Re: Is Brandon Ingram a max player and the MIP
Posted: Wed Jul 1, 2020 2:02 am
There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
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iamworthy wrote:There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
Duke4life831 wrote:iamworthy wrote:There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
Same could be said for Ben Simmons (Embiid) and Jamal Murray (Jokic), but both got the 5-year offer from their teams. It also makes more sense for a small market to offer it, it ideally builds a better relationship with the player with hope he doesn't leave as a UFA.
iamworthy wrote:Duke4life831 wrote:iamworthy wrote:There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
Same could be said for Ben Simmons (Embiid) and Jamal Murray (Jokic), but both got the 5-year offer from their teams. It also makes more sense for a small market to offer it, it ideally builds a better relationship with the player with hope he doesn't leave as a UFA.
Ben Simmons is understandable. I wouldn't have given murray 5 years. Just because another franchise makes bad decisions doesn't mean you have to. If I'm the pels I would have like to see Ingram and Zion together for a year. Zion is the market, and honestly, Ingram is better than lonzo but if lonzo clicks better with Zion then what.
Duke4life831 wrote:iamworthy wrote:Duke4life831 wrote:Same could be said for Ben Simmons (Embiid) and Jamal Murray (Jokic), but both got the 5-year offer from their teams. It also makes more sense for a small market to offer it, it ideally builds a better relationship with the player with hope he doesn't leave as a UFA.
Ben Simmons is understandable. I wouldn't have given murray 5 years. Just because another franchise makes bad decisions doesn't mean you have to. If I'm the pels I would have like to see Ingram and Zion together for a year. Zion is the market, and honestly, Ingram is better than lonzo but if lonzo clicks better with Zion then what.
Then they sign Lonzo as well. They can afford all 3, especially with Lonzo not going to be a max player. Plus it's much easier to replace Lonzo than it is Ingram. You're not going to find too many wing players to plug along Zion that can shoot 3s at a high rate and efficiency, can create for himself in the half-court, facilitates, and is a very low usage player when it comes to time with the ball.
iamworthy wrote:There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
Lost Angel wrote:iamworthy wrote:There's really no reason for the pels to offer a 5 year. The franchise guy is Zion, not Ingram.
I get what your saying, but the fact is Ingram is a 22 year old, All-Star player. In the western conference. There’s only been 8 of those players in the last 10 years.
You absolutely max a guy like Ingram.
hoosierdaddy34 wrote:
He shot well from 3 his last season in LA, he is just doing it now with more volume. I think what he meant to say was what he is doing now is on par with the trajectory of growth he had already been displaying. His only blip in the road was the first part of the season learning to play with LeBron, but by January he was back on track with increased numbers across the board.
lordjeff05 wrote:hoosierdaddy34 wrote:
He shot well from 3 his last season in LA, he is just doing it now with more volume. I think what he meant to say was what he is doing now is on par with the trajectory of growth he had already been displaying. His only blip in the road was the first part of the season learning to play with LeBron, but by January he was back on track with increased numbers across the board.
Yeah and I disagree with that. I think he displayed the trajectory of a good player last year but not in the way he is now. What I mean is that it shouldn’t be a surprise that Ingram is averaging 20 plus points a game, especially with Zion out, but his game looked like it was made to be more ball dominant/ball stopperish than what he’s shown this year. Think LeBron, Kawhi, Derozan. All of those are good players and two are mvps but none of them are what you’d call complimentary players. They have to be the guy on their team otherwise it doesn’t really work.
That was always going to be a problem with a guy like Zion coming in to the mix. BI isn’t going to be the focal point and prior to this year it was an open question of whether he could score in that scenario.
BI’s numbers have gone down a little bit but I think that has more to do with the fact that we only have one floor spacing big to pair with him and Zion (Melli). Having Favors out there kills spacing even though it helps the defense. The best way to maximize Ingram and Zion is to pair them with a rim protecting floor spacing big, which is why I’m so high on a guy like Mo Bamba.
iamworthy wrote:Duke4life831 wrote:iamworthy wrote:
Ben Simmons is understandable. I wouldn't have given murray 5 years. Just because another franchise makes bad decisions doesn't mean you have to. If I'm the pels I would have like to see Ingram and Zion together for a year. Zion is the market, and honestly, Ingram is better than lonzo but if lonzo clicks better with Zion then what.
Then they sign Lonzo as well. They can afford all 3, especially with Lonzo not going to be a max player. Plus it's much easier to replace Lonzo than it is Ingram. You're not going to find too many wing players to plug along Zion that can shoot 3s at a high rate and efficiency, can create for himself in the half-court, facilitates, and is a very low usage player when it comes to time with the ball.
Lonzo, BI, and Zion aren't winning anything important in the NBA. Lonzo will have a bigger impact with Zion just because he's always looking to get his teammates involved. I also need to see another year of Ingram shooting the 3 to become a believer. What did BI average when Zion played?
I concur.Trey24 wrote:I think that while Ingram may not be a max player right now, teams need to bet on his future. I'm a huge fan of his. It would surprise me if he wasn't tendered a max offer in October
lordjeff05 wrote:Yeah...this is just factually incorrect. The way he shoots and where he shoots is different.
hoosierdaddy34 wrote:lordjeff05 wrote:hoosierdaddy34 wrote:
He shot well from 3 his last season in LA, he is just doing it now with more volume. I think what he meant to say was what he is doing now is on par with the trajectory of growth he had already been displaying. His only blip in the road was the first part of the season learning to play with LeBron, but by January he was back on track with increased numbers across the board.
Yeah and I disagree with that. I think he displayed the trajectory of a good player last year but not in the way he is now. What I mean is that it shouldn’t be a surprise that Ingram is averaging 20 plus points a game, especially with Zion out, but his game looked like it was made to be more ball dominant/ball stopperish than what he’s shown this year. Think LeBron, Kawhi, Derozan. All of those are good players and two are mvps but none of them are what you’d call complimentary players. They have to be the guy on their team otherwise it doesn’t really work.
That was always going to be a problem with a guy like Zion coming in to the mix. BI isn’t going to be the focal point and prior to this year it was an open question of whether he could score in that scenario.
BI’s numbers have gone down a little bit but I think that has more to do with the fact that we only have one floor spacing big to pair with him and Zion (Melli). Having Favors out there kills spacing even though it helps the defense. The best way to maximize Ingram and Zion is to pair them with a rim protecting floor spacing big, which is why I’m so high on a guy like Mo Bamba.
It doesn’t really matter what you choose to believe. He averaged 23 pts 5.5 reb 3 ast on 56% FG and 38% from 3 in January, February and March (till he got the blood clots) that season. Those numbers aren’t far off the 24-6-4 he did this season.
If you don’t believe me, this was what was being said about his performance at the end of the year.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sbnation.com/platform/amp/nba/2019/3/4/18247830/brandon-ingram-lakers-stats-highlights-breakdown
The fit will be determined how much success the team has. I doubt Zion or the NBA will want him staying if New Orleans doesn't become a serious contender during the short term. Time will tell.Bologna Smasher wrote:Ingram is an easy max for a team like the Pelicans. He's a good fit next to Zion and he's going to be even better than he already is sooner than later.
I really wanted the Kings to grab him when the Lakers/Cousins trade rumors were going on. If the rumors were true, think we dropped the ball again. At least we weren't the only ones, Spurs apparently didn't want him for Kawhi either.
HMFFL wrote:I concur.Trey24 wrote:I think that while Ingram may not be a max player right now, teams need to bet on his future. I'm a huge fan of his. It would surprise me if he wasn't tendered a max offer in October
In addition to what you said, New Orleans must back his future, because the last thing they need to do is subtract talent away from Zion.
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