preliminary determination of a novel (or new) coronavirus, identified in a hospitalized person with pneumonia in Wuhan."

It added: "In the coming weeks, more comprehensive information is required to understand the current status and epidemiology of the outbreak, and the clinical picture."

Jan. 14

WHO officials gave conflicting signals about whether there is human-to-human transmission. At a press conference in Geneva, Maria Van Kerkhove of WHO's emerging diseases unit told a Reuters reporter: "From the information that we have it is possible that there is limited human-to-human transmission, potentially among families, but it is very clear right now that we have no sustained human-to-human transmission." However, that same day WHO tweeted a different take, stating that "Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in #Wuhan, #China" and also told an NPR reporter that Van Kerkhove had been misunderstood and there was in fact no evidence of human-to-human transmission.

Jan. 22

Asked by CNBC whether there were any concerns about the virus spreading to the U.S., Trump responded: "We have it totally under control. It's one person coming in from China, and we have it under control. It's going to be just fine."

Jan. 23

WHO Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said in a statement that it was too early to declare the coronavirus outbreak a public health emergency of international concern. "Make no mistake. This is an emergency in China, but it has not yet become a global health emergency. It may yet become one."

Jan. 24

In a tweet, Trump praised China for its efforts to prevent the spread of the virus. "China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!"

Jan. 29

Dr. Mike Ryan, head of the WHO's Health Emergencies Programme, said, "The whole world needs to be on alert now. The whole world needs to take action and be ready for any cases that come from the epicenter or other epicenter that becomes established."

Jan. 30

At a campaign rally in Iowa,

In a tweet, Trump praised China for its efforts to prevent the spread of the virus. "China has been working very hard to contain the Coronavirus. The United States greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. In particular, on behalf of the American People, I want to thank President Xi!"

Feb. 2

In an interview with Sean Hannity, Trump said, "We pretty much shut it down coming in from China." His executive order banning anyone who has been in China in the previous 14 days — with exceptions, including for U.S. citizens, lawful permanent residents and their close family members — went into effect.

Feb. 4

At a WHO briefing, Tedros urged that there be no travel bans. "We reiterate our call to all countries not to impose restrictions that unnecessarily interfere with international travel and trade. Such restrictions can have the effect of increasing fear and stigma, with little public health benefit. ... Where such measures have been implemented, we urge that they are short in duration, proportionate to the public health risks and are reconsidered regularly as the situation evolves."

Feb. 10

At a campaign rally in Manchester, N.H., Trump said: "Looks like by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away. I hope that's true. But we're doing great in our country. China, I spoke with President Xi, and they're working very, very hard. And I think it's going to all work out fine."

Feb. 11

At a WHO briefing, Tedros urged world leaders to give priority to containing the virus: "To be honest, a virus is more powerful in creating political, economic and social upheaval than any terrorist attack. A virus can have more powerful consequences than any terrorist action, and that's true. If the world doesn't want to wake up and consider this enemy virus as Public Enemy Number 1, I don't think we will learn our lessons."

Feb. 13

In an interview with Geraldo Rivera, Trump characterized the threat of the virus in the U.S. by saying: "In our country, we only have, basically, 12 cases, and most of those people are recovering and some cases fully recovered. So it's actually less."

Feb. 24

In a tweet, Trump wrote, "The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!"

Feb. 26

In a news conference, Trump said: "When you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that's a pretty good job we've done."

Feb. 28

The WHO raises the global risk of the coronavirus from "high" to "very high."

March 5

In a WHO briefing, Tedros praised China and the U.S. for taking "the right approach." He said: "After our visit to Beijing and seeing China's approach, and President Xi leading that, and also in the U.S., President Trump himself, and also for regular coordination, designating the vice president. These are the approaches we're saying are the right ones, and these are the approaches we're saying are going to mobilize the whole government."

In a Fox News town hall, Trump said, "It's going to all work out. Everybody has to be calm. It's all going to work out."

March 10

In a meeting with Republican senators at the U.S. Capitol, Trump said, "This was unexpected. ... And it hit the world. And we're prepared, and we're doing a great job with it. And it will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away."

March 11

Trump said in an Oval Office address: "The vast majority of Americans, the risk is very, very low."

Tedros said the WHO had "made the assessment that COVID-19 can be characterized as a pandemic."

March 16

"You cannot fight a fire blindfolded. And we cannot stop this pandemic if we don't know who is infected," Tedros said at a briefing in Geneva. He added, "We have a simple message for all countries: test, test, test. Test every suspected case."

At a press briefing, Trump issued orders to control the spread of the virus in the U.S.: "My administration is recommending that all Americans, including the young and healthy, work to engage in schooling from home when possible. Avoid gathering in groups of more than 10 people. Avoid discretionary travel. And avoid eating and drinking at bars, restaurants and public food courts. If everyone makes this change or these critical changes and sacrifices now, we will rally together as one nation and we will defeat the virus. And we're going to have a big celebration all together. With several weeks of focused action, we can turn the corner and turn it quickly."

March 17

Trump told reporters: "This is a pandemic. ... I felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic."

Bolded are Trump lies/statements. There’s really no defending him.

Post #883 » by **zimpy27** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:37 pm

Please keep this thread about the global pandemic out of the American political gutter. There are plenty of threads in the Current Affairs section of the forum dedicated to these discussions, in fact half the threads in there are about Trump alone.

wade44 · Post #884 » by **wade44** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:40 pm

zimpy27 wrote:Please keep this thread about the global pandemic out of the American political gutter. There are plenty of threads in the Current Affairs section of the forum dedicated to these discussions, in fact half the threads in there are about Trump alone.

It's likely the same posters parroting their anti-Trump agenda. Probably time to start handing out warnings

Post #885 » by **boomershadow** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:47 pm

Never mind.

Pointgod · Post #886 » by **Pointgod** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:48 pm

zimpy27 wrote:Please keep this thread about the global pandemic out of the American political gutter. There are plenty of threads in the Current Affairs section of the forum dedicated to these discussions, in fact half the threads in there are about Trump alone.

Are you deleting the posts claiming that this wasn’t a Trump issue too? And can we post about what leadership needs to do as long as we don’t mention Trump by name? Many posters have spoken about the response of the Governors for example.

DowJones · Post #887 » by **DowJones** » Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:53 pm

dhsilv2 wrote:
DowJones wrote:This isn't a Trump issue when it comes to America's response. Everyone was caught with their pants down. Heck, Fauci himself said he wasn't overly concerned towards the end of February. Part of that can be blamed on the lack of transparency coming out of Wuhan.

It was WELL known that this was a major deal and coming honestly by min jan, but certainly by the end of it. Worse is that it had been brought up that this kind of thing was more likely that not and that the US wasn't ready. It's not political to be critical of government's when they aren't ready for disasters, especially ones they absolutely should have been aware of, not months but years prior. There's no excuse for the US to have not restrocked masks from the last event that happened under the prior administration. This isn't some budget destroying expense. Everyone makes mistakes, and everyone should get criticized at some point, that's just part of life and being in leadership. This was a big screw up and it seems the US is still playing catch up.

Fauci didn't know it was coming. Towards the end of February he said he wasn't overly concerned. How can I rip Trump and his response when Fauci himself wasn't ringing alarm bells?

mtron929 · Post #888 » by **mtron929** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:16 am

DowJones wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
DowJones wrote:This isn't a Trump issue when it comes to America's response. Everyone was caught with their pants down. Heck, Fauci himself said he wasn't overly concerned towards the end of February. Part of that can be blamed on the lack of transparency coming out of Wuhan.

It was WELL known that this was a major deal and coming honestly by min jan, but certainly by the end of it. Worse is that it had been brought up that this kind of thing was more likely that not and that the US wasn't ready. It's not political to be critical of government's when they aren't ready for disasters, especially ones they absolutely should have been aware of, not months but years prior. There's no excuse for the US to have not restrocked masks from the last event that happened under the prior administration. This isn't some budget destroying expense. Everyone makes mistakes, and everyone should get criticized at some point, that's just part of life and being in leadership. This was a big screw up and it seems the US is still playing catch up.

Fauci didn't know it was coming. Towards the end of February he said he wasn't overly concerned. How can I rip Trump and his response when Fauci himself wasn't ringing alarm bells?

I think we had discussion yesterday on when to open up the economy and I have suggested that observing the data and intepreting the trend will just provide us with the answers. So it seems like the number of daily deaths has increased again (4/21 - 2776 deaths) and I suppose we can at least agree that the economy cannot be open (at least not completely) until a downward trend is established, right?

mtron929 · Post #889 » by **mtron929** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:21 am

With regards to Trump, I would suspect that in an alternate history where Trump warned about the dangers of the coronavirus and the importance of social distancing from early on (see South Korea's president), then the country would have been united. The conservatives would have been on board with the message of the president and I believe that the liberals (at least a large majority of them) would not have turned this into a partisan issue. In that alternate universe, the US would have been in a much better position in present time as everyone would have been more cognizant and careful about social distancing from the beginning when it truly mattered.

nymets1 · Post #890 » by **nymets1** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 1:04 am

Last night's numbers as of 9pm from bing.com/covid

USA- 795,898 confirmed cases(+29,718 increase), Recoveries- 72,715(+2003 increase), Deaths- 42,560(+1969 increase)

New York- 247,512 confirmed cases(+4726 increase)
New jersey- 88,806 confirmed cases(+3505 increase)
Mass- 39,643 confirmed cases(+1566 increase)
California- 33,404 confirmed cases(+4441 increase)
Penn- 33,232 confirmed cases(+948 increase)
Michigan- 32,000 confirmed cases(+1209 increase)
Illinois- 31,508 confirmed cases(+2348 increase)
Florida- 27,058 confirmed cases(+744 increase)
Louisana- 24,523 confirmed cases(+595 increase)
Connecticut- 19,815 confirmed cases(+1853 increase)
Texas- 19,458 confirmed cases(+535 increase)
Georgia- 19,399 confirmed cases(+1008 increase)
Maryland- 13,684 confirmed cases(+1230 increase)
Ohio- 12,919 confirmed cases(+2697 increase)
Washington- 11,934 confirmed cases(+132 increase)
Indiana- 11,686 confirmed cases(+1045 increase)
Colorado- 10,106 confirmed cases(+376 increase)
Virginia- 8990 confirmed cases(+2101 increase)

Spain- 200,210 confirmed cases, Recoveries- 80,587(+3230 increase)
Italy- 182,228 confirmed cases(+434 increase)
Germany- 147,139 confirmed cases(+2733 increase), Recoveries- 87,500
United Kingdom- 124,743 confirmed cases(+4676 increase)

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

USA- 792,759 confirmed cases, Recoveries- 72,389, Deaths- 42,514

New York-252,094 confirmed cases(+4879 increase)
New Jersey- 88,806 confirmed cases(+3505 increase)
Mass- 39,643 confirmed cases(+1566 increase)
Penn- 39,914 confirmed cases(+1180 increase)
California- 33,686 confirmed cases(+2256 increase)
Michigan- 32,000 confirmed cases(+576 increase)
Illinois- 31,508 confirmed cases(+1151 increase)
Florida- 27,058 confirmed cases(+744 increase)
Louisana- 24,523 confirmed cases(+595 increase)
Texas- 19,822 confirmed cases(+505 increase)
Connecticut- 19,815 confirmed cases(+1853 increase)
Georgia- 19,399 confirmed cases(+1242 increase)
Maryland- 13,284 confirmed cases(+854 increase)
Ohio- 12,919 confirmed cases(+1317 increase)
Washington- 12,085 confirmed cases(+295 increase)
Indiana- 11,686 confirmed cases(+476 increase)
Colorado- 10,106 confirmed cases(+376 increase)

1. New Jersey is less than 12,000 new cases away from potentially reaching 100,000 confirmed cases
2. Connecticut has just passed Texas in total confimed cases according to worldometers and Texas is the 2nd largest US state but Texas is the worst or 2nd to worst US state in testing.
3. Louisana is now 10 straight days of low increase in new confirmed cases each day
4. Washington has had a small increase in new confirmed cases over 2 full weeks now, Now just have to watch their active cases left which is 9651
5. Texas now 9 straight days of low increase in new confirmed cases each day
6. Michigan, Florida and Georgia are among the top 11 states with the most confirmed cases and Michigan and Florida now have 3 straight days of keeping their new confirmed cases under 1000 for the day. While Georgia had over 1000 new cases today
7. Ohio had a big jump today in new confirmed cases over 1000, different numbers from bing and worldometers as of 9pm eastern time. 2 straight days of increase in over 1000 cases each day.
8. New York is slowly bringing down their increase in new cases each day, They were increasing 7000 to almost 20,000 new cases each day but today they increased around +4800. Once New York gets a day that they only increase around 1000 per day or just under 1000 per day, Than New York would be under control.

Today's numbers as of 9pm from bing.com/covid

USA- 824,069 confirmed cases(+25,507 increase), Recoveries- 75,050(+2875 increase), Deaths- 45,142(+2582 increase)
New York- 251,690 confirmed cases(+4178 increase)
New Jersey- 92,387 confirmed cases(+4250 increase)
Mass- 41,199 confirmed cases(+3122 increase)
Penn- 34,528 confirmed cases(+2244 increase)
California-33,897 confirmed cases(+2367 increase)
Illinois- 33,059 confirmed cases(+1551 increase)
Michigan- 32,967 confirmed cases(+967 increase)
Florida- 27,869 confirmed cases(+811 increase)
Louisana- 24,854 confirmed cases(+311 increase)
Connecticut- 20,360 confirmed cases(+2398 increase)
Texas- 20,196 confirmed cases(+738 increase)
Georgia- 20,166 confirmed cases(+767 increase)
Maryland- 14,193 confirmed cases(+496 increase)
Ohio- 13,725 confirmed cases(+806 increase)
Washington- 12,282 confirmed cases(+348 increase)
Indiana- 12,097 confirmed cases(+887 increase)

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

USA- 819,805 confirmed cases, Recoveries- 82,923, Deaths- 45,316
New York- 256,555 confirmed cases(+4461 increase)
New Jersey- 92,387 confirmed cases(+3581 increase)
Mass- 41,199 confirmed cases(+1556 increase)
California- 36,704 confirmed cases(+3018 increase)
Penn- 35,293 confirmed cases(+1379 increase)
Illinois- 35,059 confirmed cases(+1551 increase)
Michigan- 32,967 confirmed cases(+967 increase)
Florida- 27,869 confirmed cases(+811 increase)
Louisana- 24,854 confirmed cases(+331 increase)
Texas- 20,596 confirmed cases(+774 increase)
Connecticut- 20,396 confirmed cases(+545 increase)
Georgia- 20,166 confirmed cases(+767 increase)
Maryland- 14,193 confirmed cases(+509 increase)
Ohio- 13,725 confirmed cases(+806 increase)
Washington- 12,282 confirmed cases(+197 increase)
Indiana- 12,097 confirmed cases(+411 increase)

1. New Jersey is less than 10,000 new cases away from potentially reaching 100,000 confirmed cases
2. Louisana is now 11 straight days of low increase in new confirmed cases each day
4. Washington has had a small increase in new confirmed cases over 2 full weeks now, Now just have to watch their active cases left which is 9818
5. Texas now 10 straight days of low increase in new confirmed cases each day
6. Michigan, Florida and Georgia are among the top 11 states with the most confirmed cases and Michigan and Florida now have 4 straight days of keeping their new confirmed cases under 1000 for the day. While Georgia also kept it under 1000 new cases today
7. Ohio had an increase of 806 new cases today after back to back days over 1000+ new cases on Sunday/Monday
8. New York is slowly bringing down their increase in new cases each day, They were increasing 7000 to almost 20,000 new cases each day but today they increased around between +4100 to 4400 after coming down from +4800 yesterday. Once New York gets a day that they only increase around 1000 per day or just under 1000 per day, Than New York would be under control.
9. Bing and worldometers have different numbers as of right now for USA total confirmed cases, USA recoveries and the number of confirmed cases for New York, Penn and California

michaelm · Post #891 » by **michaelm** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 1:19 am

mtron929 wrote:With regards to Trump, I would suspect that in an alternate history where Trump warned about the dangers of the coronavirus and the importance of social distancing from early on (see South Korea's president), then the country would have been united. The conservatives would have been on board with the message of the president and I believe that the liberals (at least a large majority of them) would not have turned this into a partisan issue. In that alternate universe, the US would have been in a much better position in present time as everyone would have been more cognizant and careful about social distancing from the beginning when it truly mattered.

This is pretty much what has happened in Australia. I was not at an admirer of the Australian PM, but he has done his best to act on the economic side of things, and taken advice on the medical side. Some consider his hand to have been forced to a degree by the leaders of the states, but even though the political hues of those leaders differ a reasonably cohesive national response has occurred, with even a form of national cabinet involving the state and federal leaders being constituted. It is of course considerably easier for Australia to shut its borders as he did, and some of the states have also done this.

As someone has already said the China blame game is unproductive, and focusing on China will not aid the current response to the pandemic at all. Even if you believe they lacked transparency early they certainly didn’t tell anyone not to worry about Italy afaik. Shutting down travel from China as both Trump and the Australian PM did was entirely appropriate, the error imo was an apparent blind spot perhaps partly due to politics that this would be sufficient to deal with a ‘Chinese’ virus. Here in Australia the PM in the face of criticism put travellers from China and Australians repatriated from the Diamond Princess in Yokohama harbour into actual quarantine on an island, which was absolutely sensible but didn’t stop travellers from Europe and the US bringing the Coronavirus with them.

Liminy · Post #892 » by **Liminy** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:03 am

I'm not sure what is wrong with posting about how the virus might have come from the lab. I think that is pretty legitimate question at this point and frankly their are still so many things that we don't know about how it started and what really happened in Wuhan. Here is one source that I think is worthwhile to look into.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/documentary-tracking-down-the-origin-of-wuhan-coronavirus_3313091.html

Liminy · Post #893 » by **Liminy** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:06 am

michaelm wrote:
mtron929 wrote:With regards to Trump, I would suspect that in an alternate history where Trump warned about the dangers of the coronavirus and the importance of social distancing from early on (see South Korea's president), then the country would have been united. The conservatives would have been on board with the message of the president and I believe that the liberals (at least a large majority of them) would not have turned this into a partisan issue. In that alternate universe, the US would have been in a much better position in present time as everyone would have been more cognizant and careful about social distancing from the beginning when it truly mattered.

This is pretty much what has happened in Australia. I was not at an admirer of the Australian PM, but he has done his best to act on the economic side of things, and taken advice on the medical side. Some consider his hand to have been forced to a degree by the leaders of the states, but even though the political hues of those leaders differ a reasonably cohesive national response has occurred, with even a form of national cabinet involving the state and federal leaders being constituted. It is of course considerably easier for Australia to shut its borders as he did, and some of the states have also done this.

As someone has already said the China blame game is unproductive, and focusing on China will not aid the current response to the pandemic at all. Even if you believe they lacked transparency early they certainly didn’t tell anyone not to worry about Italy afaik. Shutting down travel from China as both Trump and the Australian PM did was entirely appropriate, the error imo was an apparent blind spot perhaps partly due to politics that this would be sufficient to deal with a ‘Chinese’ virus. Here in Australia the PM in the face of criticism put travellers from China and Australians repatriated from the Diamond Princess in Yokohama harbour into actual quarantine on an island, which was absolutely sensible but didn’t stop travellers from Europe and the US bringing the Coronavirus here.

I think the China questions are still relevant because they are still refusing to release relevant information that coulld still be useful for the world to understand, like, what actually happens when you lift restrictions? What do they know about treatments, where did the virus actually come from?

Pointgod · Post #894 » by **Pointgod** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:13 am

Liminy wrote:I'm not sure what is wrong with posting about how the virus might have come from the lab. I think that is pretty legitimate question at this point and frankly their are still so many things that we don't know about how it started and what really happened in Wuhan. Here is one source that I think is worthwhile to look into.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/documentary-tracking-down-the-origin-of-wuhan-coronavirus_3313091.html

Epoch times is not a legitimate news source.

michaelm · Post #895 » by **michaelm** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:21 am

Double

michaelm · Post #896 » by **michaelm** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:22 am

Liminy wrote:I'm not sure what is wrong with posting about how the virus might have come from the lab. I think that is pretty legitimate question at this point and frankly their are still so many things that we don't know about how it started and what really happened in Wuhan. Here is one source that I think is worthwhile to look into.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/documentary-tracking-down-the-origin-of-wuhan-coronavirus_3313091.html

I can’t read that article but will take the evidence of scientific studies published in scientific journals such as Virology by scientists who have studied/sequenced the virus and concluded that it is a virus of natural origin. If accidentally released from a lab which was experimenting with bats or bat viruses which is not impossible but well down the list of the probable imo and according to most, then it is a matter of record that the CDC summarily shut down a US virology lab in August-September 2019 for safety reasons which can prompt and has prompted an alternative conspiracy theory.

spacemonkey · Post #897 » by **spacemonkey** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:39 am

Liminy wrote:I'm not sure what is wrong with posting about how the virus might have come from the lab. I think that is pretty legitimate question at this point and frankly their are still so many things that we don't know about how it started and what really happened in Wuhan. Here is one source that I think is worthwhile to look into.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/documentary-tracking-down-the-origin-of-wuhan-coronavirus_3313091.html

You should probably understand the epoch times before using them as a source. Just do some prelim research and you'll see why they can't be used as an accurate source for just about anything, if accuracy is your main concern.

You may align politically with them (many do given how staunchly anti-ccp they are) but they're not a reliable source for any kind of real information.

LordCovington33 · Post #898 » by **LordCovington33** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 4:18 am

michaelm wrote:
Liminy wrote:I'm not sure what is wrong with posting about how the virus might have come from the lab. I think that is pretty legitimate question at this point and frankly their are still so many things that we don't know about how it started and what really happened in Wuhan. Here is one source that I think is worthwhile to look into.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/documentary-tracking-down-the-origin-of-wuhan-coronavirus_3313091.html

I can’t read that article but will take the evidence of scientific studies published in scientific journals such as Virology by scientists who have studied/sequenced the virus and concluded that it is a virus of natural origin. If accidentally released from a lab which was experimenting with bats or bat viruses which is not impossible but well down the list of the probable imo and according to most, then it is a matter of record that the CDC summarily shut down a US virology lab in August-September 2019 for safety reasons which can prompt and has prompted an alternative conspiracy theory.

Numerous scientific studies have shown the virus was of natural origin, so it surprises me that people still believe the garbage they read in Epoch Times and similar newspapers.

dhsilv2 · Post #899 » by **dhsilv2** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 6:37 am

DowJones wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
DowJones wrote:This isn't a Trump issue when it comes to America's response. Everyone was caught with their pants down. Heck, Fauci himself said he wasn't overly concerned towards the end of February. Part of that can be blamed on the lack of transparency coming out of Wuhan.

It was WELL known that this was a major deal and coming honestly by min jan, but certainly by the end of it. Worse is that it had been brought up that this kind of thing was more likely that not and that the US wasn't ready. It's not political to be critical of government's when they aren't ready for disasters, especially ones they absolutely should have been aware of, not months but years prior. There's no excuse for the US to have not restrocked masks from the last event that happened under the prior administration. This isn't some budget destroying expense. Everyone makes mistakes, and everyone should get criticized at some point, that's just part of life and being in leadership. This was a big screw up and it seems the US is still playing catch up.

Fauci didn't know it was coming. Towards the end of February he said he wasn't overly concerned. How can I rip Trump and his response when Fauci himself wasn't ringing alarm bells?

So lets assume that's true. I don't think that's the case, but lets take that. We have data showing that as far back as 2017 people were concerned about our preparation of such an event.

Now of course that's not true, he knew this was an issue just like everyone else talking to trump. Just like every medical official in the world.

Clay Davis · Post #900 » by **Clay Davis** » Wed Apr 22, 2020 6:45 am

Triples333 wrote:
bidde wrote:
NBAFan93 wrote:
Or that entire family quarantines. Still a lot better than every single family in the country having to do it when they don’t have a person like that in their household.

Oh cool, you might have a plan. So we are now saying quarantine the entire family. How many people do you think we would need to quarantine this way?

Around 95% less than are currently being quarantined.

Bear in mind that a massive chunk of the population that this effects to the greatest degree are retired and/or on social security. The provisions are in place to help them, and more would be taken.

If even 0.1% of the population needs ICU beds, that's enough to absolutely cripple the healthcare system. The economic impact of putting people back to work will be even worse, sorry to say, since the fatality rate will get even higher the more overburdened the healthcare system is.

This is the new normal.

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