Kyrie Trade Discussion Continued

[TheBobster]

I remember Knick fans getting all excited about getting Noah and Rose before last season...oh they are going to be a 4 or 5 seed in the playoffs, so I don't think we can go by their thoughts. They are really underestimating both how good Kyrie is and how bad Noah's contract is. KP is "probably" going to be a very good player, "maybe" an all star, but he is just a good player now with "potential". Kyrie is already a great player, an all star, at 25, still not reaching his prime. And yes, I would rather keep Kyrie, but not after his trade request and the obvious issues going on with him and his teammates last season.

This is really nothing new for the Knicks. They have been interested in name players, coaches and front office personnel no matter how they fit in for years - Walt Bellamy, Earl Monroe, Wilt Chamberlain, Bob McAdoo, Spencer Haywood, George McGinnis, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, David Thompson, Marvin Webster, Paul Westphal, John Paxson, Bernard King, Larry Johnson, Stephon Marbury, Amare Stoudemire, LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony, Pat Riley, Red Auerbach, Larry Brown, Don Nelson, Lenny Wilkens, Phil Jackson, Isiah Thomas. Some have worked out, many haven't and many deals fell through.

It's just the nature of the beast. Playing in New York the Knicks have almost always felt the need to have marquee names, even if they were over-paid.

[lambchop]

the love and kyrie for porzingis and melo trade is interesting.

[Stillwater]

My impression of the NY involvement is strictly based on their ownership's inability to accept a rebuild and tank. Roll with KP and Ntilikina and see what transpires, even if it means caving and giving Melo a buyout. They have a future star in KP but they are not by any means opposed to moving him for KI imo or for any player that increases their odds of winning "with Melo immediately" who they can't trade, despite having also a potential star pg in Ntilikina that they also would likely move if his value was higher in the hopes of bringing in somebody else to join them. In their mind they cannot keep the budding star in KP if he is their only bargaining chip to get rid of bad contracts from Phil,since they cannot move Melo,and will be incapable of adding FA's. So they are focused on clearing bad contracts at least of Noah and having a chance at getting Boogie,Deandre,LMA etc in 2018 fa. They might even think they can attract bigger names than that, but it would be unrealistic in their hopes to Join Melo and KI. and actually compete at a level that is formidable .
I highly doubt Cleveland would take back Noah, but if they had a 3rd team involved that would ,who would receive KP for doing so sending their blue chip player & vet pg to Cavs etc. it might be conceivable

[Stillwater]

I posted this previously , but it was ignored so here it is again , and falls into the only scenario where I think all 3 teams might do it considering some of the things I mentioned in the previous post about NY inability to accept a tank :
Cavs get Miami 2018 from Suns ( Cavs keep it if it falls between 8-14,Suns keep it 15-30,Miami keeps it 1-7)if not transferred Cavs get Suns 2021 1st from Miami unprotected.
Cav's also get NY's 2018 Lottery protected until 2019 where it becomes unprotected.
NY gets Cavs 2019 second round draft pick from Minnesota or L.A. Lakers (less favorable)& Suns 2018 2nd round pick from Toronto.
Suns get 2020 top 10 protected from NY,unprotected in 2021.
Cav's get what they want in a vet pg and a blue chip rook.+ picks. But loses their all star guard & draft and stash Gem.
NY gets better with KI and Bender & Fry's contract is expiring,pawns Noah but gives up KP and two futures.
Phoenix gets better long term adding KP and Ntilikina & Osman for eating Noahs C & shipping JJ / Bender but retains their own 1st round picks & gets another to make up for the Miami pick they ship out.
Not that unrealistic from any teams perspective depending on the value held by each org on player movement.https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6935555

[Takingbaconback]

Team that trades for him won't have an advantage when he hits free agency. In fact it's going to be a disadvantage unless they can knock off the warriors. Irving has said he wants to lead a team and he clearly wants to build his own brand. He has said he's not going to commit to a team and he's gonna get wined and dined across the league. Knicks are the front runners and you can bet he isn't intimidated about turning that franchise around. A lot can change til then but knicks should definitely keep porzingis, he's going to be another factor for Irving to go to NY

[PrecociousNeoph]

I remember Knick fans getting all excited about getting Noah and Rose before last season...oh they are going to be a 4 or 5 seed in the playoffs, so I don't think we can go by their thoughts. They are really underestimating both how good Kyrie is and how bad Noah's contract is. KP is "probably" going to be a very good player, "maybe" an all star, but he is just a good player now with "potential". Kyrie is already a great player, an all star, at 25, still not reaching his prime. And yes, I would rather keep Kyrie, but not after his trade request and the obvious issues going on with him and his teammates last season.

no you don't, because we hated both moves, especially the noah signing

[John Murdoch]

I posted this previously , but it was ignored so here it is again , and falls into the only scenario where I think all 3 teams might do it considering some of the things I mentioned in the previous post about NY inability to accept a tank :
Cavs get Miami 2018 from Suns ( Cavs keep it if it falls between 8-14,Suns keep it 15-30,Miami keeps it 1-7)if not transferred Cavs get Suns 2021 1st from Miami unprotected.
Cav's also get NY's 2018 Lottery protected until 2019 where it becomes unprotected.
NY gets Cavs 2019 second round draft pick from Minnesota or L.A. Lakers (less favorable)& Suns 2018 2nd round pick from Toronto.
Suns get 2020 top 10 protected from NY,unprotected in 2021.
Cav's get what they want in a vet pg and a blue chip rook.+ picks. But loses their all star guard & draft and stash Gem.
NY gets better with KI and Bender & Fry's contract is expiring,pawns Noah but gives up KP and two futures.
Phoenix gets better long term adding KP and Ntilikina & Osman for eating Noahs C & shipping JJ / Bender but retains their own 1st round picks & gets another to make up for the Miami pick they ship out.
Not that unrealistic from any teams perspective depending on the value held by each org on player movement.https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6935555

Phx slightly overpays here imo , but hey with the Paul George trade anything is possible

[Sark]

Knicks are not taking calls on KP, so it's pointless to keep including him in any trade scenario.

Knicks would probably listen to Melo + WHG for Kyrie + Love.

[LuDux1]

Watch on YouTube

[Alatan]

Knicks would probably listen to Melo + WHG for Kyrie + Love.

Lol, they can add Lebron in as a sweetener.

[Asian Celtic]

Knicks would probably listen to Melo + WHG for Kyrie + Love.

Lol, they can add Lebron in as a sweetener.

Not enough, Should add Cleveland's 2020 1st round pick unprotected.

[axeman23]

Lol would Noah even report to Cle?

It'd make great viewing, just from that angle alone...

[axeman23]

Knicks are not taking calls on KP, so it's pointless to keep including him in any trade scenario.

Knicks would probably listen to Melo + WHG for Kyrie + Love.

And I'd probably listen to the offer of a Mila Kunis/Scarlett Johansson sandwich, but I'm not sure either offer is coming...

[Sark]

Knicks would probably listen to Melo + WHG for Kyrie + Love.

Lol, they can add Lebron in as a sweetener.

Not enough, Should add Cleveland's 2020 1st round pick unprotected.

Knicks are listening. Keep going. What else can you add?

[baldur]

Lol, they can add Lebron in as a sweetener.

Not enough, Should add Cleveland's 2020 1st round pick unprotected.

Knicks are listening. Keep going. What else can you add?

Key of the city of Cleveland?

[Sark]

Not enough, Should add Cleveland's 2020 1st round pick unprotected.

Knicks are listening. Keep going. What else can you add?

Key of the city of Cleveland?

I'd rather have another pick

[XPeak]

Denver has come into play.

What package could they assemble for Kalye Irving?

Murray, Chandler, + ???

[NBAFan93]

Watch on YouTube

This is hilarious! They were playing on Sirius this morning - came to post it, but, as always, someone beat me too it .

[Alatan]

Denver has come into play.

What package could they assemble for Kalye Irving?

Murray, Chandler, + ???

As good as KI is I dont want him in Denver. He would kill the chemistry with ISO ball, see how i am great, heroics. I think Murray has the posibillity to be a 20 ppg scorer in a few of years and a 15 ppg scorer next season so they are fine at the pg spot.

[LookToShoot]

I remember Knick fans getting all excited about getting Noah and Rose before last season...oh they are going to be a 4 or 5 seed in the playoffs, so I don't think we can go by their thoughts. They are really underestimating both how good Kyrie is and how bad Noah's contract is. KP is "probably" going to be a very good player, "maybe" an all star, but he is just a good player now with "potential". Kyrie is already a great player, an all star, at 25, still not reaching his prime. And yes, I would rather keep Kyrie, but not after his trade request and the obvious issues going on with him and his teammates last season.

This is really nothing new for the Knicks. They have been interested in name players, coaches and front office personnel no matter how they fit in for years - Walt Bellamy, Earl Monroe, Wilt Chamberlain, Bob McAdoo, Spencer Haywood, George McGinnis, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, David Thompson, Marvin Webster, Paul Westphal, John Paxson, Bernard King, Larry Johnson, Stephon Marbury, Amare Stoudemire, LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony, Pat Riley, Red Auerbach, Larry Brown, Don Nelson, Lenny Wilkens, Phil Jackson, Isiah Thomas. Some have worked out, many haven't and many deals fell through.

It's just the nature of the beast. Playing in New York the Knicks have almost always felt the need to have marquee names, even if they were over-paid.

The Knicks have also gambled on unproven players: Jamal Crawford, Jerome James, Zach Randolph. Those guys didn't do much.

Other than trading a young Trevor Ariza for a washed up Steve Francis, I don't see the issue of going after star players. The Lakers have done the same thing.