Nikola Jokic wins MVP(again)

eyeatoma · Post #901 » by **eyeatoma** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:38 am

Shaquille O'Neal as well.

hippesthippo · Post #902 » by **hippesthippo** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:54 am

losmi wrote:
bearadonisdna wrote:it just dawned on me that embiid won the scoring title.
It seems premium seeding and the scoring designation is usually enough to clinch,
but its a dangerous precedent that people are overvaluing other things that matter less.

So we got embiid , scoring titile and his team 2 games from the top seed and then jokic is 16 games behind and didnt even win his own division.

The aesthetics of this is just bad but there has been a precedent of people overvaluing things while disparaging or discrediting more key components.
Its like 2 different planets and how guys like gobert, draymond green and evan mobley get massively overrated.

recently makes me think if i even enjoy the nba product anymore.
when my team wins but plays a bad style of ball, i dis enjoy it.
People act how could i dislike my team winning. An artful game has become ugly to its core.

4th seed is not premium.

Correlation between scoring title and MVP is weak.

The aesthetics of giving the MVP to someone whose entire game is based on flopping would be much worse.

What kills me more than this poor scoring title argument is the whole seeding thing. Jokic's team only lost 3 more games than Embiid and Giannis and he plays in the tougher conference, yet that somehow gets spun into Jokic being "16 games behind."

Wolfgang630 · Post #903 » by **Wolfgang630** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:55 am

And Shaq is regarded as a top 10 player with one MVP. Nash is nowhere near top 10 with his 2 MVP’s….

maxwellcu · Post #904 » by **maxwellcu** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:56 am

The tears in this thread are incredible. Truly incredible. Beyond my wildest hopes and dreams, even.

Richard Miller · Post #905 » by **Richard Miller** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:56 am

eyeatoma wrote:

Read on Twitter

Shaquille O'Neal as well.

Kobe was way ahead on that

Watch on YouTube

hippesthippo · Post #906 » by **hippesthippo** » Tue May 10, 2022 11:56 am

eyeatoma wrote:

Read on Twitter

Shaquille O'Neal as well.

Yup, that's the downside to having superstar teammates for the entirety of your career. You end up splitting MVP votes and someone else wins.

reload141 · Post #907 » by **reload141** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:00 pm

Nikola reading all the tears from this thread like:

So he doesn’t have Harden playing next to him, or a GSW team filled with HOF talent.

Dude dominated. Deserved it.

And all the posters here are feeding his Rakija tears.

Accept he’s the best. Move on.

Oh and btw…

He’s repeating this:

This is pure entertainment.

Wolfgang630 · Post #908 » by **Wolfgang630** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:04 pm

I guess it’s jokers fault Kobe and Shaq played together so they couldn’t win multiple MVP’s

losmi · Post #909 » by **losmi** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:07 pm

hippesthippo wrote:
losmi wrote:
bearadonisdna wrote:it just dawned on me that embiid won the scoring title.
It seems premium seeding and the scoring designation is usually enough to clinch,
but its a dangerous precedent that people are overvaluing other things that matter less.

So we got embiid , scoring titile and his team 2 games from the top seed and then jokic is 16 games behind and didnt even win his own division.

The aesthetics of this is just bad but there has been a precedent of people overvaluing things while disparaging or discrediting more key components.
Its like 2 different planets and how guys like gobert, draymond green and evan mobley get massively overrated.

recently makes me think if i even enjoy the nba product anymore.
when my team wins but plays a bad style of ball, i dis enjoy it.
People act how could i dislike my team winning. An artful game has become ugly to its core.

4th seed is not premium.

Correlation between scoring title and MVP is weak.

The aesthetics of giving the MVP to someone whose entire game is based on flopping would be much worse.

What kills me more than this poor scoring title argument is the whole seeding thing. Jokic's team only lost 3 more games than Embiid and Giannis and he plays in the tougher conference, yet that somehow gets spun into Jokic being "16 games behind."

It's hilarious when they bring up seeding, but they never say "Embiid is 4th seed".

premium seeding = 2 games behind 1st seed :lol:

dhsilv2 · Post #910 » by **dhsilv2** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:16 pm

eyeatoma wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
eyeatoma wrote:

Took me 2 minutes

What do you think all that actually told you?

That I'm right.

Again, what advanced stats did it cite and what was wrong with them? PER and BPM is box metrics, not real advanced stats. So again, which ones and why?

maxwellcu · Post #911 » by **maxwellcu** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:18 pm

eyeatoma wrote:

Read on Twitter

Shaquille O'Neal as well.

Against better judgment for even engaging with this, what exactly is the point being made here? That the single-season MVP should be awarded based on how many MVPs the player's career seems to "merit" in the eyes of the fans and voters? That's called a "lifetime achievement award" and we have one of those already. It's called the hall of fame. We even have a super special version of it called "first ballot".

There is actually some precedent for MVP being given out for this reason, I guess. For instance, at the time it was awarded, some commentators criticized Kobe's lone MVP as something of a lifetime achievement award. But sorry, Embiid ain't there yet.

Gusto1903 · Post #912 » by **Gusto1903** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:29 pm

I ask again.

Without mentioning or comparing Giannis and Jokic. What made Embiids Season "one of the best seasons of all time" and deserving the MVP Award? He has the Scoring Title. Thats it. Basically. What else?

duppyy · Post #913 » by **duppyy** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:46 pm

Feels like every year people cry about the mvp award and bring up playoffs when it’s a regular season award.

BelgradeNugget · Post #914 » by **BelgradeNugget** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:49 pm

Gusto1903 wrote:I ask again.

Without mentioning or comparing Giannis and Jokic. What made Embiids Season "one of the best seasons of all time" and deserving the MVP Award? He has the Scoring Title. Thats it. Basically. What else?

4th seed in the east. It happened only 75 times in the HISTORY of THE NBA that there was a team who was 4th in the east. Ha

BelgradeNugget · Post #915 » by **BelgradeNugget** » Tue May 10, 2022 12:55 pm

BelgradeNugget wrote:
Gusto1903 wrote:I ask again.

Without mentioning or comparing Giannis and Jokic. What made Embiids Season "one of the best seasons of all time" and deserving the MVP Award? He has the Scoring Title. Thats it. Basically. What else?

4th seed in the east. It happened only 75 times in the HISTORY of THE NBA that there was a team who was 4th in the east. Ha

Here you go - first center in the history of the NBA that plays for 76ers, wore a mask, and stopped Oladipo from driving to the hoop on perimeter for 10 secs. Want more?

duppyy · Post #916 » by **duppyy** » Tue May 10, 2022 1:17 pm

Gusto1903 wrote:I ask again.

Without mentioning or comparing Giannis and Jokic. What made Embiids Season "one of the best seasons of all time" and deserving the MVP Award? He has the Scoring Title. Thats it. Basically. What else?

Playing more games than sitting on the bench from injury in a season is a historical achievement for Embiid.

dhsilv2 · Post #917 » by **dhsilv2** » Tue May 10, 2022 1:22 pm

bearadonisdna wrote:it just dawned on me that embiid won the scoring title.
It seems premium seeding and the scoring designation is usually enough to clinch,
but its a dangerous precedent that people are overvaluing other things that matter less.

So we got embiid , scoring titile and his team 2 games from the top seed and then jokic is 16 games behind and didnt even win his own division.

The aesthetics of this is just bad but there has been a precedent of people overvaluing things while disparaging or discrediting more key components.
Its like 2 different planets and how guys like gobert, draymond green and evan mobley get massively overrated.

recently makes me think if i even enjoy the nba product anymore.
when my team wins but plays a bad style of ball, i dis enjoy it.
People act how could i dislike my team winning. An artful game has become ugly to its core.

Well if you want Art, watch Jokic play! He's the guy who won more games than the guys he was a finalist for MVP with.

nomansland · Post #918 » by **nomansland** » Tue May 10, 2022 1:34 pm

If Embiid had won it, I'd say "good for him," and not go through a bunch of mental gymnastics trying to explain why he wasn't worthy.

Actually gymnastics isn't even the right description. It's more like summersaults in a bouncy house.

All this thread does is make Embiid fans look like a bunch of sore losers.

Damienfan · Post #919 » by **Damienfan** » Tue May 10, 2022 1:42 pm

I see 90% euros stanning for their comrade.

Man up, stop being so defensive about your guy's defense.

Lunartic · Post #920 » by **Lunartic** » Tue May 10, 2022 1:42 pm

Jokic is the best player in the NBA and completely deserved MVP, he's pretty much in the same position Curry was in. Nuggets need to stop waiting for players to return from injury and start making moves to improve asap, don't waste MVP talent. No one knows if Murray will still be good when he returns and no one knows if MPJ will even return.