Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry

Moderators: GeorgeMarcus, ken6199, Domejandro, KingDavid, BombsquadSammy, jamaalstar21, zimpy27, Prez, infinite11285, bwgood77, Dirk

User avatar
phanman
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,651
And1: 4,447
Joined: Mar 18, 2016

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#161 » by phanman » Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:53 pm

Floody100 wrote:
HeartDonor wrote:ones coming off leading his team to a championship


This is absurd. You guys don’t make it out of the second round if you don’t do the Derozan/Kawhi trade. He helped you guys win a championship but he definitely didn’t “lead” your team to a championship.

What is absurd is that you fail to do some simple research and see that we made it to the ECF in 2016. Both of our teams have only lost to the LeBron's Cavs prior to the last season.
Image
Courtesy of: Clutch0z24
HeartBreakKid
RealGM
Posts: 16,512
And1: 11,960
Joined: Mar 08, 2012
     

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#162 » by HeartBreakKid » Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:58 pm

phanman wrote:
Floody100 wrote:
HeartDonor wrote:ones coming off leading his team to a championship


This is absurd. You guys don’t make it out of the second round if you don’t do the Derozan/Kawhi trade. He helped you guys win a championship but he definitely didn’t “lead” your team to a championship.

What is absurd is that you fail to do some simple research and see that we made it to the ECF in 2016. Both of our teams have only lost to the LeBron's Cavs prior to the last season.


Making the ECF 4 years ago isn't the same thing as winning a championship...not even close really. There is a really big difference between having Kawhi Leonard and not - and allocating the credit to Kyle Lowry seems bizarre. Not saying they would get eliminated in the second round in 2019 (it's possible for sure, no LBJ but more solid teams in the East in 2019 than 2016) - but HeartDonor's argument is way, way more absurd.
Floody100
Rookie
Posts: 1,032
And1: 912
Joined: Oct 21, 2018
 

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#163 » by Floody100 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:14 pm

phanman wrote:
Floody100 wrote:
HeartDonor wrote:ones coming off leading his team to a championship


This is absurd. You guys don’t make it out of the second round if you don’t do the Derozan/Kawhi trade. He helped you guys win a championship but he definitely didn’t “lead” your team to a championship.

What is absurd is that you fail to do some simple research and see that we made it to the ECF in 2016. Both of our teams have only lost to the LeBron's Cavs prior to the last season.


I’m not talking about 4 years ago. Philly would’ve comfortably beaten you guys last year if you still had Derozan.
User avatar
Duffman100
Forum Mod - Raptors
Forum Mod - Raptors
Posts: 23,604
And1: 27,523
Joined: Jun 27, 2002
   

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#164 » by Duffman100 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:19 pm

Floody100 wrote:
phanman wrote:
Floody100 wrote:
This is absurd. You guys don’t make it out of the second round if you don’t do the Derozan/Kawhi trade. He helped you guys win a championship but he definitely didn’t “lead” your team to a championship.

What is absurd is that you fail to do some simple research and see that we made it to the ECF in 2016. Both of our teams have only lost to the LeBron's Cavs prior to the last season.


I’m not talking about 4 years ago. Philly would’ve comfortably beaten you guys last year if you still had Derozan.


Sure. We don't have DeRozan now.

Which is a positive...
GiannisAnte34
Pro Prospect
Posts: 922
And1: 544
Joined: Jun 19, 2019
 

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#165 » by GiannisAnte34 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:19 pm

Personally I think Boston beats Toronto in the 2nd round, Lowry will crack under the pressure without Kawhi to fall back on and teams have figured out the Siakam spin move.
aguiar95
Sophomore
Posts: 145
And1: 44
Joined: Mar 10, 2020
     

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#166 » by aguiar95 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:25 pm

mademan wrote:
Lol. Lowry was consistently better than Derozan. Every impact stat ever generated puts Lowry as extremely valuable and Derozan as near negative value (and negative some years). Lowry was the best player on a 59 win team


Lowry had the better season, but he was NOT the better player.
User avatar
Duffman100
Forum Mod - Raptors
Forum Mod - Raptors
Posts: 23,604
And1: 27,523
Joined: Jun 27, 2002
   

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#167 » by Duffman100 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:27 pm

aguiar95 wrote:
mademan wrote:
Lol. Lowry was consistently better than Derozan. Every impact stat ever generated puts Lowry as extremely valuable and Derozan as near negative value (and negative some years). Lowry was the best player on a 59 win team


Lowry had the better season, but he was NOT the better player.


Lowry was far and away the better player than DeRozan.
User avatar
SFour
RealGM
Posts: 26,459
And1: 41,115
Joined: Apr 07, 2012
   

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#168 » by SFour » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:31 pm

Duffman100 wrote:
aguiar95 wrote:
mademan wrote:
Lol. Lowry was consistently better than Derozan. Every impact stat ever generated puts Lowry as extremely valuable and Derozan as near negative value (and negative some years). Lowry was the best player on a 59 win team


Lowry had the better season, but he was NOT the better player.


Lowry was far and away the better player than DeRozan.


some people just look at PPG and think the player with the higher PPG is the better player :lol:
Image
mademan
RealGM
Posts: 17,512
And1: 14,705
Joined: Feb 18, 2010

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#169 » by mademan » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:36 pm

aguiar95 wrote:
mademan wrote:
Lol. Lowry was consistently better than Derozan. Every impact stat ever generated puts Lowry as extremely valuable and Derozan as near negative value (and negative some years). Lowry was the best player on a 59 win team


Lowry had the better season, but he was NOT the better player.


Lowry had a better season than Derozan every year they were on the same team. At what point is he the better player, lol?
Curmudgeon
RealGM
Posts: 29,190
And1: 10,393
Joined: Jan 20, 2004
Location: Boston, MA

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#170 » by Curmudgeon » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:40 pm

LOL, as for Kemba vs Kyle, we will find out in about 5 weeks.
"Numbers lie alot. Wins and losses don't lie." - Jerry West
"You are what your record says you are."- Bill Parcells
"Offense sells tickets. Defense wins games. Rebounding wins championships." Pat Summit
User avatar
phanman
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,651
And1: 4,447
Joined: Mar 18, 2016

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#171 » by phanman » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:40 pm

Floody100 wrote:
phanman wrote:
Floody100 wrote:
This is absurd. You guys don’t make it out of the second round if you don’t do the Derozan/Kawhi trade. He helped you guys win a championship but he definitely didn’t “lead” your team to a championship.

What is absurd is that you fail to do some simple research and see that we made it to the ECF in 2016. Both of our teams have only lost to the LeBron's Cavs prior to the last season.


I’m not talking about 4 years ago. Philly would’ve comfortably beaten you guys last year if you still had Derozan.

Considering it took a last minute game winner by Kawhi that is probably true. I reread your post and thought you meant something totally different so that's my fault.

He didn't lead the team in the traditional sense of being the best player on the team but he was the de-facto leader of our team. It is easy to point at his relatively lackluster averages to argue the point but he had to make the biggest adjustment for the team implementing so many new guys along with the emergence of Pascal.
Image
Courtesy of: Clutch0z24
ATLTimekeeper
RealGM
Posts: 28,196
And1: 12,891
Joined: Apr 28, 2008

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#172 » by ATLTimekeeper » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:49 pm

Kemba just doesn't have the body-type to defend like Lowry can. Lowry is a fire hydrant, Kemba is a sprinkler. That's not a knock on Kemba, I've been a big fan since his UConn days, he's just a different type of guard.
docholliday99
Freshman
Posts: 55
And1: 29
Joined: Apr 15, 2019

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#173 » by docholliday99 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:59 pm

Clay Davis wrote:
docholliday99 wrote:
Clay Davis wrote:
Do you have iso statistics


I'm not the one trying to prove a point - I know how he got his points but do you?

You are indeed the one trying to prove a point, as you're the one who originally claimed that Boston has three better creators than Powell. If that original point could not stand up to a more distant statistic (TS%), then you must either have a more representative statistic up your sleeve or not have one at all, in which case your claim was made without anything to back-up your point and has less evidence behind it than mine.


Boston does have 3 better creators than Powell, that's one of the reasons Brown is on a 4/107, why Hayward is on a max and why Tatum will get the max. Powell won't come close to these numbers as he needs others to create his shot for him. For instance, Powell had 78% of his shots assisted this year (that alone is enough to show he's not a creator); of all his shots taken (especially on his scoring tear), 60% were jump shots with 86% of those assisted; 34% of his shots were in close with 68% assisted; and 6% of his shots were dunks with 74% of those assisted. This isn't a bad thing, Powell is just not a creator and that's ok - I love Powell on the Raptors and he makes a fantastic 6th-7th man. I even like him as a starting 2 when his shot is falling, with FVV off the bench (for now anyways). What I shouldn't have said is that he's an iso player (I used the wrong word there and that's my bad), he's not cause he can't create for himself well.
docholliday99
Freshman
Posts: 55
And1: 29
Joined: Apr 15, 2019

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#174 » by docholliday99 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:21 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:Kemba just doesn't have the body-type to defend like Lowry can. Lowry is a fire hydrant, Kemba is a sprinkler. That's not a knock on Kemba, I've been a big fan since his UConn days, he's just a different type of guard.


Kyle is one of the few guards that I've seen that can handle a switch onto a 4 or 5. His defense is ridiculous for a 6' player, guarding 1 - 5, rebounding deep into the paint amongst the giants and all those charges taken...love Lowry.
docholliday99
Freshman
Posts: 55
And1: 29
Joined: Apr 15, 2019

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#175 » by docholliday99 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:25 pm

Curmudgeon wrote:LOL, as for Kemba vs Kyle, we will find out in about 5 weeks.




I don't think it will matter imo, if the standings stay the way they are going into the playoffs, I don't see Boston getting past Philly.
User avatar
LoveMyRaps
RealGM
Posts: 10,598
And1: 19,053
Joined: Jun 10, 2013
       

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#176 » by LoveMyRaps » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:05 pm

docholliday99 wrote:
Curmudgeon wrote:LOL, as for Kemba vs Kyle, we will find out in about 5 weeks.




I don't think it will matter imo, if the standings stay the way they are going into the playoffs, I don't see Boston getting past Philly.


The Celtics will smack Philly up. :lol:
In Masai We Trust :meditate:
ImageImage
aguiar95
Sophomore
Posts: 145
And1: 44
Joined: Mar 10, 2020
     

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#177 » by aguiar95 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:07 pm

SFour wrote:
some people just look at PPG and think the player with the higher PPG is the better player :lol:


Some have short memory and gets attached to the guy that won the chip (carried by Kawhi). LOL.
docholliday99
Freshman
Posts: 55
And1: 29
Joined: Apr 15, 2019

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#178 » by docholliday99 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:21 pm

aguiar95 wrote:
SFour wrote:
some people just look at PPG and think the player with the higher PPG is the better player :lol:


Some have short memory and gets attached to the guy that won the chip (carried by Kawhi). LOL.


The same guy that has been the most clutch player in the nba playoffs the last 5 years and capped off the run with a championship?
Been more clutch in the playoffs than Kawhi, Lebron and KD...I'll take Lowry any day to lead a squad.
docholliday99
Freshman
Posts: 55
And1: 29
Joined: Apr 15, 2019

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#179 » by docholliday99 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:33 pm

LoveMyRaps wrote:
docholliday99 wrote:
Curmudgeon wrote:LOL, as for Kemba vs Kyle, we will find out in about 5 weeks.




I don't think it will matter imo, if the standings stay the way they are going into the playoffs, I don't see Boston getting past Philly.


The Celtics will smack Philly up. :lol:


I'd easily drop a C note that Philly would take out Boston in the first round :) . I just see Philly's starting 5 are way more talented and has something Boston doesn't - elite level talent in Embiid and Simmons. Also, there's no one on Boston's roster that can stop Embiid and a highly motivated Horford in the frontcourt - certainly not with Theis or Kanter lol. After last season's heartbreak, I don't see them losing in the first round to Boston.

TBH, as a Raps fan, I'd rather face Boston in the second round than Philly.
The_Hater
RealGM
Posts: 74,148
And1: 27,827
Joined: May 23, 2001
     

Re: Kemba Walker or Kyle Lowry 

Post#180 » by The_Hater » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:43 pm

Jcool0 wrote:Kemba is clearly the better player. But Toronto fans are loyal so this thread exists.


Or maybe you’re just not as smart as you think you are.
AthensBucks wrote:Lowry is done.
Nurse is below average at best.
Masai is overrated.
I dont get how so many people believe in the raptors,they have zero to chance to win it all.


April 14th, 2019.

Return to The General Board