freethedevil wrote:Lebron has a similar peak. He's going to retire with much better longetivity. The argument for MJ is that he won 3 more rings and a marginally higher % of playoff series whithout weighs lebron's 3 extra finals. Fair enough.
Russel won 5 more rings, made 6 more finals, was the clear #1 on his team throughout as they went to win 90% of their playoff series. That's about a 30% gap. The gap between jordan and lebron's team success is much closer than mj and russell.
How does one argue for mj against one without conceding his inferiority to the other?
Because having MJ>LeBron is the "cool" thing to do. Same way I'm sure having LeBron>(the next closest ATG) will be the cool thing to do 20 years from now. It's always "cool" to root for the older star and say "well you young guys just don't understand".
It's also because MJ has the "killer mindset" that LeBron allegedly
doesn't have because he's friends with all these guys off the court and isn't a pure scorer.
Truthfully I think when you get to the very top - MJ, Kareem, LeBron (pretty much everyone agrees they're 1, 2, 3 in some order) - I think there are arguments that can be made for any of them being at the #1 spot and they're hard to compare as they play 3 different positions and roles and played in 3 different eras.
People will always have biases - whether it be because they grew up watching Mike or because they were bigger NBA fans when they watched LeBron, so that watched every game of his playoffs runs, or whatever it may be.
Like Kobe's said before, there's no concrete way to determine who's the GOAT. It's a conversation that will always be ongoing. There are too many factors - rings, impact, legacy, physical dominance, etc.
This is what makes it fun to discuss. I personally have MJ, LeBron, Kareem in that order but I don't get bothered if someone else has a different order to their top 3. It is what it is.
But, I agree, if your sole argument is "MJ is 6-0 in the Finals, he's the GOAT" then you don't have much of an argument. Kobe was 5-2, Shaq was 4-2, and Timmy 5-1. (All better records than LBJ). Yet we don't put these guys in the GOAT conversation. 1-2 rings isn't the sole determinant of why these guys aren't in the conversation, a LOT of other things factor in there.
I don't think we'll ever have a true answer as to who's the GOAT. Even 20 years from now, the older generation will have watched LeBron throughout his whole dominance yet likely never seen Jordan play. And they will also favor the newest star because his dominance will be fresh in their mind. It's a never-ending discussion unfortunately or fortunately depending how you see it