CP3/John Wall Swap

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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#21 » by bulliedog8 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:22 pm

Rafael122 wrote:
bulliedog8 wrote:Next years draft class is point guard heavy. No need to trade for CP0 when you can tank the year and then get a wall replacement next year. Wonder what they do with Beal though. After all the assets being acquired for stars right now, they should sell high on beal and start over.


Only team I'd trade Beal to is the Pelicans. Their draft stash is more immediate, whereas there's too many unknowns with the picks OKC got.


Ya looking around the nba, not many teams that are 1 Beal away from contention that also have enticing assets. Closest team would be the nuggets. But I’d want Jamal Murray. Not sure how many picks the nuggets would give up with Murray.

Knicks assets don’t look like anything special, and they are going all in for 2021 anyways. I’m sure they’d rather keep assets then throw a max at Beal and hope he takes it.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#22 » by Best2EverDoIt » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:24 pm

Nope, no thanks.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#23 » by GeorgeMarcus » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:25 pm

TheGOATWill wrote:No point in okc shuffling deck chairs on the titanic


Great metaphor, although I somewhat disagree because Wall is much younger than CP3.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#24 » by illuminati666 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:45 pm

76ciology wrote:Wiggins make more sense.

Wiggins as tank commander. Cp3 plays 2man with KAT.

I thought about that too but it just makes too little sense for the Wolves. I think Wiggins is an actual asset he just needs a new team. Timberwolves are very young, they do not need CP3 on that team.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#25 » by Effigy » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:45 pm

Dadouv47 wrote:
Effigy wrote:
Dadouv47 wrote:
MORE PICKSSSSSSS YES !!!!

Kidding. I prefer a second young prospect to develop with SGA.

Not happening anyway


I think any young prospects involved in this trade are going to be going with CP3, not coming back for him. Nobody wants that contract. The Rockets had to attach two picks to him to take back an equally bad contract.


John Wall contract is the worst in the NBA, not even close with his terrible injury. It's basically the only trade where we could find some positive value, but won't happen. We will end up trading CP3 and a small asset to the heat for garbage.


The big advantage Wall has is his age. He's 6 years younger than Paul. He's also about $9 million cheaper per year. You can tank and wait for him to return to form and either build around him or trade him when he builds his value back up. Wall and CJ Miles for Paul seems like a fair deal to me.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#26 » by illuminati666 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:47 pm

Best2EverDoIt wrote:Nope, no thanks.

Might be one of the only trades you can get assets back for CP3. Depends on how much the Heat want to offer if they offer anything at all
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#27 » by PharmD » Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:54 pm

Wall's contract is untradeable, even for Paul's contract. Wall will make 47M in 22-23!
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#28 » by Rafael122 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:01 pm

If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#29 » by SAKURABA216 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:08 pm

CP3 needs to find a way to get traded to the Bucks for Bledsoe/Hill/Illyasova. They would be the favorites to win the east after that and CP3 would have the best chance to actually make it to the finals.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#30 » by SAKURABA216 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:10 pm

Rafael122 wrote:If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.



I think the difference is that Durant can pull up and shoot over everyone in the league while Wall relies on his speed. Brandon Jennings also tore his achilles while he was balling out for us for a stretch and was never the same.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#31 » by Rafael122 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:16 pm

SAKURABA216 wrote:
Rafael122 wrote:If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.



I think the difference is that Durant can pull up and shoot over everyone in the league while Wall relies on his speed. Brandon Jennings also tore his achilles while he was balling out for us for a stretch and was never the same.


I agree, their games are different but Durant is still facing the same uphill battle Wall is.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#32 » by igorbianch » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:17 pm

Rafael122 wrote:If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.


Because Wall was never worth that contract even when he was healthy. Now your throw in the injury + the fact he can’t shoot and relies heavily on athleticism... It’s a ****.

A healthy Durant is worth even more than the supermax. We don’t know how good he will be, but there’s a chance he will still be good and worth the contract.

With Wall this possibility never existed.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#33 » by poomaster » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:19 pm

Rafael122 wrote:If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.


Huh are you seriously trying to compare Wall and Durant - Wall whose game is entirely reliant on athleticism and Durant who is one of the greatest scorers of all time who barely even needs to jump to get his shot off?

There must be something in the water over there in Washington, the stuff that comes out of your fanbase is legendary.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#34 » by PushDaRock » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:21 pm

Rafael122 wrote:If Wall gets back to 80-85% of himself, there will be a market for him in 2021. It's really interesting how the NBA media views Wall's contract. He tore his Achilles, devastating injury, no question about it. Durant tore his Achilles, is 2 years older than Wall, yet no one blinked an eye when they were like "oh Durant's getting the max." He just suffered the same injury, yet somehow his contract outlook is better than Wall's? Are their games different? Yes, but by the time Wall's contract ends, he'll be 32 whereas KD will be 34. I think the age thing is being overlooked. You know what the salary difference between the two is in 2021? Like $3.5 million. It's a little weird, but it is what it is.


Assuming Wall misses this year, he will have played in 73 total games the last 3 years. This isn't Wall's first injury, he's been banged up for years. Even at 100%, there isn't a market at all for an inefficient ball dominant guard in his 30's making 43 million a year with a 15% trade kicker on top.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#35 » by PushDaRock » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:27 pm

Effigy wrote:
Dadouv47 wrote:
Effigy wrote:
I think any young prospects involved in this trade are going to be going with CP3, not coming back for him. Nobody wants that contract. The Rockets had to attach two picks to him to take back an equally bad contract.


John Wall contract is the worst in the NBA, not even close with his terrible injury. It's basically the only trade where we could find some positive value, but won't happen. We will end up trading CP3 and a small asset to the heat for garbage.


The big advantage Wall has is his age. He's 6 years younger than Paul. He's also about $9 million cheaper per year. You can tank and wait for him to return to form and either build around him or trade him when he builds his value back up. Wall and CJ Miles for Paul seems like a fair deal to me.


Wall is making 43 million a year with a 15% trade kicker as well and will have played just 73 games in the last 3 years after this season assuming he misses the entire year.

Paul is making 40 million a year and his contract runs a year shorter while also being the better and healthier player regardless of age.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#36 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:28 pm

Right now, at this moment, Paul's contract is less awful than Wall's because Paul can still get on a basketball court and play 55 games this year. But the Wizards aren't worried about this year. They've already gone all-in on a tank-for-a-season plan.

If you fast forward to Summer 2020, Wall is arguably more valuable than Paul. Wall will be 29, healthy again at perhaps 85-90% of his former self. Paul will be 35, declining, and more fragile. The year after in Summer 2021 (the year that matters as that will be the year that Beal resigns or not), Wall will be 30 years old, 2.5 removed from his surgery with two years left on his deal. Paul will be a 36-year-old decrepit curmudgeon with still one more year left on his deal. I'd much rather have Wall at that point.

The bottom line is that I wouldn't even trade Wall straight up for Chris Paul and I sure as hell wouldn't include Hachimura or a future pick in the transaction. The only scenario where a straight up trade makes sense is if the Wizards cared a great deal about winning games this season. And they don't.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#37 » by poomaster » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:31 pm

nate33 wrote:Right now, at this moment, Paul's contract is less awful than Wall's because Paul can still get on a basketball court and play 55 games this year. But the Wizards aren't worried about this year. They've already gone all-in on a tank-for-a-season plan.

If you fast forward to Summer 2020, Wall is arguably more valuable than Paul. Wall will be 29, healthy again at perhaps 85-90% of his former self. Paul will be 35, declining, and more fragile. The year after in Summer 2021 (the year that matters as that will be the year that Beal resigns or not), Wall will be 30 years old, 2.5 removed from his surgery with two years left on his deal. Paul will be a 36-year-old decrepit curmudgeon with still one more year left on his deal. I'd much rather have Wall at that point.

The bottom line is that I wouldn't even trade Wall straight up for Chris Paul and I sure as hell wouldn't include Hachimura or a future pick in the transaction. The only scenario where a straight up trade makes sense is if the Wizards cared a great deal about winning games this season. And they don't.


Games Played for Wall:

2017 - 2018 - 41

2018-2019 - 32

2019 - 2020 - 0

Mmhmm yes yes judging by this trend he is going to come back fully healthy and be an MVP candidate everyone will be dying to get.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#38 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:33 pm

PushDaRock wrote:
Effigy wrote:
Dadouv47 wrote:
John Wall contract is the worst in the NBA, not even close with his terrible injury. It's basically the only trade where we could find some positive value, but won't happen. We will end up trading CP3 and a small asset to the heat for garbage.


The big advantage Wall has is his age. He's 6 years younger than Paul. He's also about $9 million cheaper per year. You can tank and wait for him to return to form and either build around him or trade him when he builds his value back up. Wall and CJ Miles for Paul seems like a fair deal to me.


Wall is making 43 million a year with a 15% trade kicker as well and will have played just 73 games in the last 3 years after this season assuming he misses the entire year.

Paul is making 40 million a year and his contract runs a year shorter while also being the better and healthier player regardless of age.

You can subtract about $30M off of Wall's cost because insurance will pay that much of his salary. So now their net costs are much closer to equal. Basically, they're both 3-year contracts as far as the financial burden goes.

And calling Paul the better and healthier player regardless of age is dubious. Short point guards never age well. Paul declined pretty dramatically last season and can't even play 60 games anymore. This year, he'll be better than Wall because Wall won't play, but the following year, I seriously doubt he'll be better. And the year after that, I'm almost sure Wall will be better. I'll take 30-year-old Wall over 36-year-old Paul even after the Achilles injury. Wall will be 2.5 years removed from surgery at that point.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#39 » by nate33 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:35 pm

poomaster wrote:
nate33 wrote:Right now, at this moment, Paul's contract is less awful than Wall's because Paul can still get on a basketball court and play 55 games this year. But the Wizards aren't worried about this year. They've already gone all-in on a tank-for-a-season plan.

If you fast forward to Summer 2020, Wall is arguably more valuable than Paul. Wall will be 29, healthy again at perhaps 85-90% of his former self. Paul will be 35, declining, and more fragile. The year after in Summer 2021 (the year that matters as that will be the year that Beal resigns or not), Wall will be 30 years old, 2.5 removed from his surgery with two years left on his deal. Paul will be a 36-year-old decrepit curmudgeon with still one more year left on his deal. I'd much rather have Wall at that point.

The bottom line is that I wouldn't even trade Wall straight up for Chris Paul and I sure as hell wouldn't include Hachimura or a future pick in the transaction. The only scenario where a straight up trade makes sense is if the Wizards cared a great deal about winning games this season. And they don't.


Games Played for Wall:

2017 - 2018 - 41

2018-2019 - 32

2019 - 2020 - 0

Mmhmm yes yes judging by this trend he is going to come back fully healthy and be an MVP candidate everyone will be dying to get.

Yeah, and the history of sub-6-foot 35-year-old PG's is really impressive.
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Re: CP3/John Wall Swap 

Post#40 » by jjscap » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:39 pm

He's heading to MIN.

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