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After Kobe busted his achilles, was that in 2012 or 2013?

yeah 2007.

I feel like Kobe's "swagger", image and playing for the LA Lakers has benefited him more than any other player in history. Players always mention him right below Jordan and most casual fans think the same. It's kinda crazy to me seeing how Jordan and LeBron imo have such a wide gap between themselves and Kobe but the image is he's in the conversation for GOAT. Kobe was always very mindful of his image and I think it has served his legacy very well.

This is like the Jordan case. He was already the best player in the NBA around '87, definitely '88 but most are hesitant to call him that because of the lack of playoff success as well as Magic still winning championships.

Lebron was already at Kobe's level or higher way earlier but with Kobe winning championships in 2009 and 2010, it delayed the anointing of Lebron as the best player even when he won MVP those 2 years.

Lebron elevated to a level Kobe had never reached in that 2007 game against Detroit. However I wasn't willing to announce him as better than Kobe yet, because I was a little stubborn about it, and I only make that evaluation given a full year.

By 2008 I basically assumes he was/will obviously be.

2009 closed the case and I started to think he was going to be a GOAT candidate someday. Guess that turned out alright.

2007

05-06

Dupp wrote:2008 he was on Kobe’s level, but worse. 2009 he was better.

Basically, this.

Bertrob wrote:2007. Lebron actually had a weird start to his career in 05 and 06. He was really good but weirdly not as impactful as his stats. But if someone argued for 2006 I wouldn't fight very hard

Personally I think its hard to add as many wins as he did to the **** roster he came into the league with and try to say his impact wasn't equaling his stats. His team went from the very bottom of the league to a playoff team within two years without any major fa signings. The only decent players that really got added were Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden and LeBron. Yet they go from 17 wins to 50 wins within 3 years. To answer the question LeBron was definitely in Kobe's tier by year 3 when he came in second in mvp voting. That should just be a no brainer. Clearly better by 09.

Dnt hate wrote:

lakerz12 wrote:Well LeBron felt Kobe was the best player in the world in 2009...but what does he know?

Watch on YouTube

Hes obviously being kind/humble that's a bad argument

It actually isn't when you think about it. What overwhelming physical or athletic advantage did Kobe have? Yes Kobe was very athletic in his prime but it was nowhere near top 10 imo.

definitely on the same level by 06. But i thought kobe was better in 07 and 08 and Lebron reached a GOAT level in 09

2008

2008 for me as well. I still would have taken Kobe but that's the year I knew Lebron would eventually own the league.

Cavsfansince84 wrote:

Bertrob wrote:2007. Lebron actually had a weird start to his career in 05 and 06. He was really good but weirdly not as impactful as his stats. But if someone argued for 2006 I wouldn't fight very hard

Personally I think its hard to add as many wins as he did to the **** roster he came into the league with and try to say his impact wasn't equaling his stats. His team went from the very bottom of the league to a playoff team within two years without any major fa signings. The only decent players that really got added were Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden and LeBron. Yet they go from 17 wins to 50 wins within 3 years. To answer the question LeBron was definitely in Kobe's tier by year 3 when he came in second in mvp voting. That should just be a no brainer. Clearly better by 09.

That had to be maybe the trashest team any star had to play with. Some say his Cleveland teams always sucked but in reality they were just like Iversons teams. Good defenders and smart players with a true superstar. But this team he came in with wasn't even that. Total trash.

_Game7_ wrote:2007, Kobe was never on that level, check the stats, check the carry job.

Depends, some of us dont think being a great floor raiser means you are the best, since you cant really win a title by doing so. If you could, he probably wouldnt have left cleveland in the first place

ill say 2011. they both had similar rosters, both played about as well as each other, They both lost to the same team in a similar fashion. only seems right. id listen to arguments about 09 lebron, when he quit against boston reminded me a lot of the game kobe stopped shooting.

LBJ has been the best player in the league since 2008

Not to be an ass, but it's not like Kobe was the best player in the league at any point in his career. It's just weird to consider that as a rite of passage when there were other players Lebron also had to surpass. Like Kobe was obviously a great player, and he was probably better than Lebron until James grew into his own. But that's true of Duncan, Dirk, KG, Pierce, Shaq and so many others.

It's just really weird to draw comparisons or make a fake rivalry between the two. ESPN used to do that with the muppets back in the day, and it didn't make sense outside of marketing then either. Now that Kobe's legacy has ended and Lebron's is wrapping up, it makes less sense to do it.

If we're talking too players list for specific times?
I'd say 2010, his last year in Cleveland before Miami is when I realized he was better but just didn't have the help needed.

Legacy wise? All time rankings?
He didn't pass Kobe till he won a championship with Cleveland.

Pelly24 wrote:LeBron was obviously a better player, but in what season did he become as good as Kobe?

Was it 2005-2006? 2007-2008? or was it not until 2010?

In the regular season many can pick a season.

I think the 2011 Finals show LeBron wasn’t ready to be a champion until 2012.

That’s when LeBron started being more of a post up bully. He was pissed. And it was awesome. I remember LeBron listening to Eminem I am what you say I am before that big play-off game with the Celtics. And he played with that mentality.

It was the first time you could tell LeBron was in that mental place where he would not be denied. He was done caring what people thought. Done doing stupid stuff like he did making fun of Dirk being sick in 2011. Done obsessing with his image and wanting people to like him like those comments he made after losing the 2011 Finals. About how people that aren’t LeBron fans can go back to their bad lives tomorrow.

LeBron was completely about the business/mindset of winning. Didn’t care what people thought anymore. He had matured past all that.

In 2012 that game was Real NBA Finals. The hardest game LeBron had to win. A few weeks later LeBron was a champion. And you could tell from then on out LeBron was a different player.

20never...Kobe>Lebron

Vampirate wrote:

Dnt hate wrote:

lakerz12 wrote:Well LeBron felt Kobe was the best player in the world in 2009...but what does he know?

Watch on YouTube

Hes obviously being kind/humble that's a bad argument

It actually isn't when you think about it. What overwhelming physical or athletic advantage did Kobe have? Yes Kobe was very athletic in his prime but it was nowhere near top 10 imo.

LeBron was being honest which I respect. LeBron says he’s not as good as Kobe in 2009.

LeBron says the skill set which is one of the greatest all-time is what sets them apart. But he also said he is working on improving. As a fan I saw a mental approach being the big difference. In 2011 LeBron wasn’t quite there mentally because he cared sooo much about the Heat backlash and did things like make fun of Dirk and shrink in the 2011 Finals that prevented him from being a champion in 2011. But in 2012 he had overcome that. So it’s got to be in the 2012 play-offs right when LeBron caught Kobe? Or 2013 when he did what Kobe did with back to back Finals MVPs.