Ratings down across all sports,

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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#61 » by Brofessor24 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:04 pm

Desiderium wrote:I don't think there's anyone that argues Black Live's don't matter, but the stance that the NBA has taken, associating voting for Biden and Black Lives, is completely inaccurate. I think that's what drove a lot of fans who have conservative views away. Rather than working on real issues, the stance that the NBA has taken is vote trump out of office and everything goes back to normal.

I consider myself middle of the road but leaning conservative and this is one of the big reasons why NBA hasn't appealed to me as of late. I still watched though, because i don't wan't politics to come between me and my favorite team. I just wish the NBA would take the same stance, don't let politics come between you and your fans.


Seems to me that you simply disagree with the NBA's political stance.

IMO siding with Biden/BLM was better than the alternative.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#62 » by MotownMadness » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:27 pm

Brofessor24 wrote:
Desiderium wrote:I don't think there's anyone that argues Black Live's don't matter, but the stance that the NBA has taken, associating voting for Biden and Black Lives, is completely inaccurate. I think that's what drove a lot of fans who have conservative views away. Rather than working on real issues, the stance that the NBA has taken is vote trump out of office and everything goes back to normal.

I consider myself middle of the road but leaning conservative and this is one of the big reasons why NBA hasn't appealed to me as of late. I still watched though, because i don't wan't politics to come between me and my favorite team. I just wish the NBA would take the same stance, don't let politics come between you and your fans.


Seems to me that you simply disagree with the NBA's political stance.

IMO siding with Biden/BLM was better than the alternative.

Your opinion is wrong
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#63 » by Brofessor24 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:32 pm

MotownMadness wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
Desiderium wrote:I don't think there's anyone that argues Black Live's don't matter, but the stance that the NBA has taken, associating voting for Biden and Black Lives, is completely inaccurate. I think that's what drove a lot of fans who have conservative views away. Rather than working on real issues, the stance that the NBA has taken is vote trump out of office and everything goes back to normal.

I consider myself middle of the road but leaning conservative and this is one of the big reasons why NBA hasn't appealed to me as of late. I still watched though, because i don't wan't politics to come between me and my favorite team. I just wish the NBA would take the same stance, don't let politics come between you and your fans.


Seems to me that you simply disagree with the NBA's political stance.

IMO siding with Biden/BLM was better than the alternative.

Your opinion is wrong


To me it isn't wrong at all, and you seem misguided.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#64 » by MotownMadness » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:40 pm

Brofessor24 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
Seems to me that you simply disagree with the NBA's political stance.

IMO siding with Biden/BLM was better than the alternative.

Your opinion is wrong

Wrong
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#65 » by Mulhollanddrive » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:41 pm

Sports is a proxy for the human need to battle for survival and tribe.

But we have that more in real life this year.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#66 » by Brofessor24 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:46 pm

MotownMadness wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote: Your opinion is wrong

Wrong


IMO you are wrong.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#67 » by MotownMadness » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:52 pm

Brofessor24 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:

Wrong


IMO you are wrong.

What did I tell you about you and your opinion?
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#68 » by Brofessor24 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:53 pm

MotownMadness wrote:
Brofessor24 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:Wrong


IMO you are wrong.

What did I tell you about you and your opinion?


IMO you are misguided.

However, whatever floats your boat.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#69 » by KqWIN » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:24 pm

I understand why we're talking about ratings, it's how the NBA currently makes it's money...but the real discussion should be how the NBA can monetize digitally. Feels like when we're stressing about ratings we're stressing about something that might not even exist in 10-15 years.

I'm no expert in this field, but I would imagine that the next "TV Deal" is going to be with some kind of streaming service like Netflix or YouTube...maybe both. It will be the digital giants fighting over the NBA, not Networks.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#70 » by trueballer7 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:53 pm

Nobody cares about Lebron's corporate masters stacking the deck in his favor to win easy chips, travelling 5 times a game and spamming uncontested lay ups on 20 year old midgets. Least of all this year with the fake championship tournament. 5 million viewers....NOBODY cares
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#71 » by Duke4life831 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:57 pm

KqWIN wrote:I understand why we're talking about ratings, it's how the NBA currently makes it's money...but the real discussion should be how the NBA can monetize digitally. Feels like when we're stressing about ratings we're stressing about something that might not even exist in 10-15 years.

I'm no expert in this field, but I would imagine that the next "TV Deal" is going to be with some kind of streaming service like Netflix or YouTube...maybe both. It will be the digital giants fighting over the NBA, not Networks.

Yes but that is the thing many people are saying. It's a good chance that it will be a Hulu/Netflix that will be the provider to get the TV rights for the NBA. What many are asking though is, how much will that deal be compared to what they have now. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world ain't going to drop billions of dollars for something that has its championship drawing low numbers in ratings.

Let's say the NBA is still getting around 20 million to watch every finals game, but only 5-7 mil are watching where it can be tracked. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world don't care about the 13 mil that aren't being tracked. They're going to pay for the 5-7 million that they can track and make money on. And that will be a major hit financially for the NBA.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#72 » by xAIRNESSx » Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:02 pm

Like I said before, people want to use the ratings decline to justify whatever narrative they're pushing while ignoring the likelier reason that all sports were happening at the same time and people that would generally cycle through leagues as the sporting seasons changed, had to make choices on what they wanted to watch with their finite time.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#73 » by bisme37 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:19 pm

So there's a new Morning Consult poll that says:

53% of Gen Zers identify as sports fans, compared to 63% of all adults and 69% of millennials.

Gen Zers are half as likely as millennials to watch live sports regularly and twice as likely to never watch.

Esports are more popular among Gen Z than MLB, NASCAR and the NHL, with 35% identifying as fans.


https://morningconsult.com/2020/09/28/gen-z-poll-sports-fandom/

Combine that with the Marist Poll I posted on the 1st page of this thread:

A comparison to a similar Marist Poll conducted in March 2017 shows an overall decline in Americans who consider themselves fans of specific professional sports leagues. Self-described NFL fans fell from 67% at that time to 52% currently. The proportion of baseball fans fell from 51% in March 2017 to 37% now, and basketball fans fell seven points from 44% to 37%. NASCAR experienced a six point drop, 22% to 16% in its fan base.


And it kinda seems like all these individual "reasons" we're arguing about are not really as important to this discussion as the simple fact that fewer people care about sports now. Sports are just not as big of a thing as they used to be and fewer people are sports fans.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#74 » by KqWIN » Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:35 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:
KqWIN wrote:I understand why we're talking about ratings, it's how the NBA currently makes it's money...but the real discussion should be how the NBA can monetize digitally. Feels like when we're stressing about ratings we're stressing about something that might not even exist in 10-15 years.

I'm no expert in this field, but I would imagine that the next "TV Deal" is going to be with some kind of streaming service like Netflix or YouTube...maybe both. It will be the digital giants fighting over the NBA, not Networks.

Yes but that is the thing many people are saying. It's a good chance that it will be a Hulu/Netflix that will be the provider to get the TV rights for the NBA. What many are asking though is, how much will that deal be compared to what they have now. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world ain't going to drop billions of dollars for something that has its championship drawing low numbers in ratings.

Let's say the NBA is still getting around 20 million to watch every finals game, but only 5-7 mil are watching where it can be tracked. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world don't care about the 13 mil that aren't being tracked. They're going to pay for the 5-7 million that they can track and make money on. And that will be a major hit financially for the NBA.


They have the exact same problem right now. Putting the game on cable does not make the illegal streaming thing any better. I'd be willing to be that having the games on cable makes the problem worse. People watching on illegal streams don't have cable..but they probably have Netflix/Youtube/Twitch ect. Users are willing to pay for a good UX. Sure, people still pirate movies and music, but that's really not a huge issue because people have more convenient (paid) ways to get the content. Right now, the NBA has a lot of interest online...but the delivery to the online fan base is trash. I live in Utah and unless I have cable I can't even buy the ability to watch Jazz games because of blackouts. This is true for every fan in their local markets.

The benefit that cable brings is the standard viewer base. You have people that are going to watch TV no matter what, and the NBA is hoping that they choose to watch the game and become casual fans. The cable viewer base is shrinking and especially in the demographic that the NBA appeals to. The NBA cannot fix this problem, young people don't watch cable. The digital platform is growing and cable viewership is shrinking.

It's not like cable networks have deeper pockets than the tech giants. The new deal with Netflix/Hulu will be worth more than the Networks if they can provide more value on Netflix/Hulu and vice versa. There's nothing magical about being on cable that makes you more money. What makes you more money is to deliver value, and personally I think it's pretty obvious that the NBA can deliver more value on a digital platform than on cable networks in the future.

Viewership isn't 1 to 1 either. A viewer on YouTube, for example, is more valuable than a viewer on cable. The YouTube viewer will be signed into their google account and be open to all of google's platform. Instead of watching normal commercials for national companies that might not even be in you're state, you're getting a personalized ad from a company that knows everything about you. Yes, it's creepy, but that's just reality. Data is the new gold and you know these tech giants are going to want it. They are way more efficient in how they deliver ads and that alone will allow the NBA to deliver more value on a per viewer basis.

Again, I'm no expert, but this is a no brainer to me. The next deal is going to be digital...focus on that and not how to save cable. Forget about getting people to tune into ABC and start thinking about being on the YouTube homepage.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#75 » by LouisLitt » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:00 pm

Dupp wrote:
LouisLitt wrote:
Dupp wrote:What the racists got to say about this?


I don't think "racists" are watching basketball.



Why’s that?


Why would someone who hates black people watch a league filled with black people?
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#76 » by Dupp » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:10 pm

LouisLitt wrote:
Dupp wrote:
LouisLitt wrote:
I don't think "racists" are watching basketball.



Why’s that?


Why would someone who hates black people watch a league filled with black people?



Donald sterling.


Anyway very simplistic opinion. Lots of racist people watch sport.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#77 » by LouisLitt » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:12 pm

Dupp wrote:
LouisLitt wrote:
Dupp wrote:

Why’s that?


Why would someone who hates black people watch a league filled with black people?



Donald sterling.


Anyway very simplistic opinion. Lots of racist people watch sport.


He made money off them. Weird example.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#78 » by DaGawd » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:22 pm

Think ppl just realized sports ain’t that important in the midst of this pandemic
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#79 » by ItsDanger » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:29 pm

Re: NHL finals, the ratings are skewed down due to the 2 teams involved, Dallas & TB are not going to rate well at any time. You can't compare to Lakers who have a large following across the country.
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Re: Ratings down across all sports, 

Post#80 » by Duke4life831 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 7:36 pm

KqWIN wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
KqWIN wrote:I understand why we're talking about ratings, it's how the NBA currently makes it's money...but the real discussion should be how the NBA can monetize digitally. Feels like when we're stressing about ratings we're stressing about something that might not even exist in 10-15 years.

I'm no expert in this field, but I would imagine that the next "TV Deal" is going to be with some kind of streaming service like Netflix or YouTube...maybe both. It will be the digital giants fighting over the NBA, not Networks.

Yes but that is the thing many people are saying. It's a good chance that it will be a Hulu/Netflix that will be the provider to get the TV rights for the NBA. What many are asking though is, how much will that deal be compared to what they have now. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world ain't going to drop billions of dollars for something that has its championship drawing low numbers in ratings.

Let's say the NBA is still getting around 20 million to watch every finals game, but only 5-7 mil are watching where it can be tracked. The Netflix/Hulu's of the world don't care about the 13 mil that aren't being tracked. They're going to pay for the 5-7 million that they can track and make money on. And that will be a major hit financially for the NBA.


They have the exact same problem right now. Putting the game on cable does not make the illegal streaming thing any better. I'd be willing to be that having the games on cable makes the problem worse. People watching on illegal streams don't have cable..but they probably have Netflix/Youtube/Twitch ect. Users are willing to pay for a good UX. Sure, people still pirate movies and music, but that's really not a huge issue because people have more convenient (paid) ways to get the content. Right now, the NBA has a lot of interest online...but the delivery to the online fan base is trash. I live in Utah and unless I have cable I can't even buy the ability to watch Jazz games because of blackouts. This is true for every fan in their local markets.

The benefit that cable brings is the standard viewer base. You have people that are going to watch TV no matter what, and the NBA is hoping that they choose to watch the game and become casual fans. The cable viewer base is shrinking and especially in the demographic that the NBA appeals to. The NBA cannot fix this problem, young people don't watch cable. The digital platform is growing and cable viewership is shrinking.

It's not like cable networks have deeper pockets than the tech giants. The new deal with Netflix/Hulu will be worth more than the Networks if they can provide more value on Netflix/Hulu and vice versa. There's nothing magical about being on cable that makes you more money. What makes you more money is to deliver value, and personally I think it's pretty obvious that the NBA can deliver more value on a digital platform than on cable networks in the future.

Viewership isn't 1 to 1 either. A viewer on YouTube, for example, is more valuable than a viewer on cable. The YouTube viewer will be signed into their google account and be open to all of google's platform. Instead of watching normal commercials for national companies that might not even be in you're state, you're getting a personalized ad from a company that knows everything about you. Yes, it's creepy, but that's just reality. Data is the new gold and you know these tech giants are going to want it. They are way more efficient in how they deliver ads and that alone will allow the NBA to deliver more value on a per viewer basis.

Again, I'm no expert, but this is a no brainer to me. The next deal is going to be digital...focus on that and not how to save cable. Forget about getting people to tune into ABC and start thinking about being on the YouTube homepage.


Again Im not arguing that a great chance that the next TV deal the NBA ends up going to a streaming service. What Im saying is the last TV deal was made when the NBA was seeing anywhere from 16-17 million for the first few games of the finals to 24-28 million for the final close out games of the finals. And its not just total viewers, the NBA was averaging about a 10 rating for the first few games to about a 15 rating for the close out games. For those that dont know rating is basically just a percentage of US households that watched the game. Compare that to this year, the viewership was 5.9 mil to 8.9 mil. And the rating was 3.1 to 4.8. These ratings include streaming services like Hulu Live, YoutubeTV, and SlingTV.

Youre not going to see TV channels or streaming services looking to drop 2.5 billion per year for something that its biggest 5-7 games of the year, get you a 3-4 rating market share. We are talking about a 3-4x drop in market share compared to when the last TV deal was done. That is a massive hit. Also lets remember this isnt just the bubble thing, the regular season prior to the bubble the ratings were taking a big hit and we were seeing prime time games not even getting a 1.0 rating.

Also another thing to remember, you didnt need a cable provider to watch the finals, it was on broadcast television and we still saw a very low rating. So even if there was still the 20+ million watching it but the vast majority of them just illegally streamed it even though it was on free TV. Why would more pay to watch it on Hulu/Netflix?

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