Rookie of The Year Thread

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Who are your top 3?

Anthony
19
3%
Ball
218
35%
Bey
26
4%
Edwards
98
16%
Haliburton
153
25%
Okoro
5
1%
Quickley
64
10%
Tate
3
0%
Williams
11
2%
Wiseman
27
4%
 
Total votes: 624

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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1441 » by Quentin » Sat Mar 20, 2021 2:11 pm

theGreatRC wrote:Inconsistent rookie is inconsistent.

11/10/6/7 turnovers on 4-18 shooting.

PHX packed the paint on him after going off for 42 the night before.

Let's see how he bounces back against OKC


I'd argue that the referee's packed the paint. No a single trip to the free throw line despite driving the hoop a bunch. The refs were probably the worst I've seen this season.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1442 » by HotelVitale » Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:40 pm

Domejandro wrote:
Pattycakes wrote:Not mad at all about Edwards or Ball, I was actually higher on Toppin than anyone. Happy I’m not a college2nba scout lol

I thought that Obi Toppin was a problematic prospect, but the guy I am bummed about is Aaron Nesmith. I don't know if he just didn't recover well from his injury well, or if he just isn't developing well, but I thought he would be better than he is, this year.

I never understood the Nesmith argument. He seemed to have a relatively slow, low shot for a sniper (or at least not a feathery quick trigger) and his crazy sophomore shooting numbers were based on a streak of literally like 8 games against weak comp. Take those out and iirc he was like a 34% career college shooter. Didn’t seem like a killer coming off screens or a great volume off the dribble guy (like Hield e.g.), nor did he seem like a defender or driver worth talking about. A reasonably reliable shooter who’s not a specialist in anything else and doesn’t have particularly good size or athleticism isn’t a great prospect. I always assumed he was destroying in his workouts and looking like an elite shooter.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1443 » by playa-hater » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:15 am

HotelVitale wrote:
Domejandro wrote:
Pattycakes wrote:Not mad at all about Edwards or Ball, I was actually higher on Toppin than anyone. Happy I’m not a college2nba scout lol

I thought that Obi Toppin was a problematic prospect, but the guy I am bummed about is Aaron Nesmith. I don't know if he just didn't recover well from his injury well, or if he just isn't developing well, but I thought he would be better than he is, this year.

I never understood the Nesmith argument. He seemed to have a relatively slow, low shot for a sniper (or at least not a feathery quick trigger) and his crazy sophomore shooting numbers were based on a streak of literally like 8 games against weak comp. Take those out and iirc he was like a 34% career college shooter. Didn’t seem like a killer coming off screens or a great volume off the dribble guy (like Hield e.g.), nor did he seem like a defender or driver worth talking about. A reasonably reliable shooter who’s not a specialist in anything else and doesn’t have particularly good size or athleticism isn’t a great prospect. I always assumed he was destroying in his workouts and looking like an elite shooter.


Boston fan here and still a Big believer in Nesmith. His not playing has so much more to do with Stevens than lack of ability. I have seen nothing in his game, when he plays, to make me believe he won't be as good as advertised.

Having said that, S Bey is who I really wanted, so damn either way.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1444 » by playa-hater » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:21 am

If anyone would like to do a re-draft, I'd like to see it.

2020 NBA Draft

First Round
1. Timberwolves

2. Warriors

3. Hornets
4. Bulls
5. Cavaliers

6. Hawks

7. Pistons

8. Knicks

9. Wizards

10. Suns
11. Spurs
12. Kings

13. Pelicans

14 Boston

15 Orlando

16. Trail Blazers

17. Timberwolves

18. Mavericks

19. Nets

20. Heat
21. 76ers

22. Nuggets

23. Knicks
24. Bucks

25. Thunder
26. Celtics

27. Jazz
28. Lakers

29. Raptors
30. Celtics
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1445 » by PhilBlackson » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:47 am

While LaMelo still probably has the lead, I'm not counting out Edwards.

I know some may flame from what I'm about to write but I think within 2-3 years he'll be better than Mitchell. He's even bigger and stronger and every bit as athletic, if not more. The kid will eventually have the kind (not exact) of physical strength advantage at his position that Bron has over his. The kid is gonna be a bully at SG.

I don't see any reason why he won't continue to get pile on the buckets as he continues to get comfortable and gain experience. If he continues at 20+ppg clip (which is very much possible) I don't think can call it a lock for LaMelo just yet. I could very easily see him battling for a co-roty.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1446 » by peZt » Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:05 am

playa-hater wrote:If anyone would like to do a re-draft, I'd like to see it.

2020 NBA Draft

First Round
1. Timberwolves: LaMelo Ball
2. Warriors: Anthony Edwards
3. Hornets: Patrick Williams
4. Bulls: Tyrese Haliburton
5. Cavaliers: James Wiseman
6. Hawks: Deni Avdija
7. Pistons: Immanuel Quickley

After that it gets a bit murky

8. Knicks: Saddiq Bey
9. Wizards: Isaac Okoro
10. Suns: Pokusevski
11. Spurs: Tyrese Maxey
12. Kings: Obi Toppin
13. Pelicans: Devin Vassell
14 Boston: Jaden McDaniels

For me it would be like this. Could switch Edwards and Ball really, have seen enough of Edwards to be confident in his superstar potential
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1447 » by HotelVitale » Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:00 pm

playa-hater wrote:
HotelVitale wrote:
Domejandro wrote:I thought that Obi Toppin was a problematic prospect, but the guy I am bummed about is Aaron Nesmith. I don't know if he just didn't recover well from his injury well, or if he just isn't developing well, but I thought he would be better than he is, this year.

I never understood the Nesmith argument. He seemed to have a relatively slow, low shot for a sniper (or at least not a feathery quick trigger) and his crazy sophomore shooting numbers were based on a streak of literally like 8 games against weak comp. Take those out and iirc he was like a 34% career college shooter. Didn’t seem like a killer coming off screens or a great volume off the dribble guy (like Hield e.g.), nor did he seem like a defender or driver worth talking about. A reasonably reliable shooter who’s not a specialist in anything else and doesn’t have particularly good size or athleticism isn’t a great prospect. I always assumed he was destroying in his workouts and looking like an elite shooter.
Boston fan here and still a Big believer in Nesmith. His not playing has so much more to do with Stevens than lack of ability. I have seen nothing in his game, when he plays, to make me believe he won't be as good as advertised. Having said that, S Bey is who I really wanted, so damn either way.

Why do you believe in him though? Like I mentioned before, the only reason people seemed to love him was his crazy 3pt% his soph year--but that was in only 14 games before an injury cut him down, and his whole freshman year he was a meh shooter (39% and 34% from 3) in a significantly bigger sample. And even in that 14-game soph season he had 7 good-shooting games and 7 below average ones (and almost all of the good ones were against teams like SE Missouri St). His shot looks clean and sound, but there's a big gap between just that and being a killer NBA sniper. And he has to be that to be any good, he doesn't have any other promising skills.

There's a lot we don't see, though, so I'm assuming his shot was really good in workouts etc. And I'm definitely not saying he'll be a bust or anything--who can know that? esp for a shooter. Just saying that among all the potential lotto picks this year he was the one guy I worried might be most overrated.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1448 » by playa-hater » Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:12 pm

HotelVitale wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
HotelVitale wrote:I never understood the Nesmith argument. He seemed to have a relatively slow, low shot for a sniper (or at least not a feathery quick trigger) and his crazy sophomore shooting numbers were based on a streak of literally like 8 games against weak comp. Take those out and iirc he was like a 34% career college shooter. Didn’t seem like a killer coming off screens or a great volume off the dribble guy (like Hield e.g.), nor did he seem like a defender or driver worth talking about. A reasonably reliable shooter who’s not a specialist in anything else and doesn’t have particularly good size or athleticism isn’t a great prospect. I always assumed he was destroying in his workouts and looking like an elite shooter.
Boston fan here and still a Big believer in Nesmith. His not playing has so much more to do with Stevens than lack of ability. I have seen nothing in his game, when he plays, to make me believe he won't be as good as advertised. Having said that, S Bey is who I really wanted, so damn either way.

Why do you believe in him though? Like I mentioned before, the only reason people seemed to love him was his crazy 3pt% his soph year--but that was in only 14 games before an injury cut him down, and his whole freshman year he was a meh shooter (39% and 34% from 3) in a much bigger sample. And even in that 14-game soph season he had 7 good-shooting games and 7 below average ones (and almost all of the good ones were against teams like SE Missouri St). His shot looks clean and sound, but there's a big gap between just that and being a killer NBA sniper. And he has to be that to be any good, he doesn't have any other promising skills.

There's a lot we don't see, though, so I'm assuming his shot was really good in workouts etc. And I'm definitely not saying he'll be a bust or anything--who can know that? esp for a shooter. Just saying that among all the potential lotto picks this year he was the one guy I worried might be most overrated.


I agree his sample size was small. But I was a shooter and a shooting coach, I do like his mechanics, footwork, physical tools length etc.. I just believe that Stevens is slow to play rookies over vets at times and all shooters need a certain amount of actual game reps before than can grow. not comparing games, but even Kris Middleton bounced around the league before he got his Real chance, now he is a multiple Allstar. Throw in T Rozier as well. much better players over time than their rookie years.

Again there is nothing I have seen to take away any confidence I have in him. If anything Nesmith was deemed to be a 3 -D player and has surprised at times with his ability to put the ball on the floor and play make a it.

I will be more worried if this time next year he didn't come along.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1449 » by HotelVitale » Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:40 pm

playa-hater wrote:
HotelVitale wrote:
playa-hater wrote: Boston fan here and still a Big believer in Nesmith. His not playing has so much more to do with Stevens than lack of ability. I have seen nothing in his game, when he plays, to make me believe he won't be as good as advertised. Having said that, S Bey is who I really wanted, so damn either way.

Why do you believe in him though? Like I mentioned before, the only reason people seemed to love him was his crazy 3pt% his soph year--but that was in only 14 games before an injury cut him down, and his whole freshman year he was a meh shooter (39% and 34% from 3) in a much bigger sample. And even in that 14-game soph season he had 7 good-shooting games and 7 below average ones (and almost all of the good ones were against teams like SE Missouri St). His shot looks clean and sound, but there's a big gap between just that and being a killer NBA sniper. And he has to be that to be any good, he doesn't have any other promising skills. There's a lot we don't see, though, so I'm assuming his shot was really good in workouts etc. And I'm definitely not saying he'll be a bust or anything--who can know that? esp for a shooter. Just saying that among all the potential lotto picks this year he was the one guy I worried might be most overrated.
I agree his sample size was small. But I was a shooter and a shooting coach, I do like his mechanics, footwork, physical tools length etc.. I just believe that Stevens is slow to play rookies over vets at times and all shooters need a certain amount of actual game reps before than can grow. not comparing games, but even Kris Middleton bounced around the league before he got his Real chance, now he is a multiple Allstar. Throw in T Rozier as well. much better players over time than their rookie years. Again there is nothing I have seen to take away any confidence I have in him. If anything Nesmith was deemed to be a 3 -D player and has surprised at times with his ability to put the ball on the floor and play make a it. I will be more worried if this time next year he didn't come along.
Middleton is one guy who had an extraordinary development, though, there have been at least 50 college shooters since he was drafted who flopped out. A shooting specialist can't just hit open shots to cut it, has to be able to shoot quickly, off the dribble, off screens, etc just to be a lower end rotation player. Tough way to make a living. Nesmith also wasn't a particularly strong defensive prospective, long enough but doesn't move feet well or stifle guys or anything; his defense was sort of like a possible bonus ('he might be really solid there!') than a calling card, so it seems likely he'll need to be more than just a decent shooter who stays on the court because of his D.

Anyway don't want to keep you going back and forth, just re-hashing old stuff from the draft boards. I don't love Nesmith as a lotto prospect but it's not like he sucks or isn't a real NBA prospect, and everything beyond that is just unknowns (like how good a shooter he actually is for this level--pretty good or awesome?--and how well he'll learn to shoot quickly, off the bounce, etc int he next 2-4 years).
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1450 » by playa-hater » Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:52 pm

HotelVitale wrote:
playa-hater wrote:
HotelVitale wrote:Why do you believe in him though? Like I mentioned before, the only reason people seemed to love him was his crazy 3pt% his soph year--but that was in only 14 games before an injury cut him down, and his whole freshman year he was a meh shooter (39% and 34% from 3) in a much bigger sample. And even in that 14-game soph season he had 7 good-shooting games and 7 below average ones (and almost all of the good ones were against teams like SE Missouri St). His shot looks clean and sound, but there's a big gap between just that and being a killer NBA sniper. And he has to be that to be any good, he doesn't have any other promising skills. There's a lot we don't see, though, so I'm assuming his shot was really good in workouts etc. And I'm definitely not saying he'll be a bust or anything--who can know that? esp for a shooter. Just saying that among all the potential lotto picks this year he was the one guy I worried might be most overrated.
I agree his sample size was small. But I was a shooter and a shooting coach, I do like his mechanics, footwork, physical tools length etc.. I just believe that Stevens is slow to play rookies over vets at times and all shooters need a certain amount of actual game reps before than can grow. not comparing games, but even Kris Middleton bounced around the league before he got his Real chance, now he is a multiple Allstar. Throw in T Rozier as well. much better players over time than their rookie years. Again there is nothing I have seen to take away any confidence I have in him. If anything Nesmith was deemed to be a 3 -D player and has surprised at times with his ability to put the ball on the floor and play make a it. I will be more worried if this time next year he didn't come along.
Middleton is one guy who had an extraordinary development, though, there have been at least 50 college shooters since he was drafted who flopped out. A shooting specialist can't just hit open shots to cut it, has to be able to shoot quickly, off the dribble, off screens, etc just to be a lower end rotation player. Tough way to make a living. Nesmith also wasn't a particularly strong defensive prospective, long enough but doesn't move feet well or stifle guys or anything; his defense was sort of like a possible bonus ('he might be really solid there!') than a calling card, so it seems likely he'll need to be more than just a decent shooter who stays on the court because of his D.

Anyway don't want to keep you going back and forth, just re-hashing old stuff from the draft boards. I don't love Nesmith as a lotto prospect but it's not like he sucks or isn't a real NBA prospect, and everything beyond that is just unknowns (like how good a shooter he actually is for this level--pretty good or awesome?--and how well he'll learn to shoot quickly, off the bounce, etc int he next 2-4 years).


Fair enough, in time we can look back at this
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1451 » by Slim Tubby » Mon Mar 22, 2021 2:26 am

Tough luck for LaMelo with the injury but his 16-6-6 stat line for the season shows a glimpse of what he will be. I was skeptical before the Draft but he’s clearly proven me wrong.


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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1452 » by Ballerhogger » Mon Mar 22, 2021 2:30 am

PhilBlackson wrote:While LaMelo still probably has the lead, I'm not counting out Edwards.

I know some may flame from what I'm about to write but I think within 2-3 years he'll be better than Mitchell. He's even bigger and stronger and every bit as athletic, if not more. The kid will eventually have the kind (not exact) of physical strength advantage at his position that Bron has over his. The kid is gonna be a bully at SG.

I don't see any reason why he won't continue to get pile on the buckets as he continues to get comfortable and gain experience. If he continues at 20+ppg clip (which is very much possible) I don't think can call it a lock for LaMelo just yet. I could very easily see him battling for a co-roty.

Yea Ant sitll has shot , I agree he’s going be next star he has it . You can tell
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1453 » by bstein14 » Mon Mar 22, 2021 2:39 am

This award seems wide open now. Haliburton and Edwards may be in the lead now but several other guys have a chance to pick up some ground and perhaps take the lead with nearly half a season still remaining.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1454 » by asero » Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:40 am

48 games to qualify right? Lamelo only has 41 so far.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1455 » by Mike lorenzo » Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:12 pm

peZt wrote:
playa-hater wrote:If anyone would like to do a re-draft, I'd like to see it.

2020 NBA Draft

First Round
1. Timberwolves: LaMelo Ball
2. Warriors: Anthony Edwards
3. Hornets: Patrick Williams
4. Bulls: Tyrese Haliburton
5. Cavaliers: James Wiseman
6. Hawks: Deni Avdija
7. Pistons: Immanuel Quickley

After that it gets a bit murky

8. Knicks: Saddiq Bey
9. Wizards: Isaac Okoro
10. Suns: Pokusevski
11. Spurs: Tyrese Maxey
12. Kings: Obi Toppin
13. Pelicans: Devin Vassell
14 Boston: Jaden McDaniels

For me it would be like this. Could switch Edwards and Ball really, have seen enough of Edwards to be confident in his superstar potential

I think Bane ... deserves a place ...
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1456 » by bwgood77 » Tue Mar 23, 2021 12:56 am

Dan Z wrote:Where did Anthony Edwards say that basketball isn't his favorite sport? It's football...correct? I haven't read the direct quote, but I get the feeling that it's blown out of proportion. Just because he prefers football doesn't mean he's a slacker or won't do good in the NBA.


Yeah, Antonio Gates played college basketball (and obviously probably could have played college football) but couldn't make it to the NBA and became one of the best TEs ever. I don't think preferring one sport deters you from being good at another.

Russell Wilson with baseball too.

Then who knows about guys like Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders.

There was also Charlie Ward (who I think won a heisman) played in the NBA for awhile. He didn't have enough talent to stick around, but I doubt it was for a lack of effort.

I think with Edwards too, it's more of growing up an NFL fan and he watches it more...though I'm sure he watches a lot of NBA tape now.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1457 » by Big J » Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:04 am

Hali making moves.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1458 » by Mephariel » Tue Mar 23, 2021 4:11 am

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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1459 » by penggemar » Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:05 am

Theo Maledon has been the starting point guard for Thunder for few last games, and doing not too badly.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1460 » by tmorgan » Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:34 am

Not a ROY candidate, but keep an eye on the much-maligned 16th pick, Isaiah Stewart. Getting a consistent 20 mpg now and has apparently gotten the green light from Casey to shoot open threes. And he’s making them. Pretty solid defense and boards for a rook playing 20 minutes a game, too. Looking like a future starter.

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