Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3...

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Patches Perry
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#21 » by Patches Perry » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:47 pm

Assuming all other future circumstances to be the same (which is the only fair way to hypothesize a counterfactual), I think 2014 would have been a very strong year for them. The rest of the years they probably don't win due to injuries or matchups.

2013- Westbrook hurt
2014- All or mostly healthy, could have overcome Spurs and won title
2015- Durant hurt
2016- Not sure Harden swings the matchups in their favor against GSW or SAS

The "they would have won 5 titles had they stayed together" kind of talk ignores the reality of how championships are won.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#22 » by BallerTalk » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:17 pm

Harden arrived in 2009 and here's what immediately followed:

Year One - They jumped from a 23 win lottery team to a 50 win playoff squad
Year Two - 55 wins and playoff run to the Western Conference Finals
Year Three - 58 win (pace) a trip to the NBA Finals

Then just like that it was over as ownership cheapened out forcing the infamous Harden trade.

So, while nothing is guaranteed, the trend and trajectory of that squad seems pretty clear.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#23 » by yitur » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:00 pm

Saints14 wrote:
yitur wrote:
Saints14 wrote:I still think they could have won in 2013-2015 if not for untimely injuries


I love it when LeBron's teammates gets injured he doesn't have any help, but when other teams get injured they didn't have any chance anyway. Love the consistency.


I didn't say anything about LeBron


I didn't say you did. I just agreed with you :roll:
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#24 » by Heej » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:02 pm

Westbrook
Harden
Sefolosha
KD
Ibaka

Would be the best closing lineup in the league every year lol. C'mon man.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#25 » by Saints14 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:04 pm

yitur wrote:
Saints14 wrote:
yitur wrote:
I love it when LeBron's teammates gets injured he doesn't have any help, but when other teams get injured they didn't have any chance anyway. Love the consistency.


I didn't say anything about LeBron


I didn't say you did. I just agreed with you :roll:


Ah my bad, misread your comment
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#26 » by SF_Warriors » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:05 pm

I think they would have. They made the finals as 23 year olds. They knocked out 2x champs Kobe/Gasol lakers, former 3x and future champion spurs and also the defending champ mavericks to do it.

That's about as impressive as a playoff run without actually winning it all as you can get.

Now imagine them doing the same thing for the next ten years. There's people out there that really don't think they would have won it all at some point? Harden was leading teams to 55 wins by himself for chrissake.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#27 » by Metallikid » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:25 pm

What you fail to realize here is that it's very likely if they had been smart enough to retain Harden over Ibaka it would have been OKC along with Miami/Golden State in pioneering small ball death lineups and they likely would have won a title by 2016 doing so. Not to mention I kind of think if they had stayed together Iguodala would have ended up there instead.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#28 » by Metallikid » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:27 pm

SF_Warriors wrote:I think they would have. They made the finals as 23 year olds. They knocked out 2x champs Kobe/Gasol lakers, former 3x and future champion spurs and also the defending champ mavericks to do it.

That's about as impressive as a playoff run without actually winning it all as you can get.

Now imagine them doing the same thing for the next ten years. There's people out there that really don't think they would have won it all at some point? Harden was leading teams to 55 wins by himself for chrissake.


I agree it is the most impressive Finals appearance without winning. They defeated the three prior Western Conference Champions. If they had won that year they would have defeated the best player from every Championship team from 2006 until then with the exception of Garnett who was himself beaten by Miami that year. (Wade, Duncan, Kobe, Dirk and LeBron)
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#29 » by mr570 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:04 pm

Metallikid wrote:What you fail to realize here is that it's very likely if they had been smart enough to retain Harden over Ibaka it would have been OKC along with Miami/Golden State in pioneering small ball death lineups and they likely would have won a title by 2016 doing so. Not to mention I kind of think if they had stayed together Iguodala would have ended up there instead.

I don't think they would have done that though.

Scott Brooks was not a very innovative coach. He was a good developmental coach. But not good for the playoffs or exploiting matchups in the playoffs.

Billy Donovan played maybe 4 minutes combined of small ball against the Rockets, in freaking 2020 when we know the advantages/disadvantages of small ball and against THE ROCKETS WHO ONLY PLAY SMALL BALL!!!!!!!!!, and used Steven Adams and Nerlends Noel almost exclusively over the entire series.

So this just wasn't going to happen.
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#30 » by TinmanZBoy » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:13 pm

timO wrote:They almost win without harden, major injuries, gsw 3-1 lead, the Spurs champs (with ibaka injury) etc

so with him, for sure, the rockets dont make playoffs in 2013, so Russ dont get injured etc

i say 2/3 chips for sure without all this things, and the infamous trade


yes, Patrick Beverley single handedly ruined OKC's chances...
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#31 » by TinmanZBoy » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:16 pm

SF_Warriors wrote:I think they would have. They made the finals as 23 year olds. They knocked out 2x champs Kobe/Gasol lakers, former 3x and future champion spurs and also the defending champ mavericks to do it.

That's about as impressive as a playoff run without actually winning it all as you can get.

Now imagine them doing the same thing for the next ten years. There's people out there that really don't think they would have won it all at some point? Harden was leading teams to 55 wins by himself for chrissake.


i remember by then the knock on them was they were essentially a jump shooting team which could not win champs... the old adage dies hard... nowadays every team more or less could be called jump shooting team...
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Re: Just a thought re: OKC's OG Big 3... 

Post#32 » by Metallikid » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:18 pm

mr570 wrote:
Metallikid wrote:What you fail to realize here is that it's very likely if they had been smart enough to retain Harden over Ibaka it would have been OKC along with Miami/Golden State in pioneering small ball death lineups and they likely would have won a title by 2016 doing so. Not to mention I kind of think if they had stayed together Iguodala would have ended up there instead.

I don't think they would have done that though.

Scott Brooks was not a very innovative coach. He was a good developmental coach. But not good for the playoffs or exploiting matchups in the playoffs.

Billy Donovan played maybe 4 minutes combined of small ball against the Rockets, in freaking 2020 when we know the advantages/disadvantages of small ball and against THE ROCKETS WHO ONLY PLAY SMALL BALL!!!!!!!!!, and used Steven Adams and Nerlends Noel almost exclusively over the entire series.

So this just wasn't going to happen.


Scott Brooks isn't the greatest coach but I think it's not unreasonable to say he would have tried it and been successful had they kept Harden over Ibaka. I personally think Brooks is better than Donovan so I'm not going to defend him. I mean, at the end of a Game 7 the shot he got was Steven Adams at the top of the key.
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