Updated best young cores

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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#41 » by NY 567 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:39 pm

Sharkboy242 wrote:
NY 567 wrote:
Mickey8 wrote:The Nuggets are playing Conference finals, Luka is getting fat somwhere on the private yacht , Denver is improving every year, Jokic is difference maker as well , he's not that inferior to Luka, Luka is just more selfish player on the offense.

Mavs took the Clipps to 6 despite a bogus KP ejection in a game they could have easily won, Luka on 1 leg, and KP missing most of the series. They had a real chance to win that series in 6, maybe even 5 if they were healthy.

Hey guys

Mavs with KP woulda beat the Clipps in 5 or 6. :lol:

Just because you say things, doesn't make them true.


Obviously I can't say with 100% certainty, but there is a very high probability.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#42 » by beeshma » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:40 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
beeshma wrote:I think young core should be reserved for teams that are not in the playoffs.

When a team like the Celtics tries to say they also have the best young core, that is like having your cake and eating it too. Make up your mind...is your team a legit title contender, or are they the best young core? I think it's a clear signal of Celtics insecurity that they want to claim they are both.

If your team is a title contender, then why do you need to make yourselves feel better by dreaming of how you have the best young core? That is a term reserved for daydreaming fans whose team are on the outside.


I disagree. Them being in the playoffs is just a testament to their players. They are already so good and likely to remain good due to their youth.


I modified my post, removed the Celtic attack, and clarified my criteria.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#43 » by beeshma » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:41 pm

Sharkboy242 wrote:
beeshma wrote:I think young core should be reserved for teams that are not in the playoffs.

When a team like the Celtics tries to say they also have the best young core, that is like having your cake and eating it too. Make up your mind...is your team a legit title contender, or are they the best young core? I think it's a clear signal of Celtics insecurity that they want to claim they are both.

If your team is a title contender, then why do you need to make yourselves feel better by dreaming of how you have the best young core? That is a term reserved for daydreaming fans whose team are on the outside.

Title contender and young core aren't mutually exclusive so I don't see the point of your post.



I modified my post, removed the Celtic attack, and clarified my criteria.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#44 » by Sharkboy242 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:42 pm

NY 567 wrote:
Sharkboy242 wrote:
NY 567 wrote:Mavs took the Clipps to 6 despite a bogus KP ejection in a game they could have easily won, Luka on 1 leg, and KP missing most of the series. They had a real chance to win that series in 6, maybe even 5 if they were healthy.

Hey guys

Mavs with KP woulda beat the Clipps in 5 or 6. :lol:

Just because you say things, doesn't make them true.


Obviously I can't say with 100% certainty, but there is a very high probability.

No.

The Clippers were heavily favored even with a healthy KP factored in. Extrapolating to a 4-1 and 4-2 Mavs win from 1-1 even series is disingenuous.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#45 » by SeattleJazzFan » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:45 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
SeattleJazzFan wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.


it's a good list, but as you admitted you need Memphis in there at about 5. Mavericks are too high with just Doncic and Porizingis as a potential all-star. just two dudes (where all the others have 3-5 guys) with only one being a legit star already. Also, Bridges - potential starter - he is a starter already and plays huge minutes. he might have remote all-star potential as a top 3 and D guy in the entire league.

otherwise good thread and good post.


I would argue 1 player at an MVP level like Luka is worth 2 shots at allstars. Tatum and Jokic are definitely close but i would still have Luka higher.


you are probably right.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#46 » by NY 567 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:46 pm

Sharkboy242 wrote:
NY 567 wrote:
Sharkboy242 wrote:Hey guys

Mavs with KP woulda beat the Clipps in 5 or 6. :lol:

Just because you say things, doesn't make them true.


Obviously I can't say with 100% certainty, but there is a very high probability.

No.

The Clippers were heavily favored even with a healthy KP factored in. Extrapolating to a 4-1 and 4-2 Mavs win from 1-1 even series is disingenuous.


What does heavily favored have to do with anything? The Clippers were heavily favored to beat the Nuggets, and look how that turned out. KP got tossed in a game the Mavs barely lost, fact. Luka was playing with a bad injury for half the series, fact. KP missed most of the series, fact. And it still went 6 with the Mavs making a very big run at the end of game 6 and making it close. It's not crazy to think that if KP doesn't get a bogus ejection and if Luka and KP are healthy they win that series.

Do you honestly think the Nuggets would have beat the Clippers if Jokic was hurt and if Murray missed most of the series? The Mavs injuries absolutely impacted the way that series played out.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#47 » by kenwood3333 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:48 pm

What is the age cut off here? Jokic is 25, so is Giannis.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#48 » by Jadoogar » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:48 pm

SeattleJazzFan wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
SeattleJazzFan wrote:
it's a good list, but as you admitted you need Memphis in there at about 5. Mavericks are too high with just Doncic and Porizingis as a potential all-star. just two dudes (where all the others have 3-5 guys) with only one being a legit star already. Also, Bridges - potential starter - he is a starter already and plays huge minutes. he might have remote all-star potential as a top 3 and D guy in the entire league.

otherwise good thread and good post.


I would argue 1 player at an MVP level like Luka is worth 2 shots at allstars. Tatum and Jokic are definitely close but i would still have Luka higher.


you are probably right.


lol you're too nice, it's very disorienting on this board.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#49 » by Jadoogar » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:49 pm

kenwood3333 wrote:What is the age cut off here? Jokic is 25, so is Giannis.


I said 25. I didn't include Jazz or Philly since they only had 1 player that fit the criteria. Same for Bucks.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#50 » by celticfan42487 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:54 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
kenwood3333 wrote:What is the age cut off here? Jokic is 25, so is Giannis.


I said 25. I didn't include Jazz or Philly since they only had 1 player that fit the criteria. Same for Bucks.


I think when that one player for the Bucks is the back to back MVP, as well as current DPOY

Ummm that alone is arguable #1 overall.

That's all you need.

Finding supporting casts is important but much easier.

Worst comes to worst you can sell out your future for a disgruntled #2 to put beside that kind of talent.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#51 » by Sharkboy242 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:57 pm

NY 567 wrote:
Sharkboy242 wrote:
NY 567 wrote:
Obviously I can't say with 100% certainty, but there is a very high probability.

No.

The Clippers were heavily favored even with a healthy KP factored in. Extrapolating to a 4-1 and 4-2 Mavs win from 1-1 even series is disingenuous.


What does heavily favored have to do with anything? The Clippers were heavily favored to beat the Nuggets, and look how that turned out. KP got tossed in a game the Mavs barely lost, fact. Luka was playing with a bad injury for half the series, fact. KP missed most of the series, fact. And it still went 6 with the Mavs making a very big run at the end of game 6 and making it close. It's not crazy to think that if KP doesn't get a bogus ejection and if Luka and KP are healthy they win that series.

Do you honestly think the Nuggets would have beat the Clippers if Jokic was hurt and if Murray missed most of the series? The Mavs injuries absolutely impacted the way that series played out.

At best the Mavs stand a better chance but that doesn't make them the favorites. You're delusional if you think so.

The Mavs gave up 130 points to the Clippers for three games and never held them to below 110 once.

Meanwhile the Nuggets held the Clippers to 105 or less in FIVE games.

You guys just want to build the narrative that Denver's game didn't down the clippers and it was all self inflicted. Is KP going to solve Dallas defensive problems? The Nuggets have been a good defensive team when healthy, yet people continuously cited our overall performance when half the season we've been missing two starters.

Its show and prove, not what if.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#52 » by slickrickstyles » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:16 pm

People are sleeping on the Pacers a bit I think...They have a pretty young core as well
Jeremy Lamb 28
TJ Warren 27
Myles Turner 24
Victor Oladipo 28
Malcolm Brogdon 27
Domantis Sabonis 24

In fact they only have 1 player over 30 and that is Justin Holiday at 31
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#53 » by Jadoogar » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:24 pm

slickrickstyles wrote:People are sleeping on the Pacers a bit I think...They have a pretty young core as well
Jeremy Lamb 28
TJ Warren 27
Myles Turner 24
Victor Oladipo 28
Malcolm Brogdon 27
Domantis Sabonis 24

In fact they only have 1 player over 30 and that is Justin Holiday at 31


based on my criteria, only Turner and Sabonis would qualify. I think easily outside the top 5
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#54 » by Stillwater » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:28 pm

I think the word "core" is being used to casually here.
being a young starter you want to keep doesnt make them a core player.
Most of these rosters have 1 core player and ancillary pieces , some have potenial core players as well but most wont actually
ever become that level of importance to their org or the league.
example: Nuggets are proving to have 2 legit core players in Murray and Joker...
The Suns are an example of 1 core player in Booker with Ayton having that potential only.
I think the best young teams however dont always have mutiple core players they have one franchise player
like Luka or maybe like Tatum if he can get to that level and if lucky 1 core player after that
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#55 » by YourCellarDoor » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:32 pm

Harry Garris wrote:7. Suns - Booker & Ayton are both potential all stars


devin booker is currently an all-star.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#56 » by Lalouie » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:50 pm

what exactly is young. towns is going into his 6th yr
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#57 » by JH5 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:55 pm

Lalouie wrote:what exactly is young. towns is going into his 6th yr


Here, read the first post.

Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#58 » by Bhut Jolokia » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:06 pm

1. Denver Nuggets - Nikola Jokic (MVP), Jamal Murray (All-NBA), Michael Porter Jr (All-Star), Bol Bol (starter)
2. Dallas Mavericks - Luka Doncic (MVP), Kristaps Porzingis (All-NBA), Jalen Brunson (starter)
3. Boston Celtics - Jayson Tatum (All-NBA), Jaylen Brown (All-NBA), Robert Williams (starter)
4. Miami Heat - Bam Adebayo (All-NBA), Tyler Herro (All-Star), Duncan Robinson (All-Star), Kendrick Nunn (starter)
5. New Orleans Pelicans - Zion Williamson (All-NBA), Brandon Ingram (All-NBA), Lonzo Ball (All-Star), Jaxson Hayes (All-Star)
6. Memphis Grizzlies - Ja Morant (All-NBA), Jaren Jackson Jr (All-NBA), Brandon Clarke (All-Star)
7. Phoenix Suns - Devin Booker (All-NBA), DeAndre Ayton (All-NBA), Kelly Oubre (starter), Mikal Bridges (starter)
8. Atlanta Hawks - Trae Young (All-NBA), John Collins (All-Star), Deā€™Andre Hunter (All-Star), Cameron Reddish (starter)
9. Minnesota Timberwolves - Karl-Anthony Towns (All-NBA), DeAngelo Russell (All-Star), #1 pick (All-Star), Malik Beasley (starter), Josh Okogie (starter)
10. Chicago Bulls - Zach Lavine (All-Star), Lauri Markannen (All-Star), Wendell Carter Jr (All-Star), Coby White (All-Star)
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#59 » by Jack Dempsey » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:11 pm

Harry Garris wrote:1. Nuggets - Jokic is already a superstar and just 25. Murray is trending towards one of the best #2 options in the NBA. MPJ just needs reps to figure out how to play team defense and fit into the flow of the game, he's got all star talent.
2. Celtics - Tatum is a superstar like Jokic but not as consistent. I see Brown on about the same level as Murray.
3. Mavericks - On Luka alone. Porzingis is good when healthy but he's had so many injuries already.
4. Pelicans - Zion has the talent to be an all NBA guy like Jokic and Tatum. Ingram's a solid all star.
5. Heat - Bam is already one of the best defenders in the league and improving so quickly on offense, Herro has so much skill and confidence he could be a 20+ppg guy for a long time.
6. Grizzlies - they have 3 guys in Morant, JJJ, and Clarke and a bunch of other solid young role players.
7. Suns - Booker & Ayton are both potential all stars
8. OKC - No star yet but the assets to trade for one and a brilliant GM. SGA, Dort, and Bazley are all good young pieces.
9. Timberwolves - KAT has to improve on defense. Same for Russell. #1 pick this year is worth something.
10. Hawks - Trae Young and Collins are talented but I don't know how this team gets good enough on defense to win.

I have the Pels below Miami and Memphis. Otherwise I'd agree.
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Re: Updated best young cores 

Post#60 » by dakomish23 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:26 pm

Smart turned 26 this year so he just missed the cut. The BOS young core is def top 5 IMO b/c Tatum will be a perennial all nba player.

Having that type of talent in your foundation should vault you toward the top as long as there is at least 1 other all star caliber guy.
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