Michael Jordan is still the GOAT. Lebron has solidified the #2 spot though.

[antonac]

If Lebron 3 peated in Miami he might have a chance but Jordan did it twice that’s the difference regardless
How many players won 3 times in a row twice

How many players lead a team in beating a 70 win team in the finals while 3-1 down?

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The problem with the underdog story of 2016 is it was only made possible by Lebron underachieving all year. He went into that season as the title favorite and proceeded to change everyone's mind by not playing as well as the warriors. People are always trying to change the the pre-durant warriors into a superteam, they weren't, the Cavs were stacked in comparison.

[Uncle Mxy]

MJ will always have the better narrative. His arch enemies in the Bad Boys which he beat en route for the 1st title, his 3peat into retiring because of the murder of his father, his comeback to get another 3peat, all of his HOF rivals etc. Lebron running to a team with healthy salary situation after ruining cap space of the former team by forcing his FO's to sign win-now players that get washed up after a couple of years which basically makes him seem like a parasite, and having a lot of guys on vet min who deserve a much better contract... not a great narrative at all.

Bill Russell's narrative is still the best. His team won 11 of 13 Finals, beat the two teams he'd ever lost in the playoffs to in subsequent playoffs. He never had significant injuries that caused him to miss games (unless you count winning an Olympic medal in the same season as a championship), while playing tons of minutes. He didn't care about his numbers, in an era where his biggest rival was all about the numbers. He was just about winning where it matters, and did that to a level no one else can touch. How many HOFers does Bill Russell have without doing all that winning, without being the ultimate "win" guy? He came off a better college career, too... led his team to two NCAA championships with a mostly-nothing team (apart from KC Jones).

To paraphrase Bird -- everyone is fighting for #2.

[Homer38]

If Lebron 3 peated in Miami he might have a chance but Jordan did it twice that’s the difference regardless
How many players won 3 times in a row twice

How many players lead a team in beating a 70 win team in the finals while 3-1 down?

Sent from my SM-G985F using RealGM mobile app

The problem with the underdog story of 2016 is it was only made possible by Lebron underachieving all year. He went into that season as the title favorite and proceeded to change everyone's mind by not playing as well as the warriors. People are always trying to change the the pre-durant warriors into a superteam, they weren't, the Cavs were stacked in comparison.

No,they had the 3rd best record in the NBA and they had no chance to be in the top 2 since the spurs had 67 wins and the warriors with 73 wins.

It would have been ridiculous for the cavs to burn themselves for nothing

The cavs were huge underdog because the warriors had won 73 wins and LeBron needed a legendary performance to win this finals, offense and defense and he did that!

[dautjazz]

When Jordan became the undisputed best player in the league, he never lost in the Playoffs other than when he came back after leaving the league.

When LeBron became the undisputed best player in the league, he lost multiple times in the finals.

I'm pretty sure MJ was undisputed best player for more than just 6 seasons in his career, if not he's not the GOAT. I would say from atleast 1987-88 he was the undisputed best player in basketball, by 1991 he was already being put into the GOAT convo.

[OdomFan]

Lebron is the goat. Jordan couldnt do these things at 35.

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Couldn't do what things? Jordan led his team in 1998 to his final championship at age 35. All with a Bulls team that had aged and had injuries. What Lebron did last night is nice and all, but it's no where near enough to put him over MJ.

I got Duncan above Lebron as well, and even Kareem has a argument for better overall career.

[Baronious]

Lebron is the goat. Jordan couldnt do these things at 35.

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Couldn't do what things? Jordan led his team in 1998 to his final championship at age 35. All with a Bulls team that had aged and had injuries. What Lebron did last night is nice and all, but it's no where near enough to put him over MJ.

I got Duncan above Lebron as well, and even Kareem has a argument for better overall career.

Even Kareem? At this point, Kareem and Jordan are the only 2 guys that have an argument over LeBron.

Tim Duncan has absolutely no argument over LeBron after this 4th chip.

[OverAndOut]

I could only imagine how many rings LeBron would win being coached by Phil Jackson and having arguably the best all-around player in NBA history in Scottie Pippen to go with Dennis Rodman who is arguably the best defensive player ever.

Anyone with all their brain cells can see that LeBron is superior. LeBron is an absolute cheat code, Shaq like power,with Vince Carter like leaping ability,no one can pass like LeBron in the history of the NBA this guy is rifling 20-25 mph passes end to end and on kick-outs and can finish with the left and right.

Jesus Christ

[dynamic duo]

jordan was great and is a mount rushmore player but lebron james is a walking dynasty and the clear-cut goat. it's not even close anymore.

[OdomFan]

Lebron is the goat. Jordan couldnt do these things at 35.

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Couldn't do what things? Jordan led his team in 1998 to his final championship at age 35. All with a Bulls team that had aged and had injuries. What Lebron did last night is nice and all, but it's no where near enough to put him over MJ.

I got Duncan above Lebron as well, and even Kareem has a argument for better overall career.

Even Kareem? At this point, Kareem and Jordan are the only 2 guys that have an argument over LeBron.

Tim Duncan has absolutely no argument over LeBron after this 4th chip.

He absolutely does have an argument over Lebron. Yall like to go on and on about Lebron beating the Warriors. Well Duncan is the only one that led his Spurs over the Shaq and Kobe Lakers in 1999 and 2003. Plus Duncan won the head to head Finals matchup with Lebron 2-1. Only lost the 1 because he wasn't in the game to attempt to get that rebound that led to Ray Allen sealing the deal in 2013. Disagree all you want, but that's the argument.

[GhosDini]

The thing Lebron fans will slowly have to come to terms with is the fact that this is not a real championship. Sure, it will be called one and recognized as such by the media and NBA. But whenever this goat conversation comes up people arent going to respect this title at least the way they do others.

People say there are no asterisks. People also say not all titles are equal. In the grand scheme of things this just might be the lowest quality championship in NBA history.

[OdomFan]

jordan was great and is a mount rushmore player but lebron james is a walking dynasty and the clear-cut goat. it's not even close anymore.

Lebron is great and is a mount rushmore player, but MJ never got swept nor lost in embarrassing fashion during his prime like Lebron and his Heat did in 2014 to the Spurs. Lebron is the best of right now and nothing more.

[dynamic duo]

lebron has now been the clear-cut best player in the finals 8 times, crazy.

[GhosDini]

jordan was great and is a mount rushmore player but lebron james is a walking dynasty and the clear-cut goat. it's not even close anymore.

Only one of those players ever been part of any of kind of dynasty.

[dynamic duo]

jordan about to drop another doc

[Chandan]

MJ was almost mystical.

[Baronious]

Couldn't do what things? Jordan led his team in 1998 to his final championship at age 35. All with a Bulls team that had aged and had injuries. What Lebron did last night is nice and all, but it's no where near enough to put him over MJ.

I got Duncan above Lebron as well, and even Kareem has a argument for better overall career.

Even Kareem? At this point, Kareem and Jordan are the only 2 guys that have an argument over LeBron.

Tim Duncan has absolutely no argument over LeBron after this 4th chip.

He absolutely does have an argument over Lebron. Yall like to go on and on about Lebron beating the Warriors. Well Duncan is the only one that led his Spurs over the Shaq and Kobe Lakers in 1999 and 2003. Plus Duncan won the head to head Finals matchup with Lebron 2-1. Only lost the 1 because he wasn't in the game to attempt to get that rebound that led to Ray Allen sealing the deal in 2013. Disagree all you want, but that's the argument.

I didn't say a single word about Bron beating the Warriors.. If we're going to nit pick stuff, I can easily say Duncan beat a 22 year old LeBron that had no business being in the finals with that sorry Cleveland team. Your message alone shows Duncan has no argument. You're just coming up with random BS to try to prove your point. It's also funny how you act like Duncan went head to head with Bron and beat him.

Duncan put up 15.4/10/2 in the 2014 finals while Bron put up 28.2/7.8/4. Similar story in 2013 and you have the guts to talk about the Ray Allen shot. Get real....

LeBron has more FMVP, regular season MVP, more all-nba selections, better stats, better longevity, playoff records that will never be broken etc etc. Being up 2-1 with the head to head matchups doesn't give Duncan an argument over Lebron.

Forget about Bron. Duncan doesn't have an argument over Kareem either.

[Karate Diop]

I’ll give credit where credit is due. If he can win a couple of more titles than he has a chance to surpass MJ but it’s hard for me to give someone the ‘GOAT’ status when they’ve lost more finals than they’ve won, especially when the guy he’s trying to pass has never lost a final.

So what you're saying is that if LeBron lost in the first round or missed the playoffs in the years he lost in the finals you'd see his career in a more positive light?

Doesn't that seem a little... Dumb?

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[GhosDini]

I’ll give credit where credit is due. If he can win a couple of more titles than he has a chance to surpass MJ but it’s hard for me to give someone the ‘GOAT’ status when they’ve lost more finals than they’ve won, especially when the guy he’s trying to pass has never lost a final.

So what you're saying is that if LeBron lost in the first round or missed the playoffs in the years he lost in the finals you'd see his career in a more positive light?

Doesn't that seem a little... Dumb?

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Jordan went 6 for 11 in a Bulls uniform. Thats still over 50%.

[Clutch0z24]

If Lebron 3 peated in Miami he might have a chance but Jordan did it twice that’s the difference regardless
How many players won 3 times in a row twice

How many players lead a team in beating a 70 win team in the finals while 3-1 down?

Sent from my SM-G985F using RealGM mobile app

Jordan couldn't beat himself he WAS the 70 win team and He NEVER let a finals series go 7 games ...Jordan was the Monster people couldn't overcome thats the difference

[OdomFan]

Even Kareem? At this point, Kareem and Jordan are the only 2 guys that have an argument over LeBron.

Tim Duncan has absolutely no argument over LeBron after this 4th chip.

He absolutely does have an argument over Lebron. Yall like to go on and on about Lebron beating the Warriors. Well Duncan is the only one that led his Spurs over the Shaq and Kobe Lakers in 1999 and 2003. Plus Duncan won the head to head Finals matchup with Lebron 2-1. Only lost the 1 because he wasn't in the game to attempt to get that rebound that led to Ray Allen sealing the deal in 2013. Disagree all you want, but that's the argument.

I didn't say a single word about Bron beating the Warriors.. If we're going to nit pick stuff, I can easily say Duncan beat a 22 year old LeBron that had no business being in the finals with that sorry Cleveland team. Your message alone shows Duncan has no argument. You're just coming up with random BS to try to prove your point. It's also funny how you act like Duncan went head to head with Bron and beat him.

Duncan put up 15.4/10/2 in the 2014 finals while Bron put up 28.2/7.8/4. Similar story in 2013 and you have the guts to talk about the Ray Allen shot. Get real....

LeBron has more FMVP, regular season MVP, more all-nba selections, better stats, better longevity. Being up 2-1 with the head to head matchups doesn't give Duncan an argument over Lebron.

Forget about Bron. Duncan doesn't have an argument over Kareem either.

How exactly does Lebrons 2007 Cavs have no business in the Finals judging by the weak teams he went against to get to those Finals. A Unprepared Wizards team that lost one of it's core players in Larry Hughes, An aged out Nets team and a Pistons team that no longer had its best Defensive Center Ben Wallace.

Never said you personally said anything about the Warriors, but that's in general what many Lebron fans do bring up when it comes to all time conversations. They'll cling heavily on that fact that Lebron James Led his team back from a 3-1 lead against those gosh darn 73-9 Golden State Warriors. Which I countered by mentioning Duncans argument of ending the Lakers chances of 4 peating, and potentially 5 peating had LA been able to beat them in 1999 or 2003. Got it now? If not that's on you.

Using stats to try to discredit Duncans impact is foolish because anyone who knows Duncans game knows that he was never a stats guy. he led the team by being even more unselfish than Lebron James. Buying into his coaches system unlike Lebron which is another thing he has over Lebron btw. With Lebron there's only 1 major system and that's give him the ball and get out the way. Spo might have gotten Bron to listen more than any other coach, but when it comes down to it it was still majorly Lebron Ball, and guess what? The Duncan led Spurs destroyed that system in 2014 regardless of how you want to spin it. So yeah. Imo Tim Duncan > Lebron James.

Btw Duncan was every bit as elite as Kareem was, and imo definitely a better leader. Every bit as good of an all around player even as far back as their NCAA Careers.