Celtics exposed?

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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#161 » by itrsteve » Wed Oct 9, 2019 5:41 pm

Tai wrote:
itrsteve wrote:
Froob wrote:People really in this thread roasting Ainge for not trading his picks and young players for guys like George, Butler and Kawhi who have already jumped ship twice?


It's standard operating procedure around these parts.

Meanwhile, completely overlooking that he did in fact roll the dice with one of the coveted picks for an all-star who wasn't interested in finishing out their contract just like the rest of them... Look how that turned out? I have the utmost confidence that Boston would have been left in shambles if they had rolled the dice on any of those 3 just the same.

They're going to crap on him and the celtics either way, it's best to try not to reason with them.


To be fair on Paul George, I think he woulda stayed in Boston (and actually did for the Thunder once); I think he just legit saw the writing on the wall for the Thunder and was like "yea it ain't happening here". But everyone else? Yea no doubt they were probably leaving.


I hate to speculate on the rumored hulls for the PG pick. But if I recall correctly, it was the #1 pick + Jaylen + Salary fillers (Avery Brown and Crowder). Also, I believe there were cap implications where they wanted to lock up Hayward in RFA then move PG on a S&T before being hardcapped.. This screwed up the timeline as well because they had to wait until July 4th for Hayward.

So if you think about the talent left to surround PG, what's to say he wouldn't have pulled an OKC?

I do agree, out of the entire bunch, PG would have had the highest probability of staying as he had previously called Boston as a potential destination but I'm not confident that the needle would have been pushed in our favor.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#162 » by Liminy » Wed Oct 9, 2019 6:08 pm

djsunyc wrote:
manlisten wrote:I've got them winning 42 games. They essentially have a tank roster on par with the Grizzlies and OKC but not as cohesive as those squads. They would be a 15 seed in the West. I know people like to say it's only preseason but there were some MAJOR red flags in that game and they were all highly predictable. During the stretch where they went down 17 they couldn't manufacture any type of looks on offense and Kemba/Kanter were getting abused on defense every single trip down the court. And this was against the Charlotte Hornets who have the most random assortment of names since Hinkie's Sixers. Stevens seems to be running the same system as last year with his center dictating the offense above the break. This made me realize how much of a crutch Horford was for him because Kanter and Williams aren't equipped for that role whatsoever. They are going to have to scratch and claw for any wins, absolutely nothing is coming easy for that team.

Sent from my Pixel XL using RealGM mobile app


for danny ainge to spend 5 years and all those draft picks building the charlotte hornets would be quite bad.


I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#163 » by matt6715 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 6:22 pm

Liminy wrote:
djsunyc wrote:
manlisten wrote:I've got them winning 42 games. They essentially have a tank roster on par with the Grizzlies and OKC but not as cohesive as those squads. They would be a 15 seed in the West. I know people like to say it's only preseason but there were some MAJOR red flags in that game and they were all highly predictable. During the stretch where they went down 17 they couldn't manufacture any type of looks on offense and Kemba/Kanter were getting abused on defense every single trip down the court. And this was against the Charlotte Hornets who have the most random assortment of names since Hinkie's Sixers. Stevens seems to be running the same system as last year with his center dictating the offense above the break. This made me realize how much of a crutch Horford was for him because Kanter and Williams aren't equipped for that role whatsoever. They are going to have to scratch and claw for any wins, absolutely nothing is coming easy for that team.

Sent from my Pixel XL using RealGM mobile app


for danny ainge to spend 5 years and all those draft picks building the charlotte hornets would be quite bad.


I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.


If it was so easy... why haven't they addressed it?
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#164 » by manlisten » Wed Oct 9, 2019 6:25 pm

Liminy wrote:
djsunyc wrote:
manlisten wrote:I've got them winning 42 games. They essentially have a tank roster on par with the Grizzlies and OKC but not as cohesive as those squads. They would be a 15 seed in the West. I know people like to say it's only preseason but there were some MAJOR red flags in that game and they were all highly predictable. During the stretch where they went down 17 they couldn't manufacture any type of looks on offense and Kemba/Kanter were getting abused on defense every single trip down the court. And this was against the Charlotte Hornets who have the most random assortment of names since Hinkie's Sixers. Stevens seems to be running the same system as last year with his center dictating the offense above the break. This made me realize how much of a crutch Horford was for him because Kanter and Williams aren't equipped for that role whatsoever. They are going to have to scratch and claw for any wins, absolutely nothing is coming easy for that team.

Sent from my Pixel XL using RealGM mobile app


for danny ainge to spend 5 years and all those draft picks building the charlotte hornets would be quite bad.


I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.


I can pretty much guarantee they won't be a top 3 seed. Actually yea, I guarantee it. If it was that easy to find a good center they wouldn't be in this situation in the first place. They literally have 5 and none of them are equipped to anchor a defense. They're easily going to have one of the worst defenses in the league and their offense has never been great under Stevens. It puzzles me that so many analytic models have them winning close to 50 games. Half the guys on their roster don't even have NBA data to plug-in.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#165 » by dakomish23 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 6:36 pm

Asif16 wrote:They're probably gonna end up trading for Steven Adams somehow


My money is on Bamba
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#166 » by Liminy » Wed Oct 9, 2019 7:06 pm

manlisten wrote:
Liminy wrote:
djsunyc wrote:
for danny ainge to spend 5 years and all those draft picks building the charlotte hornets would be quite bad.


I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.


I can pretty much guarantee they won't be a top 3 seed. Actually yea, I guarantee it. If it was that easy to find a good center they wouldn't be in this situation in the first place. They literally have 5 and none of them are equipped to anchor a defense. They're easily going to have one of the worst defenses in the league and their offense has never been great under Stevens. It puzzles me that so many analytic models have them winning close to 50 games. Half the guys on their roster don't even have NBA data to plug-in.


Cool. Let's bookmark this one. My bet is that 4 is the lowest seed with Miami being the only team that could pass them. Well, the top 2 are kind of obvious.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#167 » by Liminy » Wed Oct 9, 2019 7:08 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
Asif16 wrote:They're probably gonna end up trading for Steven Adams somehow


My money is on Bamba


How about Drummond after a Pistaplosion?
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#168 » by AwkwardBoogaloo » Wed Oct 9, 2019 7:09 pm

Liminy wrote:
djsunyc wrote:
manlisten wrote:I've got them winning 42 games. They essentially have a tank roster on par with the Grizzlies and OKC but not as cohesive as those squads. They would be a 15 seed in the West. I know people like to say it's only preseason but there were some MAJOR red flags in that game and they were all highly predictable. During the stretch where they went down 17 they couldn't manufacture any type of looks on offense and Kemba/Kanter were getting abused on defense every single trip down the court. And this was against the Charlotte Hornets who have the most random assortment of names since Hinkie's Sixers. Stevens seems to be running the same system as last year with his center dictating the offense above the break. This made me realize how much of a crutch Horford was for him because Kanter and Williams aren't equipped for that role whatsoever. They are going to have to scratch and claw for any wins, absolutely nothing is coming easy for that team.

Sent from my Pixel XL using RealGM mobile app


for danny ainge to spend 5 years and all those draft picks building the charlotte hornets would be quite bad.


I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.


3rd is pretty optimistic. The Celtics only finished 4th last season with Kyrie and Horford on the roster. The Pacers (who were missing Oladipo for 1/3rd of the the season) finished only 1 game behind the Celtics. That being said, I have the Bucks, 76ers, and Pacers in my top 3. Unless they make some mid-season upgrades, which isn't as easy as you make it seem, they'll finish as a 4-seed at best. I suspect they'll fall lower than that, but IMO 4-6 is the most realistic prediction for the roster they have now.
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Re: Celtics interior defense exposed? 

Post#169 » by The_Hater » Wed Oct 9, 2019 7:43 pm

CIN-C-STAR wrote:I didn't understand why they shipped Baynes to Phoenix in what was basically a salary dump.
The guy is an excellent big defender and rim protector. They couldn't have found a use for that, at least situationally?


They needed as much cap space as they could hoard at the time. Keep Baynes and they don't get Kemba. It was all part of the same sequence.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#170 » by tundraknight » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:00 pm

I was recently going to make a similar thread righter after Team USA got embarrassed in the FIBA Tournament.

That Team USA was basically a Rich Mans version of the Celtics with a few added All Star caliber players, and still struggled through out the tournament.

So I knew it was going to be a cause for concern when this current Celtics team is basically a very poor mans Team USA from the this past summer.
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Re: Celtics interior defense exposed? 

Post#171 » by Karate Diop » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:22 pm

The_Hater wrote:
CIN-C-STAR wrote:I didn't understand why they shipped Baynes to Phoenix in what was basically a salary dump.
The guy is an excellent big defender and rim protector. They couldn't have found a use for that, at least situationally?


They needed as much cap space as they could hoard at the time. Keep Baynes and they don't get Kemba. It was all part of the same sequence.


Was Kemba worth the huge overpay though? Seems like they're going to end up repeating last year's mistakes... Tatum and Brown want shots...
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Re: Celtics interior defense exposed? 

Post#172 » by The_Hater » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:27 pm

Karate Diop wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
CIN-C-STAR wrote:I didn't understand why they shipped Baynes to Phoenix in what was basically a salary dump.
The guy is an excellent big defender and rim protector. They couldn't have found a use for that, at least situationally?


They needed as much cap space as they could hoard at the time. Keep Baynes and they don't get Kemba. It was all part of the same sequence.


Was Kemba worth the huge overpay though? Seems like they're going to end up repeating last year's mistakes... Tatum and Brown want shots...


I think adding a top 20-25 player and allstar playing a position of need is more important than keeping your backup Center. So Yes. He’s better than both Tatum and Brown just as Kyrie was also better so having Walker take those shots also makes you a better Offensive team.

Besides, Baynes really isn’t any better than Kanter or Theis or Williams, Horford is the real loss here.
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Re: Celtics interior defense exposed? 

Post#173 » by RHODEY » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:47 pm

The_Hater wrote:
Karate Diop wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
They needed as much cap space as they could hoard at the time. Keep Baynes and they don't get Kemba. It was all part of the same sequence.


Was Kemba worth the huge overpay though? Seems like they're going to end up repeating last year's mistakes... Tatum and Brown want shots...


I think adding a top 20-25 player and allstar playing a position of need is more important than keeping your backup Center. So Yes. He’s better than both Tatum and Brown just as Kyrie was also better so having Walker take those shots also makes you a better Offensive team.

Besides, Baynes really isn’t any better than Kanter or Theis or Williams, Horford is the real loss here.


Retaining Baynes and Morris would have mitigated that loss. Pretending those 2 are marginal players is delusional.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#174 » by lonzo_pelota » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:52 pm

celtics will surprise a lot of people this year, i wont be one of them unfortunately as kemba has shown us what he can typically do at the helm of your team
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#175 » by Rockice_24 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:56 pm

Liminy wrote:
manlisten wrote:
Liminy wrote:
I still think they are the 3rd best team in the East. Center is the easiest place to pick someone off the scrap heap who can contribute. They do need someone that can defend in the middle for sure.


I can pretty much guarantee they won't be a top 3 seed. Actually yea, I guarantee it. If it was that easy to find a good center they wouldn't be in this situation in the first place. They literally have 5 and none of them are equipped to anchor a defense. They're easily going to have one of the worst defenses in the league and their offense has never been great under Stevens. It puzzles me that so many analytic models have them winning close to 50 games. Half the guys on their roster don't even have NBA data to plug-in.


Cool. Let's bookmark this one. My bet is that 4 is the lowest seed with Miami being the only team that could pass them. Well, the top 2 are kind of obvious.


Yikes BOS #3, MIA #4 :crazy:

TOR, INDY, BK all easily better shot at top 4 seeds.
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#176 » by Rockice_24 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 8:58 pm

lonzo_pelota wrote:celtics will surprise a lot of people this year, i wont be one of them unfortunately as kemba has shown us what he can typically do at the helm of your team


Confused, you think BOS will surprise in a good way because of Kemba's track record? What has he ever done in CHAR?
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Re: Celtics interior defense exposed? 

Post#177 » by Karate Diop » Wed Oct 9, 2019 9:14 pm

The_Hater wrote:
Karate Diop wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
They needed as much cap space as they could hoard at the time. Keep Baynes and they don't get Kemba. It was all part of the same sequence.


Was Kemba worth the huge overpay though? Seems like they're going to end up repeating last year's mistakes... Tatum and Brown want shots...


I think adding a top 20-25 player and allstar playing a position of need is more important than keeping your backup Center. So Yes. He’s better than both Tatum and Brown just as Kyrie was also better so having Walker take those shots also makes you a better Offensive team.

Besides, Baynes really isn’t any better than Kanter or Theis or Williams, Horford is the real loss here.


Eh I'd have to throw together rankings but gun to my head - off the top of my head - Kemba easily is not a Top 20 player. I guess my point was would the Celtics have been better off rolling with Smart, signing another PG for a fraction of the cost and then using their remaining cap space to shore up the front line ?
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#178 » by AwkwardBoogaloo » Wed Oct 9, 2019 9:19 pm

Rockice_24 wrote:
lonzo_pelota wrote:celtics will surprise a lot of people this year, i wont be one of them unfortunately as kemba has shown us what he can typically do at the helm of your team


Confused, you think BOS will surprise in a good way because of Kemba's track record? What has he ever done in CHAR?


I could be wrong but I think he means people will be surprised at how bad the Celtics will be this season
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#179 » by robbie84 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 9:34 pm

Bit of overreaction here.
Are they that different to the playoff Blazers last year that made the WCF?
I mean that Blazers team was never winning a championship, and this years C's are never winning a championship, but they are pretty similarly built squads.
Poor interior defensive bigs, great guard/wing play led by top 5 point guards.
Slight coaching edge goes to Celtics perhaps?

The biggest problem for Celtics is going to be playoff time vs match ups vs size like the 76ers with Embid/Horford and Bucks with the Lopez boys.
So they're going to have to play small/fast and hit a lot of threes to keep the offensive pressure on teams like this with pace and space.
Should be really fun to watch them try to counter-balance their lack of size into a speed advantage because it's the only way they'll be able to beat teams with superstars with size.

To call them 'exposed' is pretty funny. Not sure what they're being exposed for?
Was anyone expecting them to be even a fringe contender this year after losing Horford?
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Re: Celtics exposed? 

Post#180 » by Magic_Johnny12 » Wed Oct 9, 2019 9:43 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
Asif16 wrote:They're probably gonna end up trading for Steven Adams somehow


My money is on Bamba


My money is on you being wrong.

Drummond makes a lot more sense.
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