Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps

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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#741 » by iggymcfrack » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:02 pm

Jay 20 wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
ChiCitySPORTS#1 wrote:
Man, if you think Chris Paul, today, is better than Russel Westbrook - I don’t know what to tell you. It’s not even worth debating


Scoring/shooting: Paul >> Westbrook
Rebounding: Westbrook >> Paul
Passing/playmaking: Westbrook > Paul
Defense: Paul >>> Westbrook

Maybe Westbrook would be better on a team lacking a #1 guy and desperate for creation, but next to Harden it’s Paul by a mile.


If you just listed shooting on the first one then yes but you put scoring/shooting.

Westbrook is a much better scorer then Chris Paul.


Per 36 minutes, Westbrook scored 23 PPG on 20 FGA and 6 FTA. Paul scored 18 PPG on 14 FGA and 4 FTA. Do those extra 5 points on 7 possessions really add value? Of course not. If Westbrook cut out some bad shots and changed his game so he was scoring the same points on the same efficiency as Paul he’d be a much better and more valuable player.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#742 » by Jay 20 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:05 pm

iggymcfrack wrote:
Jay 20 wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
Scoring/shooting: Paul >> Westbrook
Rebounding: Westbrook >> Paul
Passing/playmaking: Westbrook > Paul
Defense: Paul >>> Westbrook

Maybe Westbrook would be better on a team lacking a #1 guy and desperate for creation, but next to Harden it’s Paul by a mile.


If you just listed shooting on the first one then yes but you put scoring/shooting.

Westbrook is a much better scorer then Chris Paul.


Per 36 minutes, Westbrook scored 23 PPG on 20 FGA and 6 FTA. Paul scored 18 PPG on 14 FGA and 4 FTA. Do those extra 5 points on 7 possessions really add value? Of course not. If Westbrook cut out some bad shots and changed his game so he was scoring the same points on the same efficiency as Paul he’d be a much better and more valuable player.


Last season maybe. What’s this look like the last 10 seasons when Westbrook has never averaged fewer than 21 ppg and Paul never averaged more than 20?
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#743 » by iggymcfrack » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:08 pm

Jay 20 wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
Jay 20 wrote:
If you just listed shooting on the first one then yes but you put scoring/shooting.

Westbrook is a much better scorer then Chris Paul.


Per 36 minutes, Westbrook scored 23 PPG on 20 FGA and 6 FTA. Paul scored 18 PPG on 14 FGA and 4 FTA. Do those extra 5 points on 7 possessions really add value? Of course not. If Westbrook cut out some bad shots and changed his game so he was scoring the same points on the same efficiency as Paul he’d be a much better and more valuable player.


Last season maybe. What’s this look like the last 10 seasons when Westbrook has never averaged fewer than 21 ppg and Paul never averaged more than 20?


Comparing their entire careers, Westbrook averages an extra 4.5 points on an extra 5 possessions not even accounting for turnovers where Russ has many more. Paul’s always been a better scorer than Westbrook. He just puts the team first ahead of his numbers.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#744 » by RyderMike » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:12 pm

wutevahung wrote:
TaylorTRoom wrote:My take? I have been critical of Westbrook, but only as a point guard, the guy driving and directing the offense. He has some great skills- athletic as hell, non stop motor, great finisher, great leader, great handle. His shot has been better than recently. His main weakness is his incredible confidence- it drives him to take over in crucial moments, keeping his team from ever reaching its potential as a unit.

I’m assuming that in Houston, he won’t be driving and initiating the offense, unless Harden is resting.

I don’t believe Westbrook would ever win a championship as a point guard. I believe he absolutely could win one as a combi guard.


His shot was actually the worst ever last year. he shot 0.29% on 5.6 3PA. It was 6-10% lower than some of his other bad years, but it was career high in attempts.

He also shot career worst from 3-10ft and 10-16ft, 0.208% and 0.333% (career average 0.316% and 0.391%), 2nd career worst from 16-23ft, 0.358% (career average 0.384%)


The mathematician in me is cringing at this post. If you use decimals, you don't put the percent sign. 0.208 is 20.8% not 0.208%. The way you had makes him look like the worst player ever shooting less than 1%.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#745 » by Best2EverDoIt » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:15 pm

iggymcfrack wrote:
Jay 20 wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
Per 36 minutes, Westbrook scored 23 PPG on 20 FGA and 6 FTA. Paul scored 18 PPG on 14 FGA and 4 FTA. Do those extra 5 points on 7 possessions really add value? Of course not. If Westbrook cut out some bad shots and changed his game so he was scoring the same points on the same efficiency as Paul he’d be a much better and more valuable player.


Last season maybe. What’s this look like the last 10 seasons when Westbrook has never averaged fewer than 21 ppg and Paul never averaged more than 20?


Comparing their entire careers, Westbrook averages an extra 4.5 points on an extra 5 possessions not even accounting for turnovers where Russ has many more. Paul’s always been a better scorer than Westbrook. He just puts the team first ahead of his numbers.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#746 » by pcbothwel » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:24 pm

Best2EverDoIt wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
Jay 20 wrote:
Last season maybe. What’s this look like the last 10 seasons when Westbrook has never averaged fewer than 21 ppg and Paul never averaged more than 20?


Comparing their entire careers, Westbrook averages an extra 4.5 points on an extra 5 possessions not even accounting for turnovers where Russ has many more. Paul’s always been a better scorer than Westbrook. He just puts the team first ahead of his numbers.
Wut


What he is saying is....Russ is a low BBIQ shot jacker that peaked offensively 3 years ago with a TS of 55%. CP3's worst year in over a decade was last year and he had a TS of 56%.

CP3s first year in Houston he averaged (Per 100 Posessions) 29 points on 21 shots... Westbrick averaged 35 points on 29 shots... so he needed 8 more shots and 3.5 more FGA to get an extra 6 points...AWFUL
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#747 » by NBAFan93 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 10:20 pm

iggymcfrack wrote:
Jay 20 wrote:
iggymcfrack wrote:
Per 36 minutes, Westbrook scored 23 PPG on 20 FGA and 6 FTA. Paul scored 18 PPG on 14 FGA and 4 FTA. Do those extra 5 points on 7 possessions really add value? Of course not. If Westbrook cut out some bad shots and changed his game so he was scoring the same points on the same efficiency as Paul he’d be a much better and more valuable player.


Last season maybe. What’s this look like the last 10 seasons when Westbrook has never averaged fewer than 21 ppg and Paul never averaged more than 20?


Comparing their entire careers, Westbrook averages an extra 4.5 points on an extra 5 possessions not even accounting for turnovers where Russ has many more. Paul’s always been a better scorer than Westbrook. He just puts the team first ahead of his numbers.


That or he’s like LeBron and protects his FG% - I’ve seen CP3 chose to flop over taking real shots so many times it’s like his go to move in the clutch. At least Westbrook isn’t afraid to shoot and miss. Chris Paul is a great player, but IMO there are just as many reasons he’s hard to watch as there are for Westbrook.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#748 » by asero » Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:23 am

Why is this taking so long to get finalized? Could it be that Iggy is on his way too?
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#749 » by red96 » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:10 am

asero wrote:Why is this taking so long to get finalized? Could it be that Iggy is on his way too?
I think its very possible that Morey is trying to use CP3's high salary to help trade for more talent.
"Morey decided in 2007 that Steve Francis was to be the "franchise player" of the Rockets only to play what... 5 games? Morey didn't think Marc Gasol was worth a look that year,"
-baki "the Rockets fan"
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#750 » by wutevahung » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:29 pm

RyderMike wrote:
wutevahung wrote:
TaylorTRoom wrote:My take? I have been critical of Westbrook, but only as a point guard, the guy driving and directing the offense. He has some great skills- athletic as hell, non stop motor, great finisher, great leader, great handle. His shot has been better than recently. His main weakness is his incredible confidence- it drives him to take over in crucial moments, keeping his team from ever reaching its potential as a unit.

I’m assuming that in Houston, he won’t be driving and initiating the offense, unless Harden is resting.

I don’t believe Westbrook would ever win a championship as a point guard. I believe he absolutely could win one as a combi guard.


His shot was actually the worst ever last year. he shot 0.29% on 5.6 3PA. It was 6-10% lower than some of his other bad years, but it was career high in attempts.

He also shot career worst from 3-10ft and 10-16ft, 0.208% and 0.333% (career average 0.316% and 0.391%), 2nd career worst from 16-23ft, 0.358% (career average 0.384%)


The mathematician in me is cringing at this post. If you use decimals, you don't put the percent sign. 0.208 is 20.8% not 0.208%. The way you had makes him look like the worst player ever shooting less than 1%.


total brain fart, it looked like it was off but i was at work so didn't think about it lol thanks.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#751 » by edmunder_prc » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:43 pm

Anyone arguing Westbrook is going to play well with Harden is wishing on a prayer.

Historically WB is a bad, bad shooter and ballhog. How that works becoming a super Patrick Beverley, only taking good shots in the flow of the offense, sacrificing for the team, giving 100% on defense and off ball movement.

Its all wishes and prayers. WB is the exact opposite of that.

Who knows, it could happen, but it’s extremely unlikely.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#752 » by Wargreymon » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:45 pm

I was hoping Miami would've traded for him so I can call him Russell Eastbrook.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#753 » by ThunderBolt » Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:59 pm

Wargreymon wrote:I was hoping Miami would've traded for him so I can call him Russell Eastbrook.


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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#754 » by Lysdexic » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:58 am

Not a fan of Westbrook and view this as a lateral move for the Rockets. Morey isn't really a fan of developing talent through the draft so the picks lost isn't a big deal to him. Russ is younger than CP3 and can hopefully make up for rebounding deficiencies the team had in the postseason against GSW by acquiring one of the best rebounding guards in the game.

I do have concerns about closing out games in the 4th with both the Beard and WB on the floor but I'm confident this is at least another 50 win team with a 2nd round to WCF exit. A lateral placement considering where the Rockets have ended up the past two seasons.

I do like the Chandler pick up as Nene has been on his last legs for about 3 seasons now.

I don't think keeping CP3 would have been a good move for the Rockets either. Paul failed to have at least one 20 point / 10 assist game in the post season and wasn't the closer the Rockets needed like he was in the '17-18 season before the hamstring injury. The albatross contract, coming into the 18-19' regular season out of shape, being injured after an 11-14 start and failing to blow by guards like he used makes parting ways easier for me. Paul physically just doesn't have it in him anymore even if he is still one of the smartest basketball players in the game. I do wish him well and hope the weight loss this off season will help him regain some of his quickness.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#756 » by Lysdexic » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:02 am

edmunder_prc wrote:Anyone arguing Westbrook is going to play well with Harden is wishing on a prayer.

Historically WB is a bad, bad shooter and ballhog. How that works becoming a super Patrick Beverley, only taking good shots in the flow of the offense, sacrificing for the team, giving 100% on defense and off ball movement.

Its all wishes and prayers. WB is the exact opposite of that.

Who knows, it could happen, but it’s extremely unlikely.


Can't believe I'm already coming to the defense of WB. Help me. Please.

When George was going off and having his little MVP tear in the middle of the 18-19' reg season, WB showed a willingness to defer to the hot hand and lower his usage if memory serves correctly.
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Re: Woj - Westbrook traded to Houston for Chris Paul, 2024 & 2026 1st round picks, 2021/2025 pick swaps 

Post#757 » by gmoney411 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:35 am

Lysdexic wrote:
edmunder_prc wrote:Anyone arguing Westbrook is going to play well with Harden is wishing on a prayer.

Historically WB is a bad, bad shooter and ballhog. How that works becoming a super Patrick Beverley, only taking good shots in the flow of the offense, sacrificing for the team, giving 100% on defense and off ball movement.

Its all wishes and prayers. WB is the exact opposite of that.

Who knows, it could happen, but it’s extremely unlikely.


Can't believe I'm already coming to the defense of WB. Help me. Please.

When George was going off and having his little MVP tear in the middle of the 18-19' reg season, WB showed a willingness to defer to the hot hand and lower his usage if memory serves correctly.


Westbrook was KD's teammate when he won the MVP and he was George's teammate last year when he was a strong contender and finished third even after injury. I'm not a Russ defender either, but other people have shined with him.

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