2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III)

Moderators: bwgood77, zimpy27, infinite11285, Clav, Domejandro, ken6199, bisme37, Dirk, KingDavid, cupcakesnake

Dirk
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 13,646
And1: 37,512
Joined: Dec 12, 2005
     

2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#1 » by Dirk » Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:12 pm

---PART ONE
---PART TWO

Guidelines
Spoiler:
--- seek to make POSITIVE contributions that distinguish this topic from others. Don't seek to pick apart and destroy other opinions based on their team logo or what player they root for.

If you come here as a fan of your team or rookie. Aim to make posts that are of value to other users who (very) likely don't watch your team as much and therefore increase the knowledge base of the forum. I.e, you are not doing that if you are having the same regurgitated discussion, with the same regurgitated user(s). Over and over and over.

--- don't come to the topic with the idea of boasting or taunting if a player has a great game or if a player has a bad game.

You are not posting on your team board or fanboy board. This topic isn't supposed to serve as your tool to feel fulfilled.

--- refrain from making baiting posts. I.e, grouping users together and then attacking whatever general fictional idea you generated. Do not use exceptions (one or two users opinions) and then generalise and again make baiting comments. I.e, "but X and Y fans of team A or B or fans of player B or C said * insert whatever fits your narrative"


Users are the ones who do the moderating. REPORT baiting/trolling/no value posts. Don't reply to baiting.


It is totally okay to make some odd jokes and comments, this topic is very lightly moderated and will continue to be. The General Board has a myriad of threads where you can make and read bad posts so don't make this just 'another thread'. Elevate this one.


Poll results
Image
juanc
Pro Prospect
Posts: 861
And1: 893
Joined: Apr 10, 2017
 

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#2 » by juanc » Mon Jan 28, 2019 2:01 pm

Image
gh123
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,848
And1: 1,197
Joined: Feb 17, 2016

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#3 » by gh123 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 2:03 pm

Is Ayton coming back this week?
Alyosha12
Analyst
Posts: 3,333
And1: 178
Joined: Nov 13, 2006
Location: SLOVENIJA

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#4 » by Alyosha12 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 3:03 pm

I think its amazing how people underestimate how hard it is, to add new skills to a players game. I mean honestly, how often does it happen, that a player who is great at penetrating but has a poor shot, adds shooting to his report, or how often does a 3&D player add penetration and handles, or how often does a big with a soft touch add a back to the basket game?

The answer: almost never.

The truth of the matter is, that most players are who they are, and very seldom, do they add a whole new aspect to their game. Why? Simply because, becoming an elite ball handler, shooter, in the paint scorer etc. takes years and years of practice and time. One off season or 5 simply isn't enough to do that.

Its much much much easier to add muscles and conditioning to your game, then it is to add skill, which is why, it is far more likely, that Doncic, whose skill is undoubtedly elite, will reach his ceiling (wherever it may be) then an elite athlete, who has little skill will reach his.

Doncic will add muscle and conditioning to his game in the next 2-3 off seasons. 2-3 months per off season is more then enough time for that. Muscle will help him penetrate and score off the dribble, conditioning will help his shooting and FT%. Both will help his man2man defense a bunch and rebounding. Ofcourse he will also improve his FG%.

I don't know if the other rookies will be able to improve their skill deficiencies in that time, I doubt it though, simply based on history. Most likely, they will improve the aspects of their game they are good at and their conditioning.

All in all the skill gap between all the rookies in this class and Doncic is simply much greater then the athleticism gap. That is also the reason, why he is simply a better basketball player, and will almost certainly always stay that way (bar injury).
Johnny Firpo
RealGM
Posts: 14,145
And1: 9,442
Joined: Apr 17, 2009
 

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#5 » by Johnny Firpo » Mon Jan 28, 2019 4:42 pm

Doncic has plenty of room for improvement, objectively. The most glaring example is his free throw shooting. There is no reason to think that he is not going to be an 80+% free throw shooter during his peak, possibly as high as 85-86%. His three point shooting will also improve, because it almost always does as players get into their career. Assist to turnover ratio, almost always improves as well, even for NBA-ready players like CP3. His body is very obviously going to improve, unless he is lazy and eats too much, but I'm sure his camp and the Mavs will pay extra attention to that. Also, anyone who puts in as many hours as he does into improving their game, is not lazy. He just eats too much/eats carb-loaded, fatty foods. Very easy to cut that out. His left hand while okay, still nowhere near as good as it could be one day. He doesn't have a hook shot basically, could develop it... He could develop the Dirk one legged fade... Do I need to go on? So many areas to improve.
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 92,440
And1: 98,386
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#6 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Jan 28, 2019 5:53 pm

I just want to say I've fallen in basketball love with Luka. And for those of you who don't appreciate him, I honestly feel bad because it's your loss. The combination of joy and skill with which he plays I'm not sure I've seen since Magic Johnson.
ThunderBolt wrote:I’m going to let some of you in on a little secret I learned on realgm. If you don’t like a thread, not only do you not have to comment but you don’t even have to open it and read it. You’re welcome.
stilldropin20
RealGM
Posts: 11,370
And1: 1,233
Joined: Jul 31, 2002
 

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#7 » by stilldropin20 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:21 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:I just want to say I've fallen in basketball love with Luka. And for those of you who don't appreciate him, I honestly feel bad because it's your loss. The combination of joy and skill with which he plays I'm not sure I've seen since Magic Johnson.


plus 1 million. this guy is a combination of magic johnson, larry bird, and steph curry. <--literally the 3 most beloved players of all time in terms of enjoying them as savants on the court.

I'll add that I called for a merger of the MVP thread and ROY thread 2 months ago. I wasn't joking then and I'm not joking now...I'm not saying Luka is a top 2 MVP candidate. But he is a top 12 candidate. and the all star results proved it. He is well on his way to all-nba 3rd team either as a SG or PF. All of which he qualifies given he is the 2nd largest player and 2nd best rebounder on the Dallas' most used starting 5 (with DSJ, Barnes, Wes, DAJ)

Another month of 27, 8 and 8 on 58%TS and its time to merge the threads. :nod: :nod: :nod:
like i said, its a full rebuild.
kg01
General Manager
Posts: 8,777
And1: 13,518
Joined: Jun 28, 2017
 

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#8 » by kg01 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:41 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:I just want to say I've fallen in basketball love with Luka. And for those of you who don't appreciate him, I honestly feel bad because it's your loss. The combination of joy and skill with which he plays I'm not sure I've seen since Magic Johnson.


Whaaa? You sayin' Luka's better than Magic Johnson?!? Whaaa?

Totally kidding. Luka is fun to watch and, as I've said before, he plays with a joy that's infectious for fans.

Our guy is sneaky-fun to watch too. Had to throw that in since they're always gonna be linked. 8-)
king01 :king:
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 92,440
And1: 98,386
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#9 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:46 pm

kg01 wrote:Our guy is sneaky-fun to watch too. Had to throw that in since they're always gonna be linked. 8-)



yeah this whole thing is so unfair to Trae Young and I hope people realize they need to measure him based on his own merits not on the decision of his front office. I think once Atlanta has more talent and structure around him he could be quite good. So far we've only seem him on that Sooner team with little around him and a re-building Hawks team.

Luka has the benefits of Rick Carlisle and playing with lots of vets(tho ironically he plays better with his more inexperienced teammates than he does Barnes and Matthews.) I don't think we can make much judgement on Trae yet other than taking note of his skillset. And his passing and shooting make him intriguing.
ThunderBolt wrote:I’m going to let some of you in on a little secret I learned on realgm. If you don’t like a thread, not only do you not have to comment but you don’t even have to open it and read it. You’re welcome.
User avatar
clyde21
RealGM
Posts: 63,709
And1: 70,065
Joined: Aug 20, 2014
     

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#10 » by clyde21 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:46 pm

Luka is a prodigy.

so, he's the #2 rookie? much more interesting conversation.
جُنْد فِلَسْطِيْن
GoodBehavior
Senior
Posts: 513
And1: 370
Joined: Dec 03, 2018

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#11 » by GoodBehavior » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:48 pm

Unless Bagley becomes a bona fide floor spacer, I don't see how he co-exist with Fox. He's too rail thin to play the 5, which means their front court is going to clog the interior for Fox. I can see why Bjelica is starting when healthy.
Bob8
RealGM
Posts: 10,655
And1: 4,491
Joined: Feb 08, 2017

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#12 » by Bob8 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:10 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:I just want to say I've fallen in basketball love with Luka. And for those of you who don't appreciate him, I honestly feel bad because it's your loss. The combination of joy and skill with which he plays I'm not sure I've seen since Magic Johnson.


Reading this, maybe someone will understand, how it felt for us, who have fallen in basketball love with Luka in his Madrid days. Believe me, it was hard reading how he’s next Rubio or Ingles.
User avatar
Clyde Frazier
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 20,228
And1: 26,110
Joined: Sep 07, 2010

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#13 » by Clyde Frazier » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:14 pm

Read on Twitter


Welp.
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 92,440
And1: 98,386
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#14 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:18 pm

Clyde Frazier wrote:
Read on Twitter


Welp.


Helps that Dwight Powell and DeAndre are both tremendous finishers, but yeah the dude is special.
ThunderBolt wrote:I’m going to let some of you in on a little secret I learned on realgm. If you don’t like a thread, not only do you not have to comment but you don’t even have to open it and read it. You’re welcome.
User avatar
E-Balla
RealGM
Posts: 35,822
And1: 25,116
Joined: Dec 19, 2012
Location: The Poster Formerly Known As The Gotham City Pantalones
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#15 » by E-Balla » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:21 pm

Clyde Frazier wrote:
Read on Twitter


Welp.

In the defense of other players Deandre Jordan has been the most effective roll target since 2011. He's the NBA leader in career FG% by 7.5% over 2nd place. The gap between him and #2 is less than the gap between #2 and #58.
User avatar
Clyde Frazier
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 20,228
And1: 26,110
Joined: Sep 07, 2010

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#16 » by Clyde Frazier » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:23 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
Clyde Frazier wrote:
Read on Twitter


Welp.


Helps that Dwight Powell and DeAndre are both tremendous finishers, but yeah the dude is special.


Yeah that did occur to me as well. What’s really striking is when he sets them up for alley oops off broken plays or half court sets where there’s barely room for a lob. His court awareness is just off the charts.
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 92,440
And1: 98,386
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#17 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:28 pm

Clyde Frazier wrote:What’s really striking is when he sets them up for alley oops off broken plays or half court sets where there’s barely room for a lob. His court awareness is just off the charts.


Did you see that one to DSJ last night? It was just like an NFL QB throwing the pass right by the corner's ear. I'm convinced no other player in the NBA even sees that pass is available much less executes it like that. It was just stupid and I could not believe what I just saw--and neither could the guys in the truck as they replayed like a dozen times. :lol:
ThunderBolt wrote:I’m going to let some of you in on a little secret I learned on realgm. If you don’t like a thread, not only do you not have to comment but you don’t even have to open it and read it. You’re welcome.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,773
And1: 5,478
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#18 » by King Ken » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:41 pm

I wish all of these rookies success. Ayton, JJJ, Trae, Luka, Bagley, Bamba, Sexton, SGA, etc.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,773
And1: 5,478
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#19 » by King Ken » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:43 pm

GoodBehavior wrote:Unless Bagley becomes a bona fide floor spacer, I don't see how he co-exist with Fox. He's too rail thin to play the 5, which means their front court is going to clog the interior for Fox. I can see why Bjelica is starting when healthy.

Bro, you might want to reads Dirks first post.

I think Fox and Bagley will be a tremendous duo that will dominate for many years.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 9,773
And1: 5,478
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: 2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III) 

Post#20 » by King Ken » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:45 pm

kg01 wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:I just want to say I've fallen in basketball love with Luka. And for those of you who don't appreciate him, I honestly feel bad because it's your loss. The combination of joy and skill with which he plays I'm not sure I've seen since Magic Johnson.


Whaaa? You sayin' Luka's better than Magic Johnson?!? Whaaa?

Totally kidding. Luka is fun to watch and, as I've said before, he plays with a joy that's infectious for fans.

Our guy is sneaky-fun to watch too. Had to throw that in since they're always gonna be linked. 8-)

Most fun rookie we have seen in Atlanta since Nique. Enjoyable and consistently improving.

Return to The General Board