ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0

Moderators: Dirk, CoreyGallagher, magnumt, ken6199, Yuri Vaultin, BombsquadSammy, Tarik Black, Mr. E, bwgood77, Rhettmatic, Duke4life831, KF10, GimmeDat, Knickstape1214, DayofMourning, Capn'O

Series Prediction

Cavaliers in 4
80
22%
Cavaliers in 5
132
36%
Cavaliers in 6
76
21%
Cavaliers in 7
20
5%
Pacers in 4
8
2%
Pacers in 5
0
No votes
Pacers in 6
12
3%
Pacers in 7
36
10%
 
Total votes: 364

Warchant
Rookie
Posts: 1,128
And1: 380
Joined: Jul 01, 2016

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1901 » by Warchant » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:53 pm

OsuCavsfan103 wrote:
Birdie wrote:
Honestly, I don't think most anyone in the current NBA (yes, even LBJ) could do what Westbrook just did this season. Closet I could think of is Wall but I don't think Wall could rebound like a banshee the way Westbrook does. Westbrook's motor is just on another level and let's not forget, on a bum knee from a few years ago. Just crazy.

And as for your slight dig at Westbrook in not making his teammates better, I mean, I think that's a bit unfair, he did avg 10.4 ast per game, so you can't really say he's not involving his teammates to a degree. Being frank, I watched a few OKC games on League Pass this year and Russ most likely easily could've been around 12-15ast per game if he had guys not brick some great looks or had the shooters LBJ has. The fact OKC is a terrible 3pt shooting team and really doesn't have another creator outside of "maybe" Dipo, the fact he even got 10ast per game is remarkable in it's own instance.

At some point, you can't ding him for being "selfish" when in the end, he's the entire team because that's what Presti put around him unfortunately. And again, let's put this in perspective:

Russell: 81 games played; 2802 minutes played, 31.6PPG 10.7REB 10.4AST 10.2-24.0FGM/A 42.5FG% 34.3 3PT% 84.5FT%
LeBron: 74 games played; 2795 minutes played, 26.4PPG 8.6REB 8.7AST 9.9-18.2FGM/A 54.8FG% 36.3 3PT% 67.4FT%

CLE = 51 wins; OKC = 46 wins

And again, I'll mention, CLE had 2 other All-Stars on the team plus 9 guys who played, including LBJ, who shot 35% or higher (Korver highest at 48.5%) from 3, 5 of those guys shot > than 40%. Russ had 4 guys who shot better than 35% with Abrines topping out at 38.1% of the guys who played and actually jacked up shots. Dipo, McBuckets, Jerami Grant and Alex Abrines. Those 4 hardly instilling fear in the hearts of other teams.

I mean, if you're gonna look at those number and say, damn, Russ isn't the MVP, I don't know man, ya just gotta give props when it's due. Any other ho hum season, LBJ takes it easily but unfortunately, Russ just had a better season and to a degree, you could say Harden too. Some might say Kawhi too but I'm not quite sold on that one but he easily could finish 3rd with LBJ fatigue when it comes to voting.

I don't know why I'm going to these lengths to defend Westbrook as I could care less but you got me on one, lol. LBJ should've been unanimous MVP that one year where that idiot reporter gave his vote to Melo and possibly, LBJ/Kobe should've been MVP's those Nash years' but at this point, I think LBJ is more than happy taking Finals MVPs' and chips as opposed to a regular season accolade. That's all I'm sayin but I don't disagree with where you're coming from and why you feel the way you do. Perfectly understandable. I think as Cavs fans', we take LBJ for granted as well and when he's gone, we're gonna be right back into suckville where no one is gonna want to come play for us again and the universe will spin on...unless it all goes to hell with what's going on currently in this crazy world but I won't digress into that non-sport talk. In the end, LBJ just affirming his beast mode and we need 13 more wins worth of it so I can have another happy panda summer again. 8-)


Oh I think LeBron could average a triple double for a season if he really really wanted to.Especially back 5 years or so again when he was 27. He never had to though, he had a good enough team fortunately for him.

Russ did the same thing last playoffs. He shoots his team out of the games. Last year he and KD did it multiple times late in the last 3 games. So far Russ has done it twice already this series, especially last game.

In the game the other night in the first half OKC was rolling, Russ was getting other players involved. Then in half 2, especially in the 4th quarter he goes into chuckmode, he refuses to get his teammates involved anymore, he takes dumb shots without running the offense. LeBron scores in smart ways, he will shoot such high percentages. Russ Jack's 47 shots to get 50 points.

I appreciate what Russ has done, but to men LeBron is still the most valuable in the league. The only reason people aren't saying so is because they are used to his greatness. I mean heck look at yesterday, LeBron almost single-handidly brought us back down huge in the 2nd half, broke the playoff record for biggest comeback. He is once again proving that he was coasting during the regular season, and I can see why. He doesn't get the credit he deserves with that MVP trophy. They need to change the title from MVP instead to "Best regular season", I would be onboard on that. Westbrook to me is not the most valuable, and to me it comes down 100% to his selfish play. I mean it's the same guy who said "My only friend when playing ball is the ball". Like wtf? Does he not have teammates. This is the 2nd year in a row he has been in chuck mode in the NBA playoffs, and I am just not onboard with it.

And yes I would much rather have LeBron win another finals MVP and title... especially if it's against GS :)

Ironically when I was typing this Max Kellerman on ESPN was agreeing that LeBron is the MVP of the league in reality. We all know he won't get it bc people are too used to his greatness sadly, but he should.

Guess we'll just agree to disagree.

LB is not even close to being the MVP in the league....let him go to Brooklyn and make them a playoff team then he can b MVP...put him on OKC and if he put up the #s Westbrook did for a season name him MVP....he was hot one game when his team was down 25 pts and hit some 3s...he was also on the receiving end of losing a 25 pt lead vs Atl...oh he was coasting during the reg season and that was a reg season game...my bad....I wonder why he embarrassed Thompson during the regular season if he doesnt care or coasts? :dontknow:
OsuCavsfan103
Analyst
Posts: 3,725
And1: 3,495
Joined: Jul 06, 2014
Location: Ohio
       

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1902 » by OsuCavsfan103 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:09 pm

Warchant wrote:[
LB is not even close to being the MVP in the league....let him go to Brooklyn and make them a playoff team then he can b MVP...put him on OKC and if he put up the #s Westbrook did for a season name him MVP....he was hot one game when his team was down 25 pts and hit some 3s...he was also on the receiving end of losing a 25 pt lead vs Atl...oh he was coasting during the reg season and that was a reg season game...my bad....I wonder why he embarrassed Thompson during the regular season if he doesnt care or coasts? :dontknow:


He's already proved himself in his career as able to do that taking the Cavaliers to the finals in 07 with guys like Sasha Pavlovic, Ira Newble, Daniel Gibson etc etc. He doesn't have to prove that anymore. He carried a crappy CLE team for years before leaving.

Exactly, LeBron does not care about the regular season, it's clear. He even said so. That doesn't mean he doesn't expect better from his teammates, but LeBron himself has earned the right to take it easier during the regular season and let teammates carry more load.

I said the same thing last year, people questioned it, and then LeBron won a title and everyone was believers. You really going to doubt him again and how he turns it on in the playoffs? I hope for your sake that's just your trolling not your actual belief.
Cleeeeveland this is for you!
Warchant
Rookie
Posts: 1,128
And1: 380
Joined: Jul 01, 2016

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1903 » by Warchant » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:24 pm

OsuCavsfan103 wrote:
Warchant wrote:[
LB is not even close to being the MVP in the league....let him go to Brooklyn and make them a playoff team then he can b MVP...put him on OKC and if he put up the #s Westbrook did for a season name him MVP....he was hot one game when his team was down 25 pts and hit some 3s...he was also on the receiving end of losing a 25 pt lead vs Atl...oh he was coasting during the reg season and that was a reg season game...my bad....I wonder why he embarrassed Thompson during the regular season if he doesnt care or coasts? :dontknow:


He's already proved himself in his career as able to do that taking the Cavaliers to the finals in 07 with guys like Sasha Pavlovic, Ira Newble, Daniel Gibson etc etc. He doesn't have to prove that anymore. He carried a crappy CLE team for years before leaving.

Exactly, LeBron does not care about the regular season, it's clear. He even said so. That doesn't mean he doesn't expect better from his teammates, but LeBron himself has earned the right to take it easier during the regular season and let teammates carry more load.

I said the same thing last year, people questioned it, and then LeBron won a title and everyone was believers. You really going to doubt him again and how he turns it on in the playoffs? I hope for your sake that's just your trolling not your actual belief.

LB won the title? They may still b playing if Kyrie didnt hit the 3....so cause he doesnt care bout the regular season his teammates have to bust their butts every min of every game...solid leader!! Also, how did he do vs SA when they were the favs in Miami? Did he lose on purpose? Please w the trolling comment....LB had 40+ games in the regular season as well so dont act like he never did this before in a reg season game
User avatar
Dupp
RealGM
Posts: 89,224
And1: 33,106
Joined: Aug 16, 2009
Location: Bertrob
 

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1904 » by Dupp » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:29 pm

What exactly is being argued here?

Cavs don't bust their butt any minute of any game let alone every. That's the issue. Lebrons busted his ass for a decade and a half almost with insane playoff minutes yet still works considerably harder on the court than anyone else on the team.
Image
Warchant
Rookie
Posts: 1,128
And1: 380
Joined: Jul 01, 2016

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1905 » by Warchant » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:38 pm

Dupp wrote:What exactly is being argued here?

Cavs don't bust their butt any minute of any game let alone every. That's the issue. Lebrons busted his ass for a decade and a half almost with insane playoff minutes yet still works considerably harder on the court than anyone else on the team.

Explain that to OSU fan...he says LB coasts during reg season and doesnt care
nolang1
Junior
Posts: 479
And1: 182
Joined: Aug 03, 2012

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1906 » by nolang1 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:46 pm

Birdie wrote:And again, I'll mention, CLE had 2 other All-Stars on the team plus 9 guys who played, including LBJ, who shot 35% or higher (Korver highest at 48.5%) from 3, 5 of those guys shot > than 40%. Russ had 4 guys who shot better than 35% with Abrines topping out at 38.1% of the guys who played and actually jacked up shots. Dipo, McBuckets, Jerami Grant and Alex Abrines. Those 4 hardly instilling fear in the hearts of other teams.


Yeah, that's why LeBron is valuable: none of those players besides Irving are particularly good shooters when LeBron isn't on the floor with them. Deron Williams went from 34.8% in Dallas to 41.5% in Cleveland during the regular season (and is 5-7 in the playoffs so far). Korver went from 40.9% in Atlanta to 48.5% in Cleveland, all while shooting 2 more 3-pointers per 36 minutes.

He also plays defense well enough that the Cavs can get by for stretches with WIlliams, Korver, and Channing Frye in the lineup at the same time. You would have the worst defense in NBA history trying to play Westbrook alongside those guys, so I don't see why it's a credit to him that the Thunder need to surround him with defensive studs in order to have the best chance of winning.
User avatar
yoyoboy
Head Coach
Posts: 6,105
And1: 6,231
Joined: Jan 29, 2015
Location: Cleveland - Lifelong
     

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1907 » by yoyoboy » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:56 pm

Deron is playing so much better in the PnR with LeBron than Kyrie could ever hope to.
2016 NBA Champions.
User avatar
Thabo Sefolosha
Thunder Forum The Opening Tip
Posts: 1,329
And1: 2,518
Joined: Oct 29, 2013
 

Re: ECQF | (2) Cleveland Cavaliers vs Indiana Pacers (7) | CLE 3-0 

Post#1908 » by Thabo Sefolosha » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:32 pm

Read on Twitter

Return to The General Board